Official Jon Gruden Thread XXVIII

[tastycar]

Off topic, but has anyone ever paid attention to Dino Babers and the way he speaks?

I am so impressed with him and his winning attitude. I would love to see him at Florida or Arkansas. He could help make the SEC better overall, imo.

 

[VolGee4]

So the idea now is we have two contracts with two separate groups that are both signed undermining the contract CBJ is executing and being paid under as recently as last night? Double secret probation type contracts? How is it VN knows how much CBJ makes and his contract details, but somehow an elusive MOU and new contract CBJ signed is all kept secret??

Put on your thinking caps, the same ones that allow you to be successful as professionals and once you do it will separate the soons from the loons IMO.

Just curious, how do you think both Tom Herman and Justin Fuente were literally announced as new head coaches a day after the former coaches had their last games? The search wasn't that quick and contact had been made.

I am not sure if an actual MOU would be signed, but this type of thing has happened plenty of times. I believe Butch knows he is gone, so there is no real damage on his end. He knows what money is coming on his end.

 

[knucklehead_vol]

LOL, that's the point, in this case, CBJ's buyout would easily be thrice, and settled. There is no attorney worth his salt IMO, that would allow going to trial/court a paper trail that the attorney participated in proving the case of his/her opposition. In this case, the supposed "signed MOU" no one has seen. There is a reason no one has "seen" this MOU. It's what many people these days refer to as vaporware because when it gets down to it, it does not exist. It does not exist for good legal and business reasons IMO. This actually means many of your "sources" are FOS regarding details like this, they may or may not be FOS on other things. Believers will rationalize ANYTHING like the smoking MOU that gives CBJ's buyout an exponential increase for legal incompetence IF it exists at all.

Actually it has been seen but you won't hear from them on this board. Just sayin.

 

[I Love Lamp]

Off topic, but has anyone ever paid attention to Dino Babers and the way he speaks?

I am so impressed with him and his winning attitude. I would love to see him at Florida or Arkansas. He could help make the SEC better overall, imo.

Yea he’s a pretty sharp dude that will not be at Syracuse very long.

He will land a sweet gig in the very new future.

 

[wildorange]

He is fighting for another job.

This^! I repeat Jones is NOT coming back. Any coach that lives off twitter and shuts it down on Oct 10th and recruiting has stopped and official visits are cancelled is NOT coming back. SOON! VERY SOON!:rock:

 

[iamadoc]

LOL, that's the point, in this case, CBJ's buyout would easily be thrice, and settled. There is no attorney worth his salt IMO, that would allow going to trial/court a paper trail that the attorney participated in proving the case of his/her opposition. In this case, the supposed "signed MOU" no one has seen. There is a reason no one has "seen" this MOU. It's what many people these days refer to as vaporware because when it gets down to it, it does not exist. It does not exist for good legal and business reasons IMO. This actually means many of your "sources" are FOS regarding details like this, they may or may not be FOS on other things. Believers will rationalize ANYTHING like the smoking MOU that gives CBJ's buyout an exponential increase for legal incompetence IF it exists at all.

Thanks for the response. I appreciate your thoughts. I imagine UT has the bases covered and both parties will handle this with dignity and class.

 

[Remy]

MOUs are extremely common in NCAA coaching searches.

Please make the stupidity stop. I daresay MOUs are used in almost ALL coaching searches. The point is you would not have an MOU out there signed with another coach hiring him or her, killing a contract with another coach that was still in force. THAT is a paper trail a good attorney would NEVER allow.

 

[Squints]

LOL, that's the point, in this case, CBJ's buyout would easily be thrice, and settled. There is no attorney worth his salt IMO, that would allow going to trial/court a paper trail that the attorney participated in proving the case of his/her opposition. In this case, the supposed "signed MOU" no one has seen. There is a reason no one has "seen" this MOU. It's what many people these days refer to as vaporware because when it gets down to it, it does not exist. It does not exist for good legal and business reasons IMO. This actually means many of your "sources" are FOS regarding details like this, they may or may not be FOS on other things. Believers will rationalize ANYTHING like the smoking MOU that gives CBJ's buyout an exponential increase for legal incompetence IF it exists at all.

Have you read anything posted here, ever? MOUs are NOT, I repeat, NOT, contracts and are not treated as such. They are not a binding agreement and do not have to be publicly published. Easy to see why no one has seen it, other than the parties involved.

 

[RikidyBones]

Thanks for the response. I appreciate your thoughts. I imagine UT has the bases covered and both parties will handle this with dignity and class.

