My conversation with a VFL

#27
#27
It doesn't surprise me at all that the players liked Kiffin much more than Dooley. It was obvious in the effort we saw on the field. That 09 team wasn't nearly as talented (minus Eric Berry) as the 2012 team,yet they made it to a bowl game. I think Kiffin is a better coach than most give him credit for.

I hate what his leaving did to our program, but everyone has a dream job and USC was his. I just can't hate him forever for taking it. Plus, if things hadn't played out the way they did we wouldn't have Butch.
 
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#30
#30
GAVol said:
I'm one of the 3 Tennessee fans that just isn't that bothered by Kiffin. Everywhere he goes, players seem to like the guy. I think we were just the victim of circumstance in that whole deal.
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Looks like one of seven.

It appears he can be a moderately successful coordinator when kept in check by a powerful pimp hand HC. IMHO, Kiffin was primarily to blame for the Ohio State loss.

sjt and a couple of others always want to blame Fulmer for the last six years. The truth is, Kiffin got his helicopters, Vol Pride, and all the rest - hoovered up every Rival 4-star + not realizing that the rest of the collegiate coaching world had actually done their homework and were navigating well clear of these guys. It turns out to be the worst recruiting class in the history of Div 1 football. With attrition at damn near 100% and two recruits that didn't fit were Taj Boyd and Bryce Petty. Oh, and the NCAA put a tent up on the Hill for a few months.

Add to that he leaves in the middle of the night, he tries to get the EEs not to go to class and follow him to SoCal, and then leaves us in a position where Mike "Hambone" Hamilton gets to make ANOTHER choice for head football coach and he quickly hires Son of Barbara (SOB) who is probably the worst football hire in the SEC in 30 years or more. I mean, Joker Phillips has something to hang his hat on thanks to Stooley.

Kiffin is hard to hate because he's just a dude, riding Daddy's coattails (as most would), and he is probably entertaining a night at the Last Lap. No one hates that guy.

However, Vol fans should remember, he completely levelled our program.
 
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#31
#31
Doyle Hargraves said:
Everyone is entitled to their own opinion of the two coaches. I am of the opinion that Dooley did infinitely more damage to the program than Kiffin ever did. Honestly speaking though, the one we all should be blaming is Hamilton because he's the one who hired both of them. It still blows my mind how you fire a longstanding coach without any solid plan in place. I mean Kiffin supposedly told Hamilton that he would leave Tennessee for USC if the job became open and he hired him anyway.
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I'm indifferent to Kiffin. But wasn't at least part of the reason we ended up with Dooley the thought of the NCAA investigation that was sparked by Kiffin? Seemed to me that no respectable coach wanted to touch the UT job for fear that hostessgate was just the tip of the iceberg.
 
#32
#32
VonVol said:
I'm indifferent to Kiffin. But wasn't at least part of the reason we ended up with Dooley the thought of the NCAA investigation that was sparked by Kiffin? Seemed to me that no respectable coach wanted to touch the UT job for fear that hostessgate was just the tip of the iceberg.
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That and signing day 11 days away. Plus big money was not available. Still paying lots of ex coaches
 
#34
#34
I recently met a famous rock star in an airport, can't say which one, and he said everything you ever heard about the women, drugs and partying is true to even a higher level than you would ever imagine.
 
#36
#36
Daniel Hood is the only person who played for all three coaches, right?

It makes sense that he would be speak highly of Kiffin as Kiffin was the person who gave him a second chance.
 
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#37
#37
VFL-82-JP said:
Absolutely agree that Hamilton has ultimate blame for the Vols Dark Ages.

Absolutely agree Dooley did more damage to the team, but that's primarily because he was allowed to continue his idiot ways for three whole years. Back to Hamilton for that.

Kiffin's damage to the program was more to tradition and pride. In my mind, you can't compare those two types of damage, they're just too different to try to equate.
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Kiffin left Dooley a seething turrd of a program. Part of that was due to the fact that he ...

first "cleaned house" with players when he came. This is normal and expected for a coach who is in at least a 3-4yr process of rebuilding. Roster depletion.

Second, he effectively cleaned house with even more when he left in the night. Some that he recruited to his vision, as expected, got shaky and re-evaluated their own careers. Further roster depletion.

Third, the coaching change in and of itself meant that his second recruiting class was snake bitten. Roster depletion in quality.

Those three things alone left Dools with a major uphill climb. Kiffin knew it but still claimed UT fans were just upset about losing his coming vision. Liar. Dooley was not capable of doing what Butch is squarely in process of ... Restoring us to prominence.
 
