Is Barnes the Best Coach in CB right now?

[vols 30]

Record may not show it when it's all said and done, but Frank Martin is really good

Obviously, RB is a great coach. Look at what he is doing with 3 star recruits

 

[LittleCat]

Barnes has a winning record against Cal since he’s been at Tennessee.

Barnes seems to be better at getting the most out of players that wasn’t highly ranked coming out of high school.

Calipari has always had the best talent next to coach K and only has one title to show for it.

Titles are only thing that we remember decades later, but I was thinking of his resume. He is clearly a HOF coach. Won at UMass. Won at Memphis. He won for 20 years before ever getting to UK. He's been to more Final Fours than anyone since 2009. He has gotten knocked out earlier far less than the other elite coaches outside maybe Jay Wright.

If you wanna say right now, as in this season, who is doing a better job, than I would say UT. But the OP title was worded badly.

 

[LittleCat]

And just to make it clear, I love Barnes. Hated seeing UT fans rag on him the last couple years while it was clear he was still building up the program. He is obviously a great coach who knows what he is doing.

 

[cardvolfan]

Titles are only thing that we remember decades later, but I was thinking of his resume. He is clearly a HOF coach. Won at UMass. Won at Memphis. He won for 20 years before ever getting to UK. He's been to more Final Fours than anyone since 2009. He has gotten knocked out earlier far less than the other elite coaches outside maybe Jay Wright.

If you wanna say right now, as in this season, who is doing a better job, than I would say UT. But the OP title was worded badly.

It was pretty clearly stated "right now." You might want to go back and check your statement about being knocked out earlier far less. He has been knocked out all but once in the last decade. He also is the only coach in NCAA history to have all his wins aborted with two different teams.

 

[cncchris33]

Calipari and Pearl (just barely).

Coach of the year? Sure.

Overall body of work as a coach? Calipari and its not even close.

The question wasn't who has the best overall body of work, though? It was best coach in the country, right now, which you seemingly amended to just the SEC. That is why I posted the records of each coach over the past year and a half.

A touch ironic that you're riding Cal's jock right now based on your opinion of him a year ago at this time. You hated his guys and wanted to run him out on a rail last year and now he is hands down, the unquestioned best coach in the SEC?

 

[LittleCat]

The question wasn't who has the best overall body of work, though? It was best coach in the country, right now, which you seemingly amended to just the SEC. That is why I posted the records of each coach over the past year and a half.

A touch ironic that you're riding Cal's jock right now based on your opinion of him a year ago at this time. You hated his guys and wanted to run him out on a rail last year and now he is hands down, the unquestioned best coach in the SEC?

Does right now mean this year or does it mean who is the best coach currently coaching in college basketball as of today? That's what confused me. Until I read it out loud I didn't really get the phrasing.

My feelings on him are the exact same. I hate the dog and pony show every season with a new team. I still think he's really good at finding a way to organize the team every year and almost always make a good run in the NCAAT. But I'd totally be lying if I said I enjoy UK basketball. I've become dead to most college basketball anyway.

 

[LittleCat]

It was pretty clearly stated "right now." You might want to go back and check your statement about being knocked out earlier far less. He has been knocked out all but once in the last decade. He also is the only coach in NCAA history to have all his wins aborted with two different teams.

I don't really want to turn this into a Calipari thread, but your points have been countered a million times.

In 10 years, since 2009, he has more Final Fours than anyone. Maybe more Elite Eights (I'd have to check). Has he ever lost in the first round like Self, Williams, Coach K? I hate to play what-ifs, but I doubt most coaches could have kept the consistency he has had in the last decade. Titles are what matters, but it's the whole body of work that should make it obvious Calipari is a very good coach. The whole script is flipped if you change a couple plays and we win another title.

 

[Dr H Lecter]

Personally, I enjoy having a team that plays good basketball during the season. The tournament is just a cherry or lemon on top of the regular season. But I believe most people only look at the tournament and how you do there, saying basketball is a tournament sport. I got little enjoyment during Martin’s last year. I could hardly watch the season games it was so ugly. Yet many consider it a great year because of the tournament run. Watching Kentucky’s Forum, many are miserable until the team starts playing better toward the end of the year. I guess you just pick which way gives you joy.

