Reuters: Russia Prepping Troops For Libyan Deployment

#26
#26
LouderVol said:
this is actually the first time you have made reference to them being the "real" government. and as one of your articles pointed out Hifter/Haftar (assuming they are the same person) doesn't see eye to eye with the government you are referencing. haftar is only really interested in the assets (the oil fields he lost and now needs russian help to reclaim) not the people.

and democratic elections with only 18% of people voting? Thats worse than Assad. 630,000 people to represent the whole country?
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/middleeast/2014/06/libyans-mourn-rights-activist-amid-turmoil-2014626161436740827.html

I haven't seen anything official on that investigation but there are a lot of ties back to her murder with those in charge including your "real" government.
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They are representing the last elected officials in Libya before the American lead coup. How is there any doubt with you or anyone else that these officials are not the rightful representatives of the people?
 
#27
#27
Rasputin_Vol said:
They are representing the last elected officials in Libya before the American lead coup. How is there any doubt with you or anyone else that these officials are not the rightful representatives of 18% of the people?
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fyp.

because if the election was only held in California and Texas I would hardly call that a fair open election, and I would understand the other 48 states rebelling and I wouldn't consider those elected as the government.
 
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#28
#28
Libyan military commander Haftar visiting Russia: RIA

Haftar's self-styled Libyan National Army controls much of eastern and southern Libya.

It has rejected a U.N.-backed government in Tripoli that is struggling to assert authority over an array of armed factions which have been competing for control since the 2011 fall of Muammar Gaddafi.

Haftar has held talks with Russian officials before and in January he was given a tour of a Russian aircraft carrier in the Mediterranean.

The head of the U.N.-backed government visited Moscow in March, and the Kremlin said then it wanted to help repair the damage it said had been done by Western involvement in the country.
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The U.N. backed government is the US supported/recognized govt. That is the "Western involvement" that has made Libya a failed state.
 
#31
#31
Grand Vol said:
My, my, my, didn't we wake up and have your cup of hate and bowl of anti-western thought this morning?
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Whenever you see me telling a lie, just let me know. But for right now, the truth seems to be indicating that countries around the world are growing tired of US intervention and are looking towards Russia for assistance.
 
#32
#32
hog88 said:
Yeah sure, I'm convinced that they have no other motives.

Russia is capitalizing on the previous 8 years of our foreign policy for dollars.
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Nothing new tRump's idol is constantly stabbing the U.S. in the back.The majority of our western allies say they trust vlad the communist impaler more then tRump to do the right thing if a crisis occurs. Blaming the previous admin is so easy when your own foreign policy is all over the map and going all to hell. You can really blame the previous admin fore the good economy the country is experiencing now, it's none of tRump's doing, but his 33% base won't admit that. To beat it all tRump and his family are awash in communist russian mafia $$$. :shakehead:
 
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#33
#33
Rasputin_Vol said:
Whenever you see me telling a lie, just let me know. But for right now, the truth seems to be indicating that countries around the world are growing tired of US intervention and are looking towards Russia for assistance.
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And tRump just keeps running his bratty little mouth. Google The 25TH Amendment. :question:
 
#34
#34
orangeluvr said:
And tRump just keeps running his bratty little mouth. Google The 25TH Amendment. :question:
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I have disdain for both parties. This country's fall from grace on the international stage has very little to do with Trump or Obama. Our political leaders on both sides have damaged our credibility and ruined our goodwill since the end of WWII.

Until reasonable people on the left and right are able to step back and look at how we are all being used in this system, then their tactic of divide and conquer will work to their advantage.
 
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#35
#35
Rasputin_Vol said:
Whenever you see me telling a lie, just let me know. But for right now, the truth seems to be indicating that countries around the world are growing tired of US intervention and are looking towards Russia for assistance.
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the truth as in Assad and these rebels. Who, funny enough, were both losing when Russia was asked to step in. Desperate times and all that. and for every war lord getting help from Russia (and yes we are helping plenty ourselves unfortunately) I can point out a nation still wanting our aide. Ukraine and the Baltic states, The Philippines, japan, s. korea etc. heck even Vietnam has reached out to us. even the EU states while hating Trump are still asking for wargames and whatnot from us.
 
#36
#36
Rasputin_Vol said:
I have disdain for both parties. This country's fall from grace on the international stage has very little to do with Trump or Obama. Our political leaders on both sides have damaged our credibility and ruined our goodwill since the end of WWII.

Until reasonable people on the left and right are able to step back and look at how we are all being used in this system, then their tactic of divide and conquer will work to their advantage.
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:rock:
 
#37
#37
Rasputin_Vol said:
I have disdain for both parties. This country's fall from grace on the international stage has very little to do with Trump or Obama. Our political leaders on both sides have damaged our credibility and ruined our goodwill since the end of WWII.

Until reasonable people on the left and right are able to step back and look at how we are all being used in this system, then their tactic of divide and conquer will work to their advantage.
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It's so sad we live in such a polarized society, a house so miserably divided can not stand. We need to vote out all of the career politicians and start with a clean slate.
 
