Not Top 10, you say? Make your case here!

[TMvol10]

Did you watch the game or look into it more than what you read from some other poster?

Yeah. UT "struggled"... really kind of did everything they could to lose the game... and still won it because they were the MUCH better team.

Have you looked at the other top 10 teams from this perspective? UGA just struggled with a Mizzou team MUCH weaker than Pitt or UF. Michigan struggled with Maryland and a really, really bad Iowa team.

Point is that you could do what you're trying to do to UT to every other top team and rationalize they aren't worthy of being in the top 10.


The D has a lot of work to do but that's the case with just about every team including others in the top 10. Ole Miss can't throw. PSU has only played one team that has an O with a pulse.

Before looking at UT in a vacuum... maybe you should take time to look deeper into the others?

And an even deeper look into the Pitt v GT game, Pitt lost their running back to a shoulder injury in the second quarter, the weather was terrible and Pitt lost the turnover battle 3-0. Not necessarily making excuses for them, but that’s the type of stuff that happens that leads to loses against inferior teams. So maybe we shouldn’t write off the Pitt win as a crappy win just yet. Pitt still has a chance to have a good year

 

[McDad]

Yes. I noticed that too. Not exactly sure what to make of it and especially with Banks getting a raise.

Maybe someone is pushing back that they need lockdown corners to do that... but IMO... you actually don't. Teams that pressure the QB and penetrate the backfield force mistakes... and cover their own weaknesses.

Personally, I would rather see UT give up more big plays but have the D on the field less.

Good thoughts.

To make sense of the dichotomy, I landed on CJH talking up an aggressive D to appeal to recruits and transfers. Anyone paying attention to our games can plainly see we play a bend but don't break style. I like two things about that approach this season. First, our D line is much more effective than last season. We aren't setting records for sacks but doing a very good job with hurries and pressures. So, we have opportunity to play aggressively in drives if the situation favors. Secondly, bending (while being stingy at the end zone) combined with our efficient offense puts pressure on the other team's offense. That pressure should lead to mistakes. So, we may not be able to beat you with our defense but we can put you in a position to make mistakes and beat yourself.

AR had the game of his life against us. I understand our secondary has issues but he made some incredible throws. Aside from Bryce, and maybe Levis, I don't see any other QB with that ability remaining on our schedule.

 

[Pride85]

Dont GAF what youre sick of. The OP asked a question and I answered it.

You actually didn't. Reread the actual post and your answer is a bit lacking. Very few have actually answered the OPs questions as detailed in his post. Most giving the same rants that were mentioned in the OP, not the details asked. If you can give the details, then you have actually answered. This applies to the entire thread, you just happened to state you had answered the question.

 

[90 Vol]

As it stands today, we're a top 10 team. We're undefeated with wins against two ranked opponents in four games. One of our wins against a ranked opponent was on the road. If you look at our resume so far, it's as good as just about anyone.

 

[VFL-82-JP]

To be fair, you're asking for a lot of work.

I am, it's true.

On the other hand, every minute we spend on these forums is 100% typing and reading. If we're going to spend 30 minutes here, why not spend it explaining our points of view and discussing them with others?



Go Vols!

 

[VFL-82-JP]

Do you find it odd CJH has repeatedly said publicly he wants us to be an attacking defense while our games look much more 'bend but don't break'?

I saw SJT's good response to your question, McDad.

And I've noticed what you're talking about, too. I personally think it's because we're not yet able to attack at full effectiveness.

I mean, we have seen the attacking spirit being coached into our lads. Our DL is getting at it. And remember that one play where Hadden didn't even try to tackle the runner as they both ran down the sideline, but instead, kept trying to punch the ball out? Attack, create turnovers, sack, hurry, confuse.

So we're seeing flashes of it, but we are not yet at the point where it becomes the identity of our defense. Maybe not enough physicality in all positions, or enough speed, or enough understanding of what the coaches want us to do. Probably a little of all that.

I think we're ALSO seeing the bend but don't break aspect of the D because that is Tim Banks' fall-back. If attacking works, you don't need to worry about them scoring. But for when it doesn't work, at least have a fail-safe. We're seeing the fail-safe.

Anyway, idk if that's right. Just seems that way to me.

Go Vols!

 

[BubbaDoc]

UGA ain’t ****

Not so fast my friend.

 

[VFL-82-JP]

I am going to play devil's advocate and argue against us being in top 10.

I still think we only have 1-2 recruiting classes from Heupel so not a lot of depth and our defense cannot seem to get off the field on 3rd or 4th down. If we have a game were our offense plays like the 2nd half of Pitt game and our defense plays like they did against Florida, we will get blown out.