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#38
#38
VonVol said:
I'm indifferent to Kiffin. But wasn't at least part of the reason we ended up with Dooley the thought of the NCAA investigation that was sparked by Kiffin? Seemed to me that no respectable coach wanted to touch the UT job for fear that hostessgate was just the tip of the iceberg.
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Should have just kept Kippy as interim coach with a chance to earn the job full time if it is true that no decent coach would give us a second look. I really don't see how it could have went any worse than it did.
 
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#41
#41
TOP said:
The second sentence totally contradicts itself. He was only a prick to the media, so that's why he not only left after one year but tried to take our players with him? And you're telling me this player actually believed him that he's only a dick in the media despite it happening not only right in front of him but to the team he plays on. Makes sense to view him as "cool" knowing all of that...

I saw nothing cool about Lane other than his wife making a personal choice to paint up orange like Bruce Pearl on a daily basis. I don't know about you... but if I employed someone and I let them use my money to help build my business, only for them to turn around after one year and try to walk out the door with my clients(players), he'd hands down be the biggest p.o.s. I had ever worked with in that scenario. He literally used our money to recruit and then tried to take the players with him on our dime. How is that anything but a dick? That's a moral low ground that's generally reserved for the scummiest of business practices.
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Lots of people do it. I know lots of Chiropractors in my profession who have done it; they go down the street and open up their own place, and take the patients with them.
 
#43
#43
GAVol said:
I'm one of the 3 Tennessee fans that just isn't that bothered by Kiffin. Everywhere he goes, players seem to like the guy. I think we were just the victim of circumstance in that whole deal.
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I understood the reason that he left UT, I just didn't like it. Kiddin did have the guts to address his team before he left which is absolutely the right thing to do, and more than I can say for other coaches like Saban that lie about it to the media and team, and then show up next at the introduction press conference.
 
#44
#44
Doyle Hargraves said:
Should have just kept Kippy as interim coach with a chance to earn the job full time if it is true that no decent coach would give us a second look. I really don't see how it could have went any worse than it did.
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I said this all along, but Hamilton just panicked and hired Dooley. After Dooley's first season, I kept asking how UT ended up with this guy as our HC and why in the hell were we paying him 2.1 million a season!
 
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#45
#45
TheCubster said:
He didn't say he agreed with what he did, only that he and the team could come to terms with it and were able to move on. I personally think it was a total slap in the face and there is more than just the business side of it. He convinced families to trust their son to him and pulled the rug out from under them.
I did forget to add that he said he came to Tennessee without ever visiting it, just based on his conversations with Kiffin and staff.[/QUOTE]

Daniel Hood...he's said similar thinks on Sports Talk on his interviews
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#46
#46
GAVol said:
I'm one of the 3 Tennessee fans that just isn't that bothered by Kiffin. Everywhere he goes, players seem to like the guy. I think we were just the victim of circumstance in that whole deal.
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You 3 must not mind the probation he left the team with. Or his staff telling recruits not to go to class.
 
#47
#47
GAVol said:
I'm one of the 3 Tennessee fans that just isn't that bothered by Kiffin. Everywhere he goes, players seem to like the guy. I think we were just the victim of circumstance in that whole deal.
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100%

the world would have been better if Pete never left...our team wouldn't have gone down the toilet and the Seahawks wouldn't have become a thing
 
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#48
#48
orange parmejohn said:
You 3 must not mind the probation he left the team with. Or his staff telling recruits not to go to class.
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I don't mind this. If I was a parent of those students, I'd be glad. Them not going to class gave them a couple extra days to determine if they still wanted to attend or if his leaving changed things. Students and parents in that situation probably don't know all the rules, so informing them of what course of action they need to take when the clock is ticking is in the players and parents' best interests.
 
#49
#49
hmanvolfan said:
I recently met a famous rock star in an airport, can't say which one, and he said everything you ever heard about the women, drugs and partying is true to even a higher level than you would ever imagine.
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I'm gonna go ahead and venture a guess...

LAX?

Or LaGuardia maybe? ATL?
 
#50
#50
Two things.

The vfl didn't say what butch is from a coaching standpoint... Just that he is big on involvement.. I would have perfered to hear.. He is miles better than kiff n dools from an x n o standpoint.. IMO

The other is that hart told everyone that dools was his guy n going to keep him n hart felt he was a great coach.......but but everyone in the world says he was terrible as a hc...but people love hart.. Lol
 
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