Sankey sends letter to NCAA on behalf of UT

[butchna]

I think you are also glossing over what we have already implemented. What I see VolinNW saying is that for whatever Donde prematurely said we did last November, we have:

1) Fired/removed the AD
2) Fired/removed the HC
3) Fired/removed all the assistant coaches
4) Fired/removed the entire recruiting administrative staff

You throw in a few scholarship reduction because we are already there with the portal transfers and tell the NCAA that is our self-imposed punishment. If they do not accept this, that is when VolinNW is advocating sue the NCAA.

What is the basis of the lawsuit? What if they want to add a postseason ban? Buck them on that and start paying the lawyers millions?

 

[butchna]

The NCAA has been gutted. Enforcement will be up to conferences now, or the schools themselves. I simply see no need to harm the program any more than it has been harmed already.



Admittedly I need to read the full Alston decision, but at this point I think the challenge would be based on similar Sherman grounds, that in light of the self imposed penalties and changes made by UT, the NCAA would be violating the Rule of Reason test in demanding additional penalties, especially in light of Alston where compensation to athletes was in play. There are clear differences from Alston, and the direct coach-player transfers (thanks, Slingblade, for THAT) is clearly an issue in the NCAA's favor, but I just don't think the NCAA wants another Circuit and potentially SCOTUS case examining its Sherman status.

Great discussion, everyone!

And neither do we. Would like another self described lawyer to weigh in on this. Seems shaky.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

The NCAA has been gutted. Enforcement will be up to conferences now, or the schools themselves. I simply see no need to harm the program any more than it has been harmed already.



Admittedly I need to read the full Alston decision, but at this point I think the challenge would be based on similar Sherman grounds, that in light of the self imposed penalties and changes made by UT, the NCAA would be violating the Rule of Reason test in demanding additional penalties, especially in light of Alston where compensation to athletes was in play. There are clear differences from Alston, and the direct coach-player transfers (thanks, Slingblade, for THAT) is clearly an issue in the NCAA's favor, but I just don't think the NCAA wants another Circuit and potentially SCOTUS case examining its Sherman status.

Great discussion, everyone!

I'm not an attorney but I'm fairly certain Alston was strictly concerning educational payments, not compensation for athletics.

The problem is that destroying the NCAA leaves nothing in its place to keep the playing field even marginally level nationwide. If the SEC decides directly paying players is not okay but the B1G or a well heeled Independent like Notre Dame decides it's fine...... who will arbitrate? If ACC schools start contacting SEC players to attempt to get them to transfer...... who can stop them?

The problem with anarchy and lawlessness is that when the chaos starts it's hard to stop.

Assuming the "good and fair spirit of athletics" to prevail is..... c'mon, I've seen 15 minute, bloody brawls at pee wee football games.

 

[CobbVol]

What is the basis of the lawsuit? What if they want to add a postseason ban? Buck them on that and start paying the lawyers millions?

Then you accept it. The point would be to self-impose as little as required and let the NCAA advise if further action is needed given all that have been implemented so far. The NCAA accepted Ole Miss's 9 scholarship reduction they self-imposed so there is some validity to them gravitating to the schools recommendations.

 

[orange_glory]

Will this fair have corn dogs, cotton candy, and sno cones?
I'm not going to mention corn hole.

Will this fair have a Beldar shooting range or Beldar water boarding uhh I mean water dunking station?

 

[butchna]

Then you accept it. The point would be to self-impose as little as required and let the NCAA advise if further action is needed given all that have been implemented so far. The NCAA accepted Ole Miss's 9 scholarship reduction they self-imposed so there is some validity to them gravitating to the schools recommendations.

I don’t know if that isn’t on the table. Sounds different presented without throwing in a “take it or lawsuit” backdrop.

 

[TNnative]

UT was not mentioned by name but he sent a letter to the NCAA saying those accused of violations should have a Fair, and heard in a Timely Manner. He mentioned it needs to be fair and quicker for the student athletes affected.

Perhaps, he was speaking of Georgia?

Georgia responds to allegations of potential NCAA investigation into football program

 

[secking]

Perhaps, he was speaking of Georgia?

Georgia responds to allegations of potential NCAA investigation into football program

UGA even in that “fan” site said it was fake news. I do wonder tho if NCAA/SEC completely separate, Is there no longer a case? Sounds like this might be happening and SEC isn’t going to punish an institution under old violations bc they didn’t break ‘SEC rules’. I can see a way where waters are muddied and UT benefits from it.

 

[VolInNW]

I have it on good authority from uga fans on this site that uga attracts recruits solely because of the rainbows, unicorns, and pure awesomeness of all things uga.

Yes......that's pretty much their attitude.

 

[LSU-SIU]

The problem is that destroying the NCAA leaves nothing in its place to keep the playing field even marginally level nationwide. If the SEC decides directly paying players is not okay but the B1G or a well heeled Independent like Notre Dame decides it's fine...... who will arbitrate? If ACC schools start contacting SEC players to attempt to get them to transfer...... who can stop them?
.