That being said, the field this year looks pretty weak so we may actually be among the top 10 teams. In the SEC alone, Auburn, Florida, and LSU appear to be "down". Then nationally the B1G only has three really good teams right now: Michigan, Penn State, and Ohio State. Big12 seems to be a mess. ACC is still the ACC for most part. Pac12 is a little "up" versus past years but two of its premier programs have losses to SEC East teams.

So, nationally, there seems to be a weak field once you get past top 3-5 teams.

To be flat honest, Tennessee reminds me a lot of the Oklahoma teams of Lincoln Riley. Spectacular offense but suspect defense. They were top 10 teams but not top 5/playoff contending teams.

As a Vols fan, I am happy with where we are whether we are a top ten team or not. I don't want the expectations to be unrealistic for Heupel should we hit a skid these next few games.

I appreciate you making the honest attempt.

As I read your post, though, I got the impression that you actually talked yourself into believing we ARE a top 10 team. Heh.

Go Vols!

 

[sjt18]

AR had the game of his life against us. I understand our secondary has issues but he made some incredible throws. Aside from Bryce, and maybe Levis, I don't see any other QB with that ability remaining on our schedule.

Young may not be available. I'm not a believer in Levis. He has the physical tools but he turns the ball over and just doesn't do things that scare me. Plus he's probably playing behind the SEC's worst OL.

AR is gifted. I'm going to be interested to see if he just needed a road game to take the pressure off. Their next three games are Mizzou, LSU, and UGA. If he's turned the corner then he's going to have a great opportunity to prove it.

 

[McDad]

I saw SJT's good response to your question, McDad.

And I've noticed what you're talking about, too. I personally think it's because we're not yet able to attack at full effectiveness.

I mean, we have seen the attacking spirit being coached into our lads. Our DL is getting at it. And remember that one play where Hadden didn't even try to tackle the runner as they both ran down the sideline, but instead, kept trying to punch the ball out? Attack, create turnovers, sack, hurry, confuse.

So we're seeing flashes of it, but we are not yet at the point where it becomes the identity of our defense. Maybe not enough physicality in all positions, or enough speed, or enough understanding of what the coaches want us to do. Probably a little of all that.

I think we're ALSO seeing the bend but don't break aspect of the D because that is Tim Banks' fall-back. If attacking works, you don't need to worry about them scoring. But for when it doesn't work, at least have a fail-safe. We're seeing the fail-safe.

Anyway, idk if that's right. Just seems that way to me.

Go Vols!

It is as good as any other speculation. In fact, as head coach he should be preparing for the sprint but training for the marathon. Consistently preach his message on aggressive defense while also preparing our team up to their capabilities for each game this season.

I am expecting our defense to continue to improve as the year progresses.

 

[McDad]

Young may not be available. I'm not a believer in Levis. He has the physical tools but he turns the ball over and just doesn't do things that scare me. Plus he's probably playing behind the SEC's worst OL.

AR is gifted. I'm going to be interested to see if he just needed a road game to take the pressure off. Their next three games are Mizzou, LSU, and UGA. If he's turned the corner then he's going to have a great opportunity to prove it.

Would really be great for AR to continue to improve and beat UGA. I would love to double dip on Florida...beat them head to head AND have them help us to an SEC Championship game.

 

[DC_Vol]

You play the opponent that's in front of you. Good wins happen. Bad losses happen. The issue with analyzing rankings and wins is that you just end up just chasing your tail.

Kentucky beat Florida but if Kentucky beats us it's not impressive because we barely beat Florida but Florida also beat a top 10 ranked Utah which basically means that Georgia Tech is better than Utah because they beat Pitt and we had to go to OT with Pitt but beat Florida.

This is absolutely right. I don’t feel like we are built like a Top 10 team. The defense is just too porous and we still make too many critical mistakes.

However, we’re 4-0 with two Top 20 wins on the resume. So we’re a Top 10 team and we control our own destiny. Arguing about the number in front of our name is a pointless endeavor.

The only thing we can do is win the next game in front of us.

And how nice it is to have people arguing about whether we’re truly deserving of a TOP 10 RANKING. It’s pretty awesome.

 

[DustyRockSolid]

bruh... you are what your record says you are.
right now we're a legit top ten team.
our passing defense sucks balls but our offense is perhaps the most potent in the country.

 

[OHvol40]

I don't have to answer all the questions to know we aren't a Top 10 team. My answer is simple enough for most to understand. All the other stuff is fluff and a waste of time. Kinda like this response. Oh, well..

, he asked which teams would you place ahead of UT. Pretty simple and lacking any “fluff.”

 

[DC_Vol]

bruh... you are what your record says you are.
right now we're a legit top ten team.
our passing defense sucks balls but our offense is perhaps the most potent in the country.