#38
#38
orangeluvr said:
It's so sad we live in such a polarized society, a house so miserably divided can not stand. We need to vote out all of the career politicians and start with a clean slate.
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its also a problem of the people. Its easier to label and hate than challenge your beliefs (or even have beliefs) and actually debate and change things.
 
#39
#39
LouderVol said:
despite not being invited by that same group? and again what is the difference here? the people of Syria clearly dont like Assad.

and its funny that Russia gets involved once the rebels lose the most valuable oil field in the area.....
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So, are you telling me that America is trying to install a puppet regime and Russia is backing a regime supported by the people?
 
#40
#40
ClearwaterVol said:
So, are you telling me that America is trying to install a puppet regime and Russia is backing a regime supported by the people?
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Just to be clear, I am suggesting that very thing. I have no idea what larger point LouderVol is trying to make outside of just being against anything I post.
 
#41
#41
Rasputin_Vol said:
Whenever you see me telling a lie, just let me know. But for right now, the truth seems to be indicating that countries around the world are growing tired of US intervention and are looking towards Russia for assistance.
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See, this isn't a lie, it's an opinion not based on anything factual.
 
#43
#43
Grand Vol said:
See, this isn't a lie, it's an opinion not based on anything factual.
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The facts are out there. Libya, Syria, and a host of other countries (even Turkey and Qatar) are making economic and military deals with the Russians. Meanwhile, the US can't even get the EU to agree on putting more sanctions on Russia this latest go around.
 
#44
#44
Rasputin_Vol said:
Just to be clear, I am suggesting that very thing. I have no idea what larger point LouderVol is trying to make outside of just being against anything I post.
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Now I see why our meddling always turns out badly. I have not been following the Libya storyline.
 
#45
#45
Rasputin_Vol said:
The facts are out there. Libya, Syria, and a host of other countries (even Turkey and Qatar) are making economic and military deals with the Russians. Meanwhile, the US can't even get the EU to agree on putting more sanctions on Russia this latest go around.
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That's cause trump is alienating most of our allies and trading partners.
 
#47
#47
ClearwaterVol said:
So, are you telling me that America is trying to install a puppet regime and Russia is backing a regime supported by the people?
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I have no clue what America's plan is, I doubt very many people do, if we have one at all beyond chaos in the area.

My point is that we have justifiably complained about America's involvement. but when Russia turns around and does the SAME exact thing Ras wants us to applaud it. I don't see why we should call an American spade a spade, while we are supposed to dress up Russian spades.

I don't want us involved, I don't want Russia involved, I don't think either will better anything. I am consistent within my own argument. at least until someone points out otherwise.

Ras doesn't want the US involved, but he does want Russia involved. Ras thinks Russian involvement will be better than US involvement. He is inconsistent. And I have pointed out ulterior motives for Russia, and how the standard he is applying is not consistent or valid. He keeps going on about "democratically elected" when a fraction of the voting population voted, 20% does not make a government of the people. and 20% was the people voting in general, not even the ones voting FOR the guys in charge Ras is backing.

Ras has been consistent in ignoring specifics of the situations and boiling the situation down to US = bad, Russia = good. and I call him on it.
 
#48
#48
orangeluvr said:
That's cause trump is alienating most of our allies and trading partners.
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Trump and his administration have very little, if anything, to do with the Libya situation right now. If anything, Obama's State Department and Hillary have blood on their hands for initiating the coup in Libya and making it a failed state right now. The Obama State Department will go down in history as one of America's most corrupt with the Arab Springs and Ukraine activities.
 
#49
#49
LouderVol said:
I have no clue what America's plan is, I doubt very many people do, if we have one at all beyond chaos in the area.

My point is that we have justifiably complained about America's involvement. but when Russia turns around and does the SAME exact thing Ras wants us to applaud it. I don't see why we should call an American spade a spade, while we are supposed to dress up Russian spades.

I don't want us involved, I don't want Russia involved, I don't think either will better anything. I am consistent within my own argument. at least until someone points out otherwise.

Ras doesn't want the US involved, but he does want Russia involved. Ras thinks Russian involvement will be better than US involvement. He is inconsistent. And I have pointed out ulterior motives for Russia, and how the standard he is applying is not consistent or valid. He keeps going on about "democratically elected" when a fraction of the voting population voted, 20% does not make a government of the people. and 20% was the people voting in general, not even the ones voting FOR the guys in charge Ras is backing.

Ras has been consistent in ignoring specifics of the situations and boiling the situation down to US = bad, Russia = good. and I call him on it.
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All I have simply said is that Russia was invited to help Syria and Libya, and the US was not.

To me, that is a pretty simple distinction and pretty easy to prove.
 
#50
#50
orangeluvr said:
It's so sad we live in such a polarized society, a house so miserably divided can not stand. We need to vote out all of the career politicians and start with a clean slate.
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You can't expect people to take you seriously when you say stuff like that first sentence and then turn right around and sound like a mouthpiece for CNN.
 
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