Nationalized Voting

[LouderVol]

There is a place in Atlanta that has expedited passport. Less than 24 hours.

does this place have an actual street address, or is it some guy down an alley?

 

[NorthDallas40]

No. You haven't. You've made bald assertions via broken comparisons.

I am perfectly willing to change my opinion and abandon my argument if you can show how states adding a checkbox on their future DL/ID issues is creating "three different levels" of drivers licenses and then additionally how that would be insurmountable.

Again: If this legislation passes, people will have to show proof of citizenship somewhere. Period. Please show how giving them choices of how/where/when to do so, while phasing the 'problem' out through daily business as usual activities, would be such a bad thing?

Stopped reading after the first sentence and relished in the irony. Yes I’ve proved my point. For a DL it will result in three versions it has too. Yes the process in TX is the same as TN because it’s a normalized federal process for real ID. So yes it results in a) DL only b) real ID DL and c) citizenship verified real ID. C or any new process requires EVERYONE to do it all again likely by in person appts. Take your own advice and read.

Now back to making breakfast before my tee time.

 

[McDad]

does this place have an actual street address, or is it some guy down an alley?

it's legit. we thought we may have to use it before our travels to Japan. Lemme see if i can find the deets.

 

[McDad]

does this place have an actual street address, or is it some guy down an alley?

For expedited passports in Atlanta, you can use the Atlanta Passport Agency for urgent travel (within 14 days) by appointment for same-day or faster service, or opt for standard expedited service (2-3 weeks + mailing) by paying an extra $60 fee on your application.

For a 24-hour or same-day passport in Atlanta, you must qualify for urgent travel (within 14 days) and book an appointment at the Atlanta Passport Agency (near Midtown), a designated Passport Agency/Center, or use a private expediting service like 24 Hour Passport and Visas for faster processing, as regular post offices handle routine renewals, not urgent 24-hour services.

 

[DinkinFlicka]

Kind of like "bootlicker", which is like an IQ test audition to be taken seriously in a discussion. An automatic fail.

Baby's first buzzword.

 

[Orange_Crush]

Stopped reading after the first sentence and relished in the irony. Yes I’ve proved my point. For a DL it will result in three versions it has too. Yes the process in TX is the same as TN because it’s a normalized federal process for real ID. So yes it results in a) DL only b) real ID DL and c) citizenship verified real ID. C or any new process requires EVERYONE to do it all again likely by in person appts. Take your own advice and read.

Nope. Same category. A driver's license or ID, each with an extra bit of information--i.e. citizenship. Kind of like organ donation information. Do you know what it's on? Yep. A driver's license.

Even if you want to use the vocabulary that you're using, you are yet to make a cogent argument as to how it would be so catastrophic--i.e. using data they are already verifying to give people a choice as to how they want to clear the hurdle for new voter registration criteria (if passed).

 

[NorthDallas40]

Nope. Same category. A driver's license or ID, each with an extra bit of information--i.e. citizenship. Kind of like organ donation information. Do you know what it's on? Yep. A driver's license.

Even if you want to use the vocabulary that you're using, you are yet to make a cogent argument as to how it would be so catastrophic--i.e. using data they are already verifying to give people a choice as to how they want to clear the hurdle for new voter registration criteria (if passed).

Look I get it. You’re all in on this latest “hot topic” button being pushed. And I’m not. I have actually pointed to the disaster that real ID has been while you’ve merely offered platitudes on how it won’t be big deal without any actual historical information to support it. So yeah take your own advice is about all I can offer.

 

[BeardedVol]

Ok it doesn’t impact me at all I’m retired. I’m looking forward to standing in line and reading on here how completely screwed up the process is!!

I wonder if we'll be able to pay $45 to bypass having to get the new ID and still vote?

TSA charging travelers without a Real ID $45 to fly

ASHWAUBENON (WLUK) - No ID, pay the fee. The Transportation Security Administration is now charging people, who don't have a Real ID, to travel.

fox11online.com

 

[USF grad in TN]

What could be easier? You just need to know the last 4 digits of your social security number.

How States Now Verify Citizenship with Social Security Numbers

USCIS now lets states use Social Security numbers to verify citizenship. Learn how this affects voter records and Good Moral Character for naturalization.

immigration-cafe.com

 

[Orange_Crush]

Look I get it. You’re all in on this latest “hot topic” button being pushed.

Whatever.

And I’m not.

OK? And?

