My Broken Record: If Your QB Can't Run, You Can't Compete Now

#1
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WiseOlVol

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#1
[Unless you're Alabama. Even then, Saban's QBs run well enough. Some very well. We're not Alabama.]

A QB without wheels gives the D an extra man. JG was sold as a Dual QB. He was not. Wouldn't have taken a snap if he'd chosen Ohio State over UT. 5.2-40 speed, tops.

Yes, Manning was pretty flat-footed. But he's the GOAT. Tee won the NC with his wheels. Josh Dobbs beat Florida - even caught a 58-yard screen pass for a TD v. the Gators.

The excuse for recruiting Pro-style QBs was that the Pro-style offense brings in the best (i.e., NFL-bound) supporting cast on offense. That excuse is no longer valid. All these guys run well and (except Rodgers) started as NFL Rookies:

Aaron Rodgers
Lamar Jackson
Baker Mayfield
Kyler Murray
Joe Burrow
Tua
Mahomes
Russel Wilson
Cam
Jalen Hurts
Trubisky
Daniel Jones (Giants)
Deshaun Watson
Justin Herbert
Marcus Mariota
Robert Griffin III

Lawrence and Fields run extremely well. They'll be drafted 1 and 2.

I've lobbied to hire [Paul Johnson] and run the Wishbone. Well, perhaps that's overkill to prove the point. Although that would lock in 8 wins IMHO. Texas high schools produce >100 4.5-40 wishbone QBs every year. We could have our pick of the average passers if running the Wishbone was our platform. But I digress.

Kaidon Salter could be the guy. Elite-11 passer. Not 4.5 speed but thoroughbred athlete, throws well on the run and is particularly effective in off-schedule situations. Here's hoping he is the template we follow from now on. It's 2021 and well past time.

Coda: Harrison Bailey was thrust into a difficult situation. Lots of upside. Pulling for him.
 
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#2
#2
You’re combining able to extend plays with true runners like Lamar and Vick. If we have a qb that can just eliminate sacks and get 5-10 yards when he pulls it drastically changes the offense. Lawrence and Fields both won’t be runners in the NFL... game is too fast at that level but they will be able to extend plays and probably add 20-30 yds in the ground game on broken plays but more times than not defense will close out to make the gain negligible or no loss. Ryan T is able to run only because defenses have to sell out on Henry. Baker was a really good runner in college but isn’t considered a true threat scrambling. You’re right though that if you don’t have a qb athletic enough to scramble in college you set yourself up to lose...
 
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#4
#4
LittleVol said:
Yup. 4.3 Brady and 4.4 Manning had wheels for days.

Pure athletes
Click to expand...
To be fair, they along with Rodgers and Drew B can pick defenses apart and could get away with a sack. Theres not a lot of QB’s out there that consistently had that ability which makes them anomalies in the current game today. Just my opinion on the matter, I think Wilson is a really really good qb but if he wasn’t as mobile as he is he wouldn’t win like he has. He doesn’t process the game like Peyton or Brady.
 
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#9
#9
WiseOlVol said:
[Unless you're Alabama. Even then, Saban's QBs run well enough. Some very well. We're not Alabama.]

A QB without wheels gives the D an extra man. JG was sold as a Dual QB. He was not. Wouldn't have taken a snap if he'd chosen Ohio State over UT. 5.2-40 speed, tops.

Yes, Manning was pretty flat-footed. But he's the GOAT. Tee won the NC with his wheels. Josh Dobbs beat Florida - even caught a 58-yard screen pass for a TD v. the Gators.

The excuse for recruiting Pro-style QBs was that the Pro-style offense brings in the best (i.e., NFL-bound) supporting cast on offense. That excuse is no longer valid. All these guys run well and (except Rodgers) started as NFL Rookies:

Aaron Rodgers
Lamar Jackson
Baker Mayfield
Kyler Murray
Joe Burrow
Tua
Mahomes
Russel Wilson
Cam
Jalen Hurts
Trubisky
Daniel Jones (Giants)
Deshaun Watson
Justin Herbert
Marcus Mariota
Robert Griffin III

Lawrence and Fields run extremely well. They'll be drafted 1 and 2.

I've lobbied to hire [Paul Johnson] and run the Wishbone. Well, perhaps that's overkill to prove the point. Although that would lock in 8 wins IMHO. Texas high schools produce >100 4.5-40 wishbone QBs every year. We could have our pick of the average passers if running the Wishbone was our platform. But I digress.

