Paul Finebaum

#28

05_never_again

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#28
You can take out vacated wins and argue about the strength of the SEC, but the results on the field the three years prior to Saban certainly look better than the three years prior to Butch at UT. I never said Alabama was good, just that the team Saban took over was "likely" better than the one Butch took over.
With the exception of that 10-win season (which I think can be fairly written off as a fluke), and adjusting for the strength of the SEC at the time, I think the results are fairly comparable.

Tennessee had a coach abruptly leave in the middle of a rebuild, but Alabama had to fire a coach in May before he even coached a game (Mike Price). Both pretty comparable, pretty awful situations, but with Alabama's being even more embarrassing. Shula at least, I suppose, provided better stability to the program than Dooley did given that he did manage to win double-digit games one year.
 
#31

jakez4ut

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#31
I'd add that Butch is handicapped by fans who don't really expect much, thereby letting him skate without feeling any real pressure to move the program up the pecking order. Saban doesn't have that luxury.
interesting way of putting it. w/out the hyperbole, there's some truth to that. i'd add though, that most of our issues regarding this particular topic revolve around a select group of well off donors that assume decision making powers. i think it's safe to say regardless of what anyone things about us as a fan base, the leadership carousel at UTK has not been on par with the FL's and Bama's of the world, and that is the biggest difference amongst the three.

but are you really saying that we as a fan base should strive to be like bammers????

slippery slope my friend....:eek:lol:
 
#33

fade route

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#33
https://www.saturdaydownsouth.com/tennessee-football/paul-finebaum-explains-frustrated-butch-jones-sec-media-days/

Idk if u guys read this article but recently have been getting annoyed by finebaum. first of all he states tennessee should be competing for the east every year. correct me if im wrong we obviously didnt win it but certainly competed for the east last year. and look in good shape to compete again. Also him comparing sabans 5th year to butchs 5th year is rediculous. Saban didnt take over nearly as much of a mess as butch had to


The difference between Saban and Butch is bigger than the Grand Canyon regardless of what they each inherited. Saban is probably one of the top 3 college football coaches of all time, and Butch isn't even in the top 3 in his conference.
 
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#35

jakez4ut

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#35
It's good to hear perspective without orange sunglasses. Alot ppl think TN should be great....besides alot of TN fans.

I admit the problem is above CBJ
agreed, and it has been, regardless of who the coach is, for about a decade.

we'll see if the new folks over there get it.
 
#39
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#39
I live in Alabama;the fans here didn't have any thought about Alabama being great when shula was here! they had one season where they won 10 games! ill say this and I know ill get bashed for this;if saban is the best coach over the past 25 yrs why didn't he win with shulas players his first yr? they were not good that yr! I know fans who wanted him gone after the first season he got lucky to win the bowl game! I think he is a good coach great game day guy, but best recruiter ever! I mean have any of you been to Tuscaloosa? don't leave your car very long is all I gotta say!
 
#41

jbr82

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#41
I live in Alabama;the fans here didn't have any thought about Alabama being great when shula was here! they had one season where they won 10 games! ill say this and I know ill get bashed for this;if saban is the best coach over the past 25 yrs why didn't he win with shulas players his first yr? they were not good that yr! I know fans who wanted him gone after the first season he got lucky to win the bowl game! I think he is a good coach great game day guy, but best recruiter ever! I mean have any of you been to Tuscaloosa? don't leave your car very long is all I gotta say!
At bammer the boosters, president, mayor, and janitor are all in. WIN! Not in Knoxville unfortunately
 
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#44

greenbacknative

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#44
Finebaum is exactly right. Saban's mess was closer to Butch's than you think. It is easy to forget now but Alabama was one of the great laughingstocks of college football from the mid 90s up until the mid 2000s. He took over a program that was coming off probation, still had scars to its image from the Mike Price debacle, etc. Alabama was not a supremely talented squad when Saban took over. Butch is just about one-tenth the coach Saban is, that's the biggest difference.

As far as "contending for the East" I suppose it depends on your definition of "contending." We failed to control our own destiny for the East crown after October 29 last year with 4 games left in the regular season. We will could have still gotten in after that but needed help. Is that "contending?" I can see it being argued both ways.
We weren't contending last year toward the end.. we were controlling. and then we sh_t the bed and lost it all. we had our chance even with all the adversity on injuries and players quitting. We will get it done this year..:thumbsup:
 
#45

fade route

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#45
I'd add that Butch is handicapped by fans who don't really expect much, thereby letting him skate without feeling any real pressure to move the program up the pecking order. Saban doesn't have that luxury.

Disagree. Butch is defensive about Vol fan's high expectations which is why he is constantly trying to refine success with cornball slogans like "champions of life", etc.
 
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#46

VOLINVONORE

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#46
He's also about 10x the coach Butch is.

Franklin would have been pursued heavily by Tennessee after Dooley was fired if he wasn't the coach at Vandy. An open pursuit of him would be too much of a blow to the ego.
Maybe, but I doubt it. If they would have, I doubt he would have come to Tennessee because of the state of Tennessee's athletic program at that time. We were lucky to get Butch when we did .
 
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#47

BeardedVol

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#47
Disagree. Butch is defensive about Vol fan's high expectations which is why he is constantly trying to refine success with cornball slogans like "champions of life", etc.
That's just cheesy coach-speak. Offering up 'improved APR' and '3 consecutive seasons with a bowl win' as a consolation for not taking the division is more along the lines of Butch trying to redefine success.
 
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#48

VolunteerHillbilly

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#48
Finebaum is the John Adams of TV. States the obvious and constantly pizzes people off intentionally.
I agree completely that what he stated about Jones in that interview is plainly obvious and it seems to have pissed off a chunk of our fanbase. I hope that Butch either fails or succeeds in a big way this year so this whole thing can be put behind us one way or another. Really not looking forward to another season of petty squabbling, name calling and hurt feelings, which is exactly what we'll have if it's a 7 or 8 win regular season.
 
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#50

LA Vol

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#50
Forget comparisons with Saban and Dooley. But Finebaum makes a valid point about trying to redefine expectations. Winning three consecutive bowl games does not equal winning the SECE and the MCB isn't the Sugar Bowl. And 8-4 in Year 5 isn't likely to get us to the SECCG in ATL. That's a disappointment.
 
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