Off Topic: Super Bowl LI Thread

#476
#476
volfannbama said:
Fess Up: which one of you just called sports animal and said the last TD in regulation wasn't a TD because the players feet were never in the end zone?

Even said everyone in the room agreed that it wasn't a TD.

If that is the case, the OT TD wasn't a TD because the players feet never went in the end zone.
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:lolabove::lolabove::lolabove::lolabove::lolabove:
 
#477
#477
Brady and Belichik are like Gary Kurtz and George Lucas.

Without each other they are pretty meh, but together they seem like the GOAT.
 
#478
#478
VolsSportsFan said:
It's not my logic bro; I'll repeat, only orange colored glasses wearers are even thinking this is a debate anymore.
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I don't blame a casual observer for assuming that the guy with the most SB rings is the greatest ever. I just think if you consider other factors, there's a strong argument to be made for Peyton. And I'm sure even I wouldn't care enough to discuss it if he hadn't played for UT. So I'll cop to that.
 
#479
#479
Hacksaw said:
I don't blame a casual observer for assuming that the guy with the most SB rings is the greatest ever. I just think if you consider other factors, there's a strong argument to be made for Peyton. And I'm sure even I wouldn't care enough to discuss it if he hadn't played for UT. So I'll cop to that.
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Fair enough.

To be honest I think the idea of a GOAT is kind of silly anyway. Too many factors to consider, to many what ifs, different eras, etc. I think at least a good 5 QBs could lay a claim to it if not more, and in the end they're all great so who really cares. I doubt any of them lose sleep over it.
 
#480
#480
Hacksaw said:
I don't blame a casual observer for assuming that the guy with the most SB rings is the greatest ever. I just think if you consider other factors, there's a strong argument to be made for Peyton. And I'm sure even I wouldn't care enough to discuss it if he hadn't played for UT. So I'll cop to that.
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Argument that Manning is better than Brady: Go Vols.
 
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#481
#481
IMO...

Yes, teams win titles.

But, I'm sorry. On paper, the Pats win with less. They even got rid of two of their best defensive players during the season.

people want to make it out like they are loaded, but it's hard to find players who have done jack once they leave New England....see Branch, Deion.

And yes, I think that separates both Brady and Belichek
 
#482
#482
99gator said:
IMO...

Yes, teams win titles.

But, I'm sorry. On paper, the Pats win with less. They even got rid of two of their best defensive players during the season.

people want to make it out like they are loaded, but it's hard to find players who have done jack once they leave New England....see Branch, Deion.

And yes, I think that separates both Brady and Belichek
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It certainly separates Belichick. He wins no matter who the position players are. That has been true at QB, too, during the times when Brady has been out. Would anyone really be surprised if Belichick keeps winning SBs after Brady retires?
 
#483
#483
Hacksaw said:
It certainly separates Belichick. He wins no matter who the position players are. That has been true at QB, too, during the times when Brady has been out. Would anyone really be surprised if Belichick keeps winning SBs after Brady retires?
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Yes, I kind of would.

And I'm not even totally disagreeing with you, as I think it was massively impressive how they still managed to go 11-5 without Brady in 2008 and 3-1 without him this year. But, you still cannot replace all of the things Brady does for them in the big moments.

I'm sorry, but he is the GOAT.
 
#484
#484
Remy said:
Like Bradshaw reminded everyone, no QB has lost as many Superbowls as Brady as well. It's a stat like Clank Kobe's missed shots that will likely never be overshadowed by another player in our lifetimes.
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He's only lost 2.

Jim Kelly has lost more and won none.
 
#486
#486
No-one can question what Brady and the Patriots have done in the age of salary caps and free agency. It's crazy what they were able to accomplish. You can't compare them to the dynasties of the past with a team full of hall of famers for multiple years.
 
#488
#488
Hacksaw said:
It certainly separates Belichick. He wins no matter who the position players are. That has been true at QB, too, during the times when Brady has been out. Would anyone really be surprised if Belichick keeps winning SBs after Brady retires?
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I think this is way overblown.

For one, it's happened all of 1 time, and people point to the 11-5 record, yet that team didn't make the playoffs. If Brady is the QB that year, they're a playoff team. Secondly let's not act like Cassel was a pure bum. Sure he sucks now, but he went and started for KC for 4 seasons, led them to the playoffs and made a Pro Bowl. People point to the 2-14 year Manning wasn't with the Colts, yeah, none of those QBs were worth a damn.

The Pats missed Brady for 4 games this year, went 3-1. Garoppolo looked good but it was 2 games. Brissett looked pretty terrible the next 2 weeks and it's not like they played murderer's row those 4 games.

Time will tell if the Pats keep winning. I won't be surprised but if he doesn't win any SBs after Brady retires, but I won't be that surprised if he doesn't either.
 
#489
#489
NE SB Wins:
20-17 (Kicker wins game at buzzer)
32-29 (Kicker wins game at buzzer)
24-21 (Kicker makes at 8.40 Q4 for 10-point lead)
28-24 (DB saves game w goal line Int at buzzer after 2nd Brady pick)
28-28 (Illegal pick play on 2-point conversion for tie after Brady bad play dug huge hole)

NE Losses
14-17 (Brady posts 18-0 team to only 14 pts v 10-6 team)
17-21 (Brady posts 13-3 team to only 2 TDs v 9-7 team)

Commonalities:
Pats superior and favored in every game
Best HC since Lombardi
Best D in NFL over 2 decades
Poor-to-indifferent QB play in every game -- all 7 -- put NE in position to lose

Conclusions:
Brady has never had a great SB game (see Phil Simms, Doug Williams, Steve Young)
Not good in biggest games generally (1-3 v PManning in AFC Championship Games)
Has Lost 2 SBs (Montana, Bradshaw, Aikman undefeated with 4, 4, and 3)
The hypothetical GOAT would have taken NE's many assets and won SBs easily
You get no special prize for digging out of the hole your mistakes have made
Drama is not competence, just the opposite
 
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#490
#490
99gator said:
You tell me how many teams Edelman and Amendola are your starting WR.