This was my point. Regardless what I or anyone else feels about where the team belongs.

 

[jeff1vol]

Maybe re-read that sentence and think about it a while.

Yeah. You kind of need to ask and answer the questions necessary to establish that you "know" something.

PS- Yeah. If you posted an opinion as truth without actually basing it on facts then you've wasted your time and everyone else's. All you've done is express your own feelings of insecurity about it. UT is 2nd nationally in scoring O, 1st in passing O, 1st in total O, and 28th in scoring D. So yeah, that's good enough to be in the top 10.

We're 97th in total D. PSU, NCST, even Wake may be better and ranked below UT. All of those teams have significantly better defenses and Wake is an offensive machine as well. The under/over in a Wake UT game would be what? 100! I simply don't think this team has enough talent and/or defensive production to be a Top 10 team. Now... if everyone else's defense sucks... than I guess so. You win! We're ****ing awesome and will have an easy time with every team we play from here on out. What was I thinking? It's funny how people absolutely freak out when someone has an opposing view. Kinda what this country has become.

 

[DC_Vol]

We're 97th in total D. PSU, NCST, even Wake may be better and ranked below UT. All of those teams have significantly better defenses and Wake is an offensive machine as well. The under/over in a Wake UT game would be what? 100! I simply don't think this team has enough talent and/or defensive production to be a Top 10 team. Now... if everyone else's defense sucks... than I guess so. You win! We're ****ing awesome and will have an easy time with every team we play from here on out. What was I thinking? It's funny how people absolutely freak out when someone has an opposing view. Kinda what this country has become.

100% agree. We earned our Top 10 ranking as of now. We’ve won the games we needed to win. Undefeated with two Top 20 wins.

However I’m skeptical this team has the makeup to stay a Top 10 team. The defense is too suspect. Hopefully it will improve as the year goes on. It’s only a matter of time before the ineffective 3rd and 4th down defense and/or the secondary cost us a game.

 

[first time caller]

Not putting away Pittsburg. Not putting away Florida. A win over LSU at there place, could flip me entirely.

 

[greenbacknative]

Wake forest would be a tough match up. They would carve us up. We would score too. But…..

the score would be 73-70....

 

[bpalmer28]

I am, it's true.

On the other hand, every minute we spend on these forums is 100% typing and reading. If we're going to spend 30 minutes here, why not spend it explaining our points of view and discussing them with others?



Go Vols!

So here's my reasoning...

Kentucky:
They've got a very good defense and I think it's good enough to slow us down. They only allowed 3 TDs combined against Florida and Ole Miss and 0 TD through the air. That's very impressive in my mind. They did give up 23 points to Northern Illinois, but since they performed better against SEC teams I'm writing that performance off as being unmotivated. Obviously we're a much harder team to stop, but I think they could hold us to 20-something points. Their pace of play on offense could throw Hooker out of rhythm.

Offensively they aren't as good at QB as many people think but Levis is decent. He's gone over 300 yards in 3 of 5 games and has a 12/4 TD/INT ratio... that's solid. His Achilles heel is that he seems to make bad mistakes at the worst of times, which single-handedly cost UK the game against OM. They shouldn't be able to run it very well against us, as I think our run defense is as good or better than both Florida and OM, but.... we don't have anyone who can cover Barion Brown, so I think he will have a big day against us.

LSU:
I'm thinking we'll struggle with them mainly because of how they handled Mississippi State. MSU doesn't have an offense as high-powered as ours but they do have a good passing attack and LSU shut it down. If LSU can force us to be one-dimensional I think they could have similar success against us, and I think they have a good chance of doing that. They held Auburn to 3.3 ypc (leading rusher Tank Bisby had 45 yards), they held MSU to 3.4 ypc (leading rusher 50 yards) and they held FSU to 3.5 ypc (leading rusher 49 yards).

Our inability to run the ball has been one of my biggest concerns this season, so I have a hard time thinking we'll suddenly get better at that against a team like LSU.

That being said... LSU's offense isn't impressive. Maybe we only score 3 TDs and still win by double-digits. Who knows? I'm just so down on our secondary that I'm in a state of mind where I expect everyone's QB to have one of their best games against us. So I'm kind of expecting the Nussmeier kid to come in and throws for 250 against us and with home-field advantage they find a way to win an ugly game.

 

[VOL89grad]

Hmm, after another day since I hit initial reply (e.g. we are a top 10 program right now), still haven’t seen anyone convince anyone else there are at least 3 other teams who a better than VOLS right now… probably since those teams don’t exist right now

Thinking about the original question and responses, I’m thinking that given the recent changes in CFB (transfer porta, NIL, etc), it’s probably pretty hard for folks to know what is top 10 right now (from comparative analysis) much less who is “ready” to be be top 10 right now, the world isn’t flat anymore, lots of change going on.