I'm sure they do as well. It's called an amendment. That amendment can say a thousand things that permit UT to pursue another coach and draft an MOU.

 

[10ecVol]

Went back and got this quote from HearForGrumors addressing the "contractual" problem. This guy is a lawyer-

"Good afternoon Grudenites:

I've been following the Gruden Threads since well before MIT's posts were deleted. I've been lurking here for years. This is my first post. (I tried to get in a few days ago, but I got buried in the mountains of new requests with the recent hubbub.) I just wanted to share a few thoughts.

DISCLAIMER: I AM NOT AN INSIDER! I HAVE NO PRIVILEGED INFORMATION AT ALL. EVERYTHING THAT FOLLOWS IS EITHER PUBLIC KNOWLEDGE, OR MY OPINION.

I wanted to clarify a few legal points that keep recurring:

First, there is no language in CBJ's contract that precludes the AD from interviewing new candidates. There is no exclusivity clause, etc. Barring some regulation that I've not found, UT could have two head coaches if they wanted. Anyone who thinks that Currie is barred from discussing an opening with potential candidates is mistaken. It may be poor form to do it publicly, but it is within the purview of the position of AD to offer the position to coaches who fit the criteria.

Second, there is 100% no obligation for UT to leave the job open for any period of time, or to vet X number of candidates before hiring anyone. Someone did post the relevant regulation, but it got washed over quickly. In a position like this, one candidate is all that is needed (and you could hire him before firing the other one).

Third, deals can be done, and based on conditions. For example, the Gruden deal could be totally done on the condition that CBJ goes 7-5 or worse. In that case, should CBJ go 8-4 then the Gruden deal would be void. This is important for anyone wanting a way to reconcile MIT's "deal is done" verbiage. (My personal opinion is the same as SFD, the deal was done on the Gruden side, and being taken to the AD. The "carrot," if you will.)

Fourth, it would not be surprising at all to see CBJ accept a buy out option. Like has been posted elsewhere, by negotiating a lump sum, he may actually receive more in total compensation. Every time I see someone say that CBJ would not accept a buy out option, I cringe. Stahp it.

Fifth, We all like transparency, but its hard to work in chaos. The AD is now operating quietly and discreetly. The result is the murmurs and grumblings we are seeing now. There is nothing wrong with grumbling, but from the AD perspective its easier to deal with vague grumbles than exacting criticism and involvement of having the whole world in your thoughts. This is not uncommon in these types of deals. Just have patience. If you don't have meaningful influence, keep it to social media. When the deal is done we'll know where we are and how we got there. (I'm thinking a 30-for-30 is totally warranted.)

Sixth, IMO, a CBJ game is equal in effect to an interim if you have your guy. It only makes sense to switch to an interim if you think the interim can do better than your coach. In this case, I think any interim is a totally unknown quantity. Just let it play out, these folks aren't stupid. Maybe egotistical and self destructive, but not dumb.

Seventh, haters end up on preacher's list. You don't want to be there.

To say a little about me, and why I have opinions on the law and deals, I'm an, in fact, an attorney. I do complex litigation that almost always involves complicated settlements between as many as 20 distinct parties. I concentrated my legal education on contracts, negotiation, and dispute resolution. I took every sports law related course offered at my school (one that focuses on sports law quite prominently. It has a top 3 ranking for sports law)."

 

[UTVolinExile]

There is no way that good legal counsel would allow anyone officially with the UTAD be in the position of negotiating a contract with someone else before the other contract in force and executing over time covered by the executed contract is underway. Could an unofficial contact or cutout attorney be doing these things? Yes. Would a paper trail of a signed MOU with someone else, be allowed? Hell to the naw!!! Think people or fire your counsel, he/she is incompetent if they cosign crap like that and I can line up lawyers from here to Timbuktu that would take CBJ's side and prevail for a minimum of treble damages.

Or, as many people have said here for weeks, Butch's exit was already legally agreed upon.

 

[ShatteredVol]

LOL, that's the point, in this case, CBJ's buyout would easily be thrice, and settled. There is no attorney worth his salt IMO, that would allow going to trial/court a paper trail that the attorney participated in proving the case of his/her opposition. In this case, the supposed "signed MOU" no one has seen. There is a reason no one has "seen" this MOU. It's what many people these days refer to as vaporware because when it gets down to it, it does not exist. It does not exist for good legal and business reasons IMO. This actually means many of your "sources" are FOS regarding details like this, they may or may not be FOS on other things. Believers will rationalize ANYTHING like the smoking MOU that gives CBJ's buyout an exponential increase for legal incompetence IF it exists at all.