We just have to agree to disagree.
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No idea, and you don't have one either. I'd suggest a lot more than you think, especially Edelman, who could start and post very good production for any team in the league. Edelman, despite missing 7 games due to injury, is averaging 90 catches for just under 1,000 yards per season the last 4 years.

I'm just telling you that those guys run free every game and make plays. But most people think they since they're not 6'4 and they're white that they suck and can't play and that only Brady makes them any good and I don't think that's true. Since Brady is the GOAT, he certainly makes them better with his decision-making and accuracy....but they're still getting open and making plays game after game after game.
 
#491
#491
WiseOlVol said:
NE SB Wins:
20-17 (Kicker wins game at buzzer)
32-29 (Kicker wins game at buzzer)
24-21 (Kicker makes at 8.40 Q4 for 10-point lead)
28-24 (DB saves game w goal line Int at buzzer after 2nd Brady pick)
28-28 (Illegal pick play on 2-point conversion for tie after Brady bad play dug huge hole)

NE Losses
14-17 (Brady posts 18-0 team to only 14 pts v 10-6 team)
17-21 (Brady posts 13-3 team to only 2 TDs v 9-7 team)

Commonalities:
Pats superior and favored in every game
Best HC since Lombardi
Best D in NFL over 2 decades
Poor-to-indifferent QB play in every game -- all 7 -- put NE in position to lose

Conclusions:
Brady has never had a great SB game (see Phil Simms, Doug Williams, Steve Young)
Not good in biggest games generally (1-3 v PManning in AFC Championship Games)
Has Lost 2 SBs (Montana, Bradshaw, Aikman undefeated with 4, 4, and 3)
The hypothetical GOAT would have taken NE's many assets and won SBs easily
You get no special prize for digging out of the hole your mistakes have made
Drama is not competence, just the opposite
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LOL montana,Bradshaw, and Aikman played on stacked teams full of hall of famers with no salary cap or free agency....
 
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#492
#492
Quoting Bradshaw is like quoting Holtz. Both morons. Terry took to many shots to the head.
 
#493
#493
jpope9 said:
LOL montana,Bradshaw, and Aikman played on stacked teams full of hall of famers with no salary cap or free agency....
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Very odd that a QB that apparently sucks in the big game has won the most Super Bowl MVPs in history.

It's almost like his opinion is.....extremely stupid.
 
#495
#495
VolsSportsFan said:
Very odd that a QB that apparently sucks in the big game has won the most Super Bowl MVPs in history.

It's almost like his opinion is.....extremely stupid.
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The whole 25-9 playoff record is meaningless.

73%
 
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#497
#497
WiseOlVol said:
NE SB Wins:
20-17 (Kicker wins game at buzzer)
32-29 (Kicker wins game at buzzer)
24-21 (Kicker makes at 8.40 Q4 for 10-point lead)
28-24 (DB saves game w goal line Int at buzzer after 2nd Brady pick)
28-28 (Illegal pick play on 2-point conversion for tie after Brady bad play dug huge hole)

NE Losses
14-17 (Brady posts 18-0 team to only 14 pts v 10-6 team)
17-21 (Brady posts 13-3 team to only 2 TDs v 9-7 team)

Commonalities:
Pats superior and favored in every game
Best HC since Lombardi
Best D in NFL over 2 decades
Poor-to-indifferent QB play in every game -- all 7 -- put NE in position to lose

Conclusions:
Brady has never had a great SB game (see Phil Simms, Doug Williams, Steve Young)
Not good in biggest games generally (1-3 v PManning in AFC Championship Games)
Has Lost 2 SBs (Montana, Bradshaw, Aikman undefeated with 4, 4, and 3)
The hypothetical GOAT would have taken NE's many assets and won SBs easily
You get no special prize for digging out of the hole your mistakes have made
Drama is not competence, just the opposite
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Not quite understanding how getting to six Super Bowls, but losing twice is somehow worse that only getting to four and never losing.
 
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#498
#498
bleedorange0037 said:
Not quite understanding how getting to six Super Bowls, but losing twice is somehow worse that only getting to four and never losing.
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I was about to say, if he's holding losing 2 against Brady then Manning can't be his GOAT. Plus somebody threw a pick 6 that pretty much lost the game for his team, and it wasn't Brady....
 
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#499
#499
VolsSportsFan said:
I was about to say, if he's holding that against Brady then Manning can't be his GOAT. Plus somebody threw a pick 6 that pretty much lost the game for his team, and it wasn't Brady....
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His rationale was basically that it's better from a legacy standpoint to lose earlier in the playoffs than in the SB, which is ridiculous.
 
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#500
#500
bleedorange0037 said:
His rationale was basically that it's better from a legacy standpoint to lose earlier in the playoffs than in the SB, which is ridiculous.
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I know, for some reason that seems to be some kind of popular rationale. People dog the crap out of the Bills. Yeah losing 4 SBs in a row sucks but it's also quite a feat to make it 4 years in a row. You can't just totally dismiss that.
 
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