I have actually pointed to

Yes. Bald assertion via false equivalency. It's not the flex that you think it is.

the disaster that real ID has been

So it's true. Your argument boils down to premonition. I've actually given you more than your argument deserves. All I need to do is make an equally inconsequential prediction and we'll be at a stale-mate. OK. Here goes.

I predict the Earth will be attacked and subdued by insectoid aliens and this whole business of "voting" will be a thing of the past

while you’ve merely offered platitudes on how it won’t be big deal

I gave an example of a state already gathering the information as BAU. Try to keep up. For the record, as mentioned, that's far more than "debate via false equivalencies and premonitions" deserves.

without any actual historical information to support it. So yeah take your own advice is about all I can offer.

As opposed to your having given future information? lol That really the flex you want to go for?

 

[NorthDallas40]

I wonder if we'll be able to pay $45 to bypass having to get the new ID and still vote?

TSA charging travelers without a Real ID $45 to fly

ASHWAUBENON (WLUK) - No ID, pay the fee. The Transportation Security Administration is now charging people, who don't have a Real ID, to travel.

fox11online.com

That is a topic that has been completely whistled by on this whole discussion. Passports have a base cost. Any expedite consideration is all pay to play. And that is the only current document that really passes the bar as a potable citizenship proof. Hey it didn’t matter to me I’ll always pay for expedite to avoid dealing with the damn government. And I’m getting a huge laugh out of the “party of small government” pushing yet another bureaucracy

 

[NorthDallas40]

Whatever.



OK? And?



Yes. Bald assertion via false equivalency. It's not the flex that you think it is.




So it's true. Your argument boils down to premonition. I've actually given you more than your argument deserves. All I need to do is make an equally inconsequential prediction and we'll be at a stale-mate. OK. Here goes.

I predict the Earth will be attacked and subdued by insectoid aliens and this whole business of "voting" will be a thing of the past



I gave an example of a state already gathering the information as BAU. Try to keep up. For the record, as mentioned, that's far more than "debate via false equivalencies and premonitions" deserves.



As opposed to your having given future information? lol That really the flex you want to go for?

Thanks for agreeing you’ve provided nothing while I’ve actually pointed to historical disasters. Bye Felicia!

 

[Delmar]

Baby's first buzzword.

I prefer leg humper. Much more descriptive of his minions.

 

[Orange_Crush]

Thanks for agreeing you’ve provided nothing while I’ve actually pointed to historical disasters. Bye Felicia!

Again, prediction via false equivalency? Not the flex you seem to think it is.

Can you state the reasons that Read ID was a problem, and what about my proposal would make it the same problem?

I'll help.

Under the law, people who want a state-issued driver's license or identification card must verify their full legal name, Social Security number, and proof of residency and lawful status to the Department of Motor Vehicles (DMV). The state would then connect its license databases to a national electronic network.

But, according to Reuters, federal law did not provide states with funds to make the changes. In 2007, at least 13 states opposed the ID card, saying it would cost billions of dollars to administer and increase risks to privacy.

Enforcement was repeatedly delayed due to widespread opposition and refusal by state governments to implement, but by 2012, states began to comply. After numerous extensions by 2020, most states were in compliance, but COVID-19 halted all efforts until December 2022.

The federal agency said that state motor vehicle departments need more time to clear the backlog of applications created by the pandemic, and allowed the deadline to continue until May 2025.

REAL ID took 20 years to become reality. What took so long?

Congress passed a law to improve security for state-issued driver's licenses after Sept. 11 attack. A look at the two-decade delay.

www.usatoday.com

Real ID was mandated and part of the mandate was not only that states verify the information, but them connect the ID/Information into a federal database. States complained about the cost and refused to do it because funding was not given (i.e. new systems and integrations into the federal database). So, the feds kept giving extensions. Finally, the states were ready to comply, but Covid hit, and then they were under the gun to fulfill the backlog of applications submitted during Covid.


My idea was, "Hey, states are already showing they can verify the information. If a state chooses (not mandated) to do so and then put that check-box (not the cost of new systems and DB integrations) on the ID (like the feds say they will honor), that would help.


So, again... Debate via false equivalency and premonition. Drop back and punt.

 

[NorthDallas40]

Again, prediction via false equivalency? Not the flex you seem to think it is.

Can you state the reasons that Read ID was a problem, and what about my proposal would make it the same problem?

I'll help.

REAL ID took 20 years to become reality. What took so long?