What is it that you believe impedes Tennessee's ability to negotiate with another party? You appear to only say that there can't be another employment contract while Butch's employment contract is active. On what are you basing that claim? State Law? Butch's contract?

 

[Remy]

LOONERS are gonna loon. It is what it is ya'll.

 

[RikidyBones]

Please make the stupidity stop. I daresay MOUs are used in almost ALL coaching searches. The point is you would not have an MOU out there signed with another coach hiring him or her, killing a contract with another coach that was still in force. THAT is a paper trail a good attorney would NEVER allow.

you're assuming an amendment hasn't been signed. we don't know if there has or hasn't been

 

[TheDude]

I had a co-worker say, "If you told me last week that I would be sitting on a bag of frozen peas, and I would like it, I would have said you're crazy. Trust me I liked it."

Best times to have it done - Beginning of March Madness or College Football Kickoff in Sept. Nothing to do but sit in a chair and stair at the TV.

 

[JackWhite]

MOU could say, if the HCUTK position comes open within the next 90 days, both parties agree to work together to make it a reality... Or some ****.

 

[zydane47]

Ok so baby question, how big was everyone's baby when they were born

 

[LakeMaryFLVol]

The Grude News, the Sunday edition. For those just tuning in.

We won yesterday. Which as of late is a pretty big deal. I won't say it was the greatest game played, but chalk it up in the W column. However, I did think we were going to get an early preview of Monday Night Raw with the Southern Miss HC and referee team.

Good for him though. You always take up for your players.

DTO dropped a significant bombshell last night and went straight to 100% confidence on Gruden. Said "lots of quiet confidence out there." And went silent afterwards...

No Atlanta or Beaver sightings though. Could be a good thing since Atlanta said he would go dark when the deal was almost set. Since his bomb the other day, not a peep out of him.

Nothing from Boro. However, his son had a hell of a game yesterday playing for the Maryville Scots. Was injured, so keep him in your thoughts.

Odds on offshore Gruden betting are offline. Before being taken down, odds somehow dropped to -1,000,000,999,999%. Website maintains it was "a clerical error" and that they "know nothing."

Volly posted a demand for "text updates" yesterday. Gruden Thread regulars were attempting to send her the DTO updates, yet receiving nothing in reply. This morning, UT Admin released a statement Athletic Director John Currie was changing his cell phone number due to the disturbing number of drunk texts he received last night as well as morally questionable pictures.

5FingerVolPunch and Mrs. 5FingerVolPunch are expecting a child soon. Here's to long life, good health and prosperity for our newest little Vol fan.

We got a visit from our Lady of the Threads, SFD. She remains calm, collected, sharp and willing to see this through to the end. Did her puzzle piece thing and is sitting somewhere around the 99.9999999999623% park. Don't be a stranger, ma'am. And the girlfriend analogy was spot on.

Wildorange filling in for Comb in his "Gruden to the Hill!" posts this morning. Doing a slam up job too. Bravo Zulu, sir.

There is a rumor of an MOA being signed by Gruden and UT. Nothing concrete, but a lot of smoke. Folks seem to think we're a lot closer this time than in 2012.

Doyle is a little down and thinks Gruden is a pipe dream. Try to cheer him up with copious amounts of hard alcohol and fast women today.

In other news today, gray trash can sales in the State of Tennessee have gone down by a record 1,572%. People are flocking to brown, green and other colors as "not to be reminded constantly of the pain and anguish we've endured." Manufacturer Rubbermaid announced a restructuring of it's sponsorship with the University of Tennessee and vowed to create both lifelike Nick Saban styled trash cans and standard sized models of Will Muschamp, former coach Jim McElwain and Kirby Smart so "Vol fans can dispose of their garbage into other team's coaches."

UT fans threatened to burn down the factory if Rubbermaid proceeds.

Modifications of the Grude 1 yacht have ground to a halt. Freak in negotiations with Sikorsky helicopters to create "sky yacht" based on their largest helicopter design. Which does include a full hot tub and tailgating access on the rear cargo ramp.

From the entire Volnation News Team, I'm Grand Vol and roads? Where we're going we don't need roads.






(All information herein is specifically parody unless otherwise indicated by real posters or events)

Thank you..Great as always :rock:

 

[BearCat204]

LOONERS are gonna loon. It is what it is ya'll.

Don't be mad because you don't understand what a simple MOU is lol.

 

[knucklehead_vol]

Don't be mad because you don't understand what a simple MOU is lol.