Again, glad our team is still in the discussion!

Go VOLS, beat the heck out of LSU!

OBTW, it’s funny as heck to look at Kentucky’s blog (Wildcat Lair)…. Most of their fans clearly have PTSD from getting beat repeatedly by our team over past 3) years - like our trepidation with playing Gators).

 

[VFL-82-JP]

We're 97th in total D. PSU, NCST, even Wake may be better and ranked below UT. All of those teams have significantly better defenses and Wake is an offensive machine as well. The under/over in a Wake UT game would be what? 100! I simply don't think this team has enough talent and/or defensive production to be a Top 10 team. Now... if everyone else's defense sucks... than I guess so. You win! We're ****ing awesome and will have an easy time with every team we play from here on out. What was I thinking? It's funny how people absolutely freak out when someone has an opposing view. Kinda what this country has become.

Okay, good progress. You're much more fun to read when you explain how you're thinking. I appreciate it.

So Penn State, NC State, and Wake are the three teams you think might be better than us. All of them have better overall defense, and Wake has a good offense, to boot. Got that.

How do you see each of those teams finishing the season? Glance at their schedules, and tell me what you think their regular season records will end up?

Also, will any of them win their division? Their conference?

Finally, how do you see the Vols ending up? 9-3? 8-4? What place do you think we'll finish in the SEC East?

Thanks, I appreciate you taking a moment to help explore all this.

Go Vols!

 

[VFL-82-JP]

So here's my reasoning...

Kentucky:
They've got a very good defense and I think it's good enough to slow us down. They only allowed 3 TDs combined against Florida and Ole Miss and 0 TD through the air. That's very impressive in my mind. They did give up 23 points to Northern Illinois, but since they performed better against SEC teams I'm writing that performance off as being unmotivated. Obviously we're a much harder team to stop, but I think they could hold us to 20-something points. Their pace of play on offense could throw Hooker out of rhythm.

Offensively they aren't as good at QB as many people think but Levis is decent. He's gone over 300 yards in 3 of 5 games and has a 12/4 TD/INT ratio... that's solid. His Achilles heel is that he seems to make bad mistakes at the worst of times, which single-handedly cost UK the game against OM. They shouldn't be able to run it very well against us, as I think our run defense is as good or better than both Florida and OM, but.... we don't have anyone who can cover Barion Brown, so I think he will have a big day against us.

LSU:
I'm thinking we'll struggle with them mainly because of how they handled Mississippi State. MSU doesn't have an offense as high-powered as ours but they do have a good passing attack and LSU shut it down. If LSU can force us to be one-dimensional I think they could have similar success against us, and I think they have a good chance of doing that. They held Auburn to 3.3 ypc (leading rusher Tank Bisby had 45 yards), they held MSU to 3.4 ypc (leading rusher 50 yards) and they held FSU to 3.5 ypc (leading rusher 49 yards).

Our inability to run the ball has been one of my biggest concerns this season, so I have a hard time thinking we'll suddenly get better at that against a team like LSU.

That being said... LSU's offense isn't impressive. Maybe we only score 3 TDs and still win by double-digits. Who knows? I'm just so down on our secondary that I'm in a state of mind where I expect everyone's QB to have one of their best games against us. So I'm kind of expecting the Nussmeier kid to come in and throws for 250 against us and with home-field advantage they find a way to win an ugly game.

Thanks!

Do you expect Kentucky to beat us? And separate question, do you expect them to end up 2nd in the East, over us?

You think we'll beat LSU, I think you said. So do you expect us to end the regular season 9-3?

Appreciate your thoughts.

Go Vols!

 

[Behr]

I am, it's true.

On the other hand, every minute we spend on these forums is 100% typing and reading. If we're going to spend 30 minutes here, why not spend it explaining our points of view and discussing them with others?



Go Vols!

It's easier to say "we suck and I ain't gone say it again. In this post".

 

[bpalmer28]

Thanks!

Do you expect Kentucky to beat us? And separate question, do you expect them to end up 2nd in the East, over us?

You think we'll beat LSU, I think you said. So do you expect us to end the regular season 9-3?

Appreciate your thoughts.

Go Vols!

Yes, I think Kentucky will beat us. Not because I think we suck or because I think they're great - I just think it's a bad matchup for us. I've got them finishing the season 10-2, 2nd in the East.

I don't know what to think about LSU, honestly. I began my post expecting to make a solid case for my prediction of a loss to LSU, but the more I look at it the more I think we'll win. I hate to be fickle, but I'm on the fence right now. Gun to my head I probably say we win and finish 9-3, but that's not what I was thinking 2 hours ago.