Congress passed a law to improve security for state-issued driver's licenses after Sept. 11 attack. A look at the two-decade delay.

www.usatoday.com

Real ID was mandated and part of the mandate was not only that states verify the information, but them connect the ID/Information into a federal database. States complained about the cost and refused to do it because funding was not given (i.e. new systems and integrations into the federal database). So, the feds kept giving extensions. Finally, the states were ready to comply, but Covid hit, and then they were under the gun to fulfill the backlog of applications submitted during Covid.


My idea was, "Hey, states are already showing they can verify the information. If a state chooses (not mandated) to do so and then put that check-box (not the cost of new systems and DB integrations) on the ID (like the feds say they will honor), that would help.


So, again... Debate via false equivalency and premonition. Drop back and punt.

We’ve already agreed I supported my case while you’ve only offered unsupported platitudes and self righteous indignation in retort when that’s pointed out to you. You have to prove your own argument on how wonderful this is going to be not me.

 

[Orange_Crush]

We’ve already agreed I supported my case while you’ve only offered unsupported platitudes and self righteous indignation in retort when that’s pointed out to you. You have to live your own argument on how wonderful this is going to be not me.

OK. Add "liar" to the list of your debating tactics. Carry on, I guess. You choose the oddest flexes.

It seems to me that your apparent dislike for me was strong enough to have you fire off half-cocked and now you've come to your senses a bit and just need to stiff-arm the conversation until it goes away.

Maybe my indignation is only "righteous" when compared to yours, which is generally how these things work. I mean, I haven't had to lie my way out of it.

 

[NorthDallas40]

OK. Add "liar" to the list of your debating tactics. Carry on, I guess. You choose the oddest flexes.

It seems to me that your apparent dislike for me was strong enough to have you fire off half-cocked and now you've come to your senses a bit and just need to stiff-arm the conversation until it goes away.

Maybe my indignation is only "righteous" when compared to yours, which is generally how these things work. I mean, I haven't had to lie my way out of it.

Oh Lordy this is simply delicious. It isn’t my fault you can’t understand why DL would have to go to 3 types now instead of 2 in order to meet your desire here. Real ID is available for legal residents to travel freely. That’s actually why it was created. They can’t meet citizenship status. It’s about a two decade rollout now. So yeah it’s obvious to anybody not being a purposely disingenuous hack. I’ll wear your liar label as a badge of honor while also knowing I’m only one who offered factual data to support my stance

And I don’t dislike you I don’t even know you. I’m simply not persuaded by your bull **** that’s all.

 

[Orange_Crush]

Oh Lordy this is simply delicious. It isn’t my fault you can’t understand why DL would have to go to 3 types now instead of 2 in order to meet your desire here. Real ID is available for legal residents to travel freely. They can’t meet citizenship status. It’s about a two decade rollout how. So yeah it’s obvious to anybody not being a purposely disingenuous hack. I’ll wear your liar label as a badge of honor while also knowing I’m only one who offered factual data to support my stance

And I don’t dislike you I don’t even know you. I’m simply not persuaded by your bull **** that’s all.

So, you lied about what I've done to support my argument and dissect your stated concerns, and you still want to keep this going? Wouldn't you be better off losing golf-balls and cursing your swing instead of me?

Like I said, I am open to you defending against your claims that states voluntarily participating in:

(1) verifying information that real-ID already has them set to verify, and then
(2) putting a "Citizen?" checkbox on IDs/DLs they will already be issuing

would be so catastrophic and analogous to the problems Real ID had in implementation.

Like
Dislike



To obtain a REAL ID, you typically need to provide proof of identity, Social Security number, and residency, along with other supporting documents.

Required Documents​

1. Proof of Identity: You can provide one of the following:

• U.S. birth certificate
• U.S. passport
• Permanent Resident Card (Green Card) if you are a non-U.S. citizen.
  
  2
• 
  
  
  
  
  
  2 Sources

1. Proof of Social Security Number: Acceptable documents include:

• Social Security card
• Form W-2 (wage and tax statement)
• Pay stub or paycheck that includes your name and Social Security number.
  
  2
• 
  
  
  
  
  
  2 Sources

1. Proof of Residency: You may need to show two documents that verify your address, such as:

• Utility bill
• Bank statement
• Lease agreement or mortgage statement.
  
  2
• 
  
  
  
  
  
  2 Sources

1. Name Change Documents: If your name has changed (e.g., due to marriage), you will need to provide legal documents such as a marriage certificate or court order.
   
   1

Remember when I showed the difference between my proposal and Real ID? I mean, I did half your work for you already:

...

REAL ID took 20 years to become reality. What took so long?