Kaidon Salter could be the guy. Elite-11 passer. Not 4.5 speed but thoroughbred athlete, throws well on the run and is particularly effective in off-schedule situations. Here's hoping he is the template we follow from now on. It's 2021 and well past time.

Coda: Harrison Bailey was thrust into a difficult situation. Lots of upside. Pulling for him.
Click to expand...
Yep.. But need some better scout eyes this time
Quarterback recruit Jarrett Guarantano commits to Tennessee
 
#10
#10
I doubt any high schools in Texas run the wishbone any more. They’re all throwing the ball out of the spread.
 
#11
#11
WiseOlVol said:
I've lobbied to hire [Paul Johnson] and run the Wishbone. Well, perhaps that's overkill to prove the point. Although that would lock in 8 wins IMHO. Texas high schools produce >100 4.5-40 wishbone QBs every year. We could have our pick of the average passers if running the Wishbone was our platform. But I digress.
Click to expand...

Ok Dude, Here goes! This could be the dumbest thing I have ever read on here and that says a lot. the fact that you even talk about that offense tells everyone how little you truly understand about how offenses operate. The wishbone had its day and is over. The backside defensive players are simply too fast to leave them unblocked like it requires. They are usually as fast as the RB's and will chase them down from behind....but I digress......

What you are saying is that EVERY single offensive mind in the country knows nothing and should listen to you, a poster on Volnation! If that was a good idea do you not think at least one of the top teams would be doing it? How good does Army compete? How does GT compete? Do you see them in the hunt for a natty each year? NOPE

Put the ego and your glory days to bed and move on from that old school crap.........I know the game has!
 
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#12
#12
I have been saying this for over 20 years. There is a reason we won a national championship with Tee and not Peyton. The traditional pocket packer can still work in the NFL but college is a different animal altogether.

Only counterpoint is you can't have just a rushing QB as we saw with Dobbs. I loved Dobbs but he was a one trick pony the opposite way. Ideally, if you had a guy with Dobbs legs who had just average accuracy you could run the table.
 
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#14
#14
Hawkeye4588 said:
I have been saying this for over 20 years. There is a reason we won a national championship with Tee and not Peyton. The traditional pocket packer can still work in the NFL but college is a different animal altogether.

Only counterpoint is you can't have just a rushing QB as we saw with Dobbs. I loved Dobbs but he was a one trick pony the opposite way. Ideally, if you had a guy with Dobbs legs who had just average accuracy you could run the table.
Click to expand...
So, Michigan won the National Championship in Peyton’s senior year.....7 yards rushing for Brian Griese. Not exactly the mobile runner like Tee. TN won the championship under Tee based upon defense, not offense.

1997 (TN under Peyton)
* 4th in total offense; 14th in scoring offense
* 32nd in total defense; 32nd in scoring defense

1998 (TN under Tee)
* 32nd in total offense; 17th in scoring
* 17th in total defense; 9th in scoring defense

edit: Griese’s rushing total was for the entire season. 7yards!
 
Last edited:
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#15
#15
WiseOlVol said:
[Unless you're Alabama. Even then, Saban's QBs run well enough. Some very well. We're not Alabama.]

A QB without wheels gives the D an extra man. JG was sold as a Dual QB. He was not. Wouldn't have taken a snap if he'd chosen Ohio State over UT. 5.2-40 speed, tops.

Yes, Manning was pretty flat-footed. But he's the GOAT. Tee won the NC with his wheels. Josh Dobbs beat Florida - even caught a 58-yard screen pass for a TD v. the Gators.

The excuse for recruiting Pro-style QBs was that the Pro-style offense brings in the best (i.e., NFL-bound) supporting cast on offense. That excuse is no longer valid. All these guys run well and (except Rodgers) started as NFL Rookies:

Aaron Rodgers
Lamar Jackson
Baker Mayfield
Kyler Murray
Joe Burrow
Tua
Mahomes
Russel Wilson
Cam
Jalen Hurts
Trubisky
Daniel Jones (Giants)
Deshaun Watson
Justin Herbert
Marcus Mariota
Robert Griffin III

Lawrence and Fields run extremely well. They'll be drafted 1 and 2.