There simply isn't a business model that's going to work. The conferences can setup their own rules on compensation but they have to deal with all the state laws. I would say at this point Congress is probably not going to get involved, and even if they did... hard to see how they can help.

Your point about players transferring is also an interesting one. Which brings up another problem individual State antitrust laws, I would say some of these conferences could be in violation of State antitrust law depending on how much of the local market the control. (topic for another day)

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

There simply isn't a business model that's going to work. The conferences can setup their own rules on compensation but they have to deal with all the state laws. I would say at this point Congress is probably not going to get involved, and even if they did... hard to see how they can help.

Your point about players transferring is also an interesting one. Which brings up another problem individual State antitrust laws, I would say some of these conferences could be in violation of State antitrust law depending on how much of the local market the control. (topic for another day)

I disagree that there's not a working business model. It just needs to be developed and there's a mint for those who do it.

Bezos was told that an online marketplace selling to every state and city would be too chaotic to manage because of varying regulations. Maybe it is/was messy, screwed cities/states out of revenue, destroyed small businesses, and has large downsides for society...... but here we are and that bald guy is the richest human on the planet.

Someone who understands what the NCAA did right and wrong, how to shape the business so reasonable compensation is there for athletes, schools, and the media, and can keep things mostly out of the court system....... will get rich.

Americans are good at this sort of thing, ya know?

 

[LSU-SIU]

Americans are good at this sort of thing, ya know?

You're throwing around a bunch of buzzwords but that doesn't put a business model together. Saying things like the above doesn't mean anything.

There simply isn't any easy road. And here I was thinking all of this was about amateur college sports.

In the meantime, all these schools need to start preparing for the lawsuits. Many already going, tons more about to get started.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

You're throwing around a bunch of buzzwords but that doesn't put a business model together. Saying things like the above doesn't mean anything.

There simply isn't any easy road. And here I was thinking all of this was about amateur college sports.

In the meantime, all these schools need to start preparing for the lawsuits. Many already going, tons more about to get started.

None of this is about amateur college sports anymore. None of it.

Creating a new business isn't easy and I never implied it was. The next generation of college sports isn't going to be an easy business to develop but it IS going to be a business first, not a psuedo-amateur athletic organization like the NCAA.

Get that from the start: amateur college football is over for elite players. They're going to be paid and that payment is going to need a business controlling it, regulating it, etc like the NFL handles pro teams. Can we agree there?

There's a need for standards and regulation of "professional college athletics" and a business will be developed to do that. No buzzwords. There's a niche for money to be made regulating this new era of pro, but not NFL (yet, anyway,) athletics.

 

[LSU-SIU]

Get that from the start: amateur college football is over for elite players. They're going to be paid and that payment is going to need a business controlling it, regulating it, etc like the NFL handles pro teams. Can we agree there?

There's a need for standards and regulation of "professional college athletics" and a business will be developed to do that. No buzzwords. There's a niche for money to be made regulating this new era of pro, but not NFL (yet, anyway,) athletics.

There is no easy way to do that in the current structure i.e. scam setup. A new model can be built but there are strong head winds there as well. Breakup is the most logical path but even with that its not a one size fits all solution. The issue is, the old business model was based on salary caps.... how exactly do you do that? There just isn't an easy path forward, they'll pretend for a bit.

The NFL business model exists as a function of the exemptions they have to antitrust. Its hard to imagine how Congress can help schools in this regard.

Although the conferences have more ability to install rules on compensation, the States have now gotten involved.... so things are more complicated than if the conferences would have acted years ago.

None of this is about amateur college sports anymore. None of it.

Oh it never was. I'm just laughing at all the hypocrisy.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

There is no easy way to do that in the current structure i.e. scam setup. A new model can be built but there are strong head winds there as well. Breakup is the most logical path but even with that its not a one size fits all solution. The issue is, the old business model was based on salary caps.... how exactly do you do that? There just isn't an easy path forward, they'll pretend for a bit.

The NFL business model exists as a function of the exemptions they have to antitrust. Its hard to imagine how Congress can help schools in this regard.

Oh it never was. I'm just laughing at all the hypocrisy.

You're just focusing on the negatives of the NCAA, I'm talking about a business niche. I get it....you hate the NCAA but let's talk about the future.

There's a lot of interest in watching these young athletes play, just like the NFL, and there's a lot of money being shuffled around to make that work on TV and streams, just like the NFL, and there's money to be made by those players, those teams, those who own facilities, those cities which have teams in them, etc, etc...... again, just like the NFL.

The NFL exists to keep the field level. It's a business and pretty successful.

I don't care if they call it "the artist previously known as the NCAA" or N (College) FL or Disneyleague Football....... the group of athletes and their teams need a nationally recognized business to regulate and organize the teams.

Easy? Hell no. Needed. Hell yes. Will it last? I doubt it. Most pro leagues fold or get eaten by bigger pro leagues. I assume eventually the NFL and NBA will have a very close relationship with what we currently call "college athletics."