Congress passed a law to improve security for state-issued driver's licenses after Sept. 11 attack. A look at the two-decade delay.

www.usatoday.com

Real ID was mandated and part of the mandate was not only that states verify the information, but them connect the ID/Information into a federal database. States complained about the cost and refused to do it because funding was not given (i.e. new systems and integrations into the federal database). So, the feds kept giving extensions. Finally, the states were ready to comply, but Covid hit, and then they were under the gun to fulfill the backlog of applications submitted during Covid.


...

Me: It would be cool if states voluntarily put a checkbox reflecting the information they'd already be verifying.

Real ID: There were problems implementing it because some states refused to (refusals that would by definition not be present in my voluntary hypothetical) due to the cost of implementing the digital DB (which would not be present in my DL/ID hypothetical) integrations and privacy concerns, but they are all on board now and will be gathering the information from now on.

You: I can predict the future even though I can't spot a false equivalency today!

 

[NorthDallas40]

So, you lied about what I've done to support my argument and dissect your stated concerns, and you still want to keep this going? Wouldn't you be better off losing golf-balls and cursing your swing instead of me?

Like I said, I am open to you defending against your claims that states voluntarily participating in:

(1) verifying information that real-ID already has them set to verify, and then
(2) putting a "Citizen?" checkbox on IDs/DLs they will already be issuing

would be so catastrophic and analogous to the problems Real ID had in implementation.

Remember when I showed the difference between my proposal and Real ID? I mean, I did half your work for you already:



Me: It would be cool if states voluntarily put a checkbox reflecting the information they'd already be verifying.

Real ID: There were problems implementing it because some states refused to (refusals that would by definition not be present in my voluntary hypothetical) due to the cost of implementing the digital DB (which would not be present in my DL/ID hypothetical) integrations and privacy concerns, but they are all on board now and will be gathering the information from now on.

You: I can predict the future even though I can't spot a false equivalency today!

Oh no I’ve addressed it completely. I don’t care whether you acknowledge that or not. I’ve also supported my stance while you have not. I’ve outright rejected that you’ve supported your stance as you have not. And I don’t need to predict the future I’ve got a two decades long rollout illustrating what a disaster it had been. But I do enjoy the laugh I’m getting out of “well it will be different this time obviously”

And my buddy is pulling into that drive way so off to golf you are free to keep pressing your completely unsupported argument without further resistance!

 

[hog88]

Oh no I’ve addressed it completely. I don’t care whether you acknowledge that or not. I’ve also supported my stance while you have not. I’ve outright rejected that I’ve supported your stance as you have not. And I don’t need to predict the future I’ve got a two decades long rollout illustrating what a disaster it had been. But I do enjoy the laugh I’m getting out of “well it will be different this time obviously”

And my buddy is pulling into that drive way so off to golf you are free to keep pressing your completely unsupported argument without further resistance!

Your Good Buddy?

 

[whodeycin85]

What's funny is people on welfare ebt and every other government assistant. Will wait weeks and jump through hoops and do everything they can to get it. But registering to vote as a verified citizen apparently is too much of a problem for some of our higher level people.

 

[utvolpj]

What's funny is people on welfare ebt and every other government assistant. Will wait weeks and jump through hoops and do everything they can to get it. But registering to vote as a verified citizen apparently is too much of a problem for some of our higher level people.

How dare they prioritize food over voting

Unsure how that's funny but haha I guess

 

[whodeycin85]

How dare they prioritize food over voting

Unsure how that's funny but haha I guess

They gotta vote for the people who give them free stuff right???

 

[NorthDallas40]

What's funny is people on welfare ebt and every other government assistant. Will wait weeks and jump through hoops and do everything they can to get it. But registering to vote as a verified citizen apparently is too much of a problem for some of our higher level people.

Oh yeah that’s hilarious. You know what’s an absolute riot? The party of small government and fiscal responsibility advocating for more beauracy and using expedite fees to rationalize imposing limitations on a constitutional right. That’s a pure riot

 

[purp]

What could be easier? You just need to know the last 4 digits of your social security number.

How States Now Verify Citizenship with Social Security Numbers

USCIS now lets states use Social Security numbers to verify citizenship. Learn how this affects voter records and Good Moral Character for naturalization.

immigration-cafe.com

View attachment 812592

View attachment 812593

I am a big fan of a web / mobile app for voting using your social.

People cry about hackers yet are okay with people hand counting and carrying boxes full of votes in the back of their car for processing.