I've lobbied to hire [Paul Johnson] and run the Wishbone. Well, perhaps that's overkill to prove the point. Although that would lock in 8 wins IMHO. Texas high schools produce >100 4.5-40 wishbone QBs every year. We could have our pick of the average passers if running the Wishbone was our platform. But I digress.

Kaidon Salter could be the guy. Elite-11 passer. Not 4.5 speed but thoroughbred athlete, throws well on the run and is particularly effective in off-schedule situations. Here's hoping he is the template we follow from now on. It's 2021 and well past time.

Coda: Harrison Bailey was thrust into a difficult situation. Lots of upside. Pulling for him.
Click to expand...





1610630610654.gif
 
#17
#17
piratelifeforme said:
Ok Dude, Here goes! This could be the dumbest thing I have ever read on here and that says a lot. the fact that you even talk about that offense tells everyone how little you truly understand about how offenses operate. The wishbone had its day and is over. The backside defensive players are simply too fast to leave them unblocked like it requires. They are usually as fast as the RB's and will chase them down from behind....but I digress......

What you are saying is that EVERY single offensive mind in the country knows nothing and should listen to you, a poster on Volnation! If that was a good idea do you not think at least one of the top teams would be doing it? How good does Army compete? How does GT compete? Do you see them in the hunt for a natty each year? NOPE

Put the ego and your glory days to bed and move on from that old school crap.........I know the game has!
Click to expand...


Army and Georgia Tech will never have a full or even half roster of elite athletes due to entrance requirements. The fact they run an offense with the success they have might indicate that offense or a variant of it woild be even more successful with better athletes.

But lets just keep doi lng what everyone else is doing and increase our "recruiting" budget
 
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#18
#18
GetYouSomeofThat said:
Army and Georgia Tech will never have a full or even half roster of elite athletes due to entrance requirements. The fact they run an offense with the success they have might indicate that offense or a variant of it woild be even more successful with better athletes.

But lets just keep doi lng what everyone else is doing and increase our "recruiting" budget
Click to expand...
Georgia Tech can. They have higher standards than many schools but not necessarily higher than Notre Dame, USCw, and a few other schools that have success.

The service academies all have the same disadvantage- a 4 year commitment to serve in the military.
 
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#19
#19
piratelifeforme said:
Ok Dude, Here goes! This could be the dumbest thing I have ever read on here and that says a lot. the fact that you even talk about that offense tells everyone how little you truly understand about how offenses operate. The wishbone had its day and is over. The backside defensive players are simply too fast to leave them unblocked like it requires. They are usually as fast as the RB's and will chase them down from behind....but I digress......

What you are saying is that EVERY single offensive mind in the country knows nothing and should listen to you, a poster on Volnation! If that was a good idea do you not think at least one of the top teams would be doing it? How good does Army compete? How does GT compete? Do you see them in the hunt for a natty each year? NOPE

Put the ego and your glory days to bed and move on from that old school crap.........I know the game has!
Click to expand...

Einstein, I said WB was a bridge too far. But a 4.5-40 QB can do a lot.
 
#20
#20
WiseOlVol said:
[Unless you're Alabama. Even then, Saban's QBs run well enough. Some very well. We're not Alabama.]

A QB without wheels gives the D an extra man. JG was sold as a Dual QB. He was not. Wouldn't have taken a snap if he'd chosen Ohio State over UT. 5.2-40 speed, tops.

Yes, Manning was pretty flat-footed. But he's the GOAT. Tee won the NC with his wheels. Josh Dobbs beat Florida - even caught a 58-yard screen pass for a TD v. the Gators.

The excuse for recruiting Pro-style QBs was that the Pro-style offense brings in the best (i.e., NFL-bound) supporting cast on offense. That excuse is no longer valid. All these guys run well and (except Rodgers) started as NFL Rookies:

Aaron Rodgers
Lamar Jackson
Baker Mayfield
Kyler Murray
Joe Burrow
Tua
Mahomes
Russel Wilson
Cam
Jalen Hurts
Trubisky
Daniel Jones (Giants)
Deshaun Watson
Justin Herbert
Marcus Mariota
Robert Griffin III

Lawrence and Fields run extremely well. They'll be drafted 1 and 2.

I've lobbied to hire [Paul Johnson] and run the Wishbone. Well, perhaps that's overkill to prove the point. Although that would lock in 8 wins IMHO. Texas high schools produce >100 4.5-40 wishbone QBs every year. We could have our pick of the average passers if running the Wishbone was our platform. But I digress.