Lol

 

[chetsteadman87]

Ok so baby question, how big was everyone's baby when they were born

7lbs 8oz

 

[TheFlash1971]

Is Jon Gruden coming ? I would say probably not. Considering that it would have probably already happened. Butch Jones will be fired and then Currie will announce who our new coach will be. My first call would be to Jon but not the Jon you all think. 1st call would be to John Harbaugh, 2nd call Jon Gruden, 3rd call Gary Patterson, 4th call Mark Dantonio . I just want to be relevant again. 10 yrs of Division 2 football I am over.

 

[LakeMaryFLVol]

Went back and got this quote from HearForGrumors addressing the "contractual" problem. This guy is a lawyer-

"Good afternoon Grudenites:

I've been following the Gruden Threads since well before MIT's posts were deleted. I've been lurking here for years. This is my first post. (I tried to get in a few days ago, but I got buried in the mountains of new requests with the recent hubbub.) I just wanted to share a few thoughts.

DISCLAIMER: I AM NOT AN INSIDER! I HAVE NO PRIVILEGED INFORMATION AT ALL. EVERYTHING THAT FOLLOWS IS EITHER PUBLIC KNOWLEDGE, OR MY OPINION.

I wanted to clarify a few legal points that keep recurring:

First, there is no language in CBJ's contract that precludes the AD from interviewing new candidates. There is no exclusivity clause, etc. Barring some regulation that I've not found, UT could have two head coaches if they wanted. Anyone who thinks that Currie is barred from discussing an opening with potential candidates is mistaken. It may be poor form to do it publicly, but it is within the purview of the position of AD to offer the position to coaches who fit the criteria.

Second, there is 100% no obligation for UT to leave the job open for any period of time, or to vet X number of candidates before hiring anyone. Someone did post the relevant regulation, but it got washed over quickly. In a position like this, one candidate is all that is needed (and you could hire him before firing the other one).

Third, deals can be done, and based on conditions. For example, the Gruden deal could be totally done on the condition that CBJ goes 7-5 or worse. In that case, should CBJ go 8-4 then the Gruden deal would be void. This is important for anyone wanting a way to reconcile MIT's "deal is done" verbiage. (My personal opinion is the same as SFD, the deal was done on the Gruden side, and being taken to the AD. The "carrot," if you will.)

Fourth, it would not be surprising at all to see CBJ accept a buy out option. Like has been posted elsewhere, by negotiating a lump sum, he may actually receive more in total compensation. Every time I see someone say that CBJ would not accept a buy out option, I cringe. Stahp it.

Fifth, We all like transparency, but its hard to work in chaos. The AD is now operating quietly and discreetly. The result is the murmurs and grumblings we are seeing now. There is nothing wrong with grumbling, but from the AD perspective its easier to deal with vague grumbles than exacting criticism and involvement of having the whole world in your thoughts. This is not uncommon in these types of deals. Just have patience. If you don't have meaningful influence, keep it to social media. When the deal is done we'll know where we are and how we got there. (I'm thinking a 30-for-30 is totally warranted.)

Sixth, IMO, a CBJ game is equal in effect to an interim if you have your guy. It only makes sense to switch to an interim if you think the interim can do better than your coach. In this case, I think any interim is a totally unknown quantity. Just let it play out, these folks aren't stupid. Maybe egotistical and self destructive, but not dumb.

Seventh, haters end up on preacher's list. You don't want to be there.

To say a little about me, and why I have opinions on the law and deals, I'm an, in fact, an attorney. I do complex litigation that almost always involves complicated settlements between as many as 20 distinct parties. I concentrated my legal education on contracts, negotiation, and dispute resolution. I took every sports law related course offered at my school (one that focuses on sports law quite prominently. It has a top 3 ranking for sports law)."

Well constructed brief barrister

 

[Power T-Rev]

Is Jon Gruden coming ? I would say probably not. Considering that it would have probably already happened. Butch Jones will be fired and then Currie will announce who our new coach will be. My first call would be to Jon but not the Jon you all think. 1st call would be to John Harbaugh, 2nd call Jon Gruden, 3rd call Gary Patterson, 4th call Mark Dantonio . I just want to be relevant again. 10 yrs of Division 2 football I am over.

Gtfo

 

[knucklehead_vol]

Is Jon Gruden coming ? I would say probably not. Considering that it would have probably already happened. Butch Jones will be fired and then Currie will announce who our new coach will be. My first call would be to Jon but not the Jon you all think. 1st call would be to John Harbaugh, 2nd call Jon Gruden, 3rd call Gary Patterson, 4th call Mark Dantonio . I just want to be relevant again. 10 yrs of Division 2 football I am over.

So who have you heard about relating to the search?