Kaidon Salter could be the guy. Elite-11 passer. Not 4.5 speed but thoroughbred athlete, throws well on the run and is particularly effective in off-schedule situations. Here's hoping he is the template we follow from now on. It's 2021 and well past time.

Coda: Harrison Bailey was thrust into a difficult situation. Lots of upside. Pulling for him.
Click to expand...

After reading your comments about lobbying to hire ( Paul Johnson ) I hereby dub thee ---- Ol Vol. Please have freak change your name on here as quickly as possible. I would be excited for any quarterback that can make good reads, pull it down and pick up yardage when the time calls for it. Bailey's speed and insticts are fine - only time will tell which of the three or four in camp gives us the best chance to win. Then the problem becomes does Pruitt lock in on the next JG ?
 
#22
#22
WiseOlVol said:
Ok. That’s 2. Add Rivers, that’s 3. Big Ben is 4. They’ll all be gone in 2 years. There are 32 teams in the NFL. Gators Trask would make 1.
Click to expand...
I think what you’re seeing now is that football coaches are wanting to put the ball in their best athletes hands on every play. So they start getting these hyper athletic kids the ball by putting them at QB at an early age. By the time they get to their Junior/Senior year in high school they’ve played so much 7 on 7 and have taken so many reps they become very fluent in reading coverages, decision making, etc... These players are so far ahead of where guys were even 10 years ago it’s unbelievable. What’s being created so much more is this sort of hybrid model that we’re seeing like a Mahomes, Josh Allen, Russel Wilson, Trevor Lawrence (maybe Fields, I‘m not sold on him yet though) who are what every team should want right now. The one thing they all have to do for longevity is be able to throw and know the offense. The legs will go away. That’s why I don‘t think Lamar Jackson will be that great forever. I don’t especially think he’s great now.
 
#23
#23
WiseOlVol said:
[Unless you're Alabama. Even then, Saban's QBs run well enough. Some very well. We're not Alabama.]

A QB without wheels gives the D an extra man. JG was sold as a Dual QB. He was not. Wouldn't have taken a snap if he'd chosen Ohio State over UT. 5.2-40 speed, tops.

Yes, Manning was pretty flat-footed. But he's the GOAT. Tee won the NC with his wheels. Josh Dobbs beat Florida - even caught a 58-yard screen pass for a TD v. the Gators.

The excuse for recruiting Pro-style QBs was that the Pro-style offense brings in the best (i.e., NFL-bound) supporting cast on offense. That excuse is no longer valid. All these guys run well and (except Rodgers) started as NFL Rookies:

Aaron Rodgers
Lamar Jackson
Baker Mayfield
Kyler Murray
Joe Burrow
Tua
Mahomes
Russel Wilson
Cam
Jalen Hurts
Trubisky
Daniel Jones (Giants)
Deshaun Watson
Justin Herbert
Marcus Mariota
Robert Griffin III

Lawrence and Fields run extremely well. They'll be drafted 1 and 2.

I've lobbied to hire [Paul Johnson] and run the Wishbone. Well, perhaps that's overkill to prove the point. Although that would lock in 8 wins IMHO. Texas high schools produce >100 4.5-40 wishbone QBs every year. We could have our pick of the average passers if running the Wishbone was our platform. But I digress.

Kaidon Salter could be the guy. Elite-11 passer. Not 4.5 speed but thoroughbred athlete, throws well on the run and is particularly effective in off-schedule situations. Here's hoping he is the template we follow from now on. It's 2021 and well past time.

Coda: Harrison Bailey was thrust into a difficult situation. Lots of upside. Pulling for him.
Click to expand...
Manning the GOAT of all QBs that ever played in the NFL? The only people who make that claim are biased UT fans. He is top 5 though
 
#25
#25
USAFgolferVol said:
Manning the GOAT of all QBs that ever played in the NFL? The only people who make that claim are biased UT fans. He is top 5 though
Click to expand...
Manning only player at any position to have more than 3 NFL MVPs. He has untouchable 5. In only 15 years. (Brady stuck at 3 in 20)
Manning only QB to be All-Pro more than 5 times. He has untouchable 7. (Brady stuck at 3)
These are individual awards, so save the Super Bowl wins argument. Note: Bart Starr 9-1 in playoffs.
Manning 3-1 v Pats in Championship Games.
Called his own plays.
He’s GOAT.
 
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