 

[VolGee4]

Calipari’s ten year run at Kentucky would be the best run in any school’s history except for about 3-4 schools. Calipari is a very good coach people just want to lie to themselves that he isn’t because they don’t like him.

Nah, Cal is a good “coach.” But if you want to break down from there, he isn’t at the top of the list for on court coaching. I saw him at Memphis for years. Sure, it takes both players and strategic planning, but Cal’s strength is obviously getting players.

 

[zjcvols]

Nah, Cal is a good “coach.” But if you want to break down from there, he isn’t at the top of the list for on court coaching. I saw him at Memphis for years. Sure, it takes both players and strategic planning, but Cal’s strength is obviously getting players.

Does being a head coach at a division 1 school require recruiting? Yes it does. That’s his job. That’s 50% of the job. And he’s top 2 for it. You all can take away whatever the hell you want from him “oh he’s not a great floor general, he doesn’t develop” blah blah blah but he gets the results better than almost anyone in college basketball. And that’s what matters. Calipari is a top 5 coach in college basketball. It’s a fact.

 

[VolFreakJosh]

Does being a head coach at a division 1 school require recruiting? Yes it does. That’s his job. That’s 50% of the job. And he’s top 2 for it. You all can take away whatever the hell you want from him “oh he’s not a great floor general, he doesn’t develop” blah blah blah but he gets the results better than almost anyone in college basketball. And that’s what matters. Calipari is a top 5 coach in college basketball. It’s a fact.

So Barnes doesn’t get the players that Cal has yet, he’s gotten better results as if we’re at the Top in the SEC right now?

Does that make Barnes a better coach by your logic ?

 

[zjcvols]

So Barnes doesn’t get the players that Cal has yet, he’s gotten better results as if we’re at the Top in the SEC right now?

Does that make Barnes a better coach by your logic ?

No because we haven’t finished the year. Kentucky can easily win the SEC regular season title. Calipari beat Barnes in the SEC tournament despite having a higher ranked team, sounds like Calipari out coached him by your logic.

 

[VolGee4]

Does being a head coach at a division 1 school require recruiting? Yes it does. That’s his job. That’s 50% of the job. And he’s top 2 for it. You all can take away whatever the hell you want from him “oh he’s not a great floor general, he doesn’t develop” blah blah blah but he gets the results better than almost anyone in college basketball. And that’s what matters. Calipari is a top 5 coach in college basketball. It’s a fact.

You don’t have to come off arrogant. I said he’s a good coach. But your previous post said people’s views are wrong because we don’t like him. Maybe some, but he has clearly put himself in position to where he has great players and has one title to show for it. I agree with your position about players, but he doesn’t finish the deal.

Not everyone is dumb if we slightly disagree with you.

 

[VolFreakJosh]

No because we haven’t finished the year. Kentucky can easily win the SEC regular season title. Calipari beat Barnes in the SEC tournament despite having a higher ranked team, sounds like Calipari out coached him by your logic.

Barnes outcoached Cal in Knoxville and at Rupp last year despite having a team filled with a bunch of 3* players.

Imagine Barnes having Cal’s talent to work with.

 

[ttocswob]

While I think the OP's assertion is pretty silly, I can't think of a single coach in the SEC I'd trade Barnes for. He is 42-10 and 18-5 in conference over the past season and a half. So, who are you implying is currently better?

...snip...

This. Hard to argue that any coach would be a better fit for UTK at this point.

 

[LittleCat]

Barnes outcoached Cal in Knoxville and at Rupp last year despite having a team filled with a bunch of 3* players.

Imagine Barnes having Cal’s talent to work with.

Talent is subjective and we are basing it off production as teenagers in high school.

Grant and Admiral are as talented as any duo in college basketball. Just like a lot of underrated high schoolers, they would have been good regardless of who coached them. You act Barnes is coaching a team of bums lol.

 

[zjcvols]

You don’t have to come off arrogant. I said he’s a good coach. But your previous post said people’s views are wrong because we don’t like him. Maybe some, but he has clearly put himself in position to where he has great players and has one title to show for it. I agree with your position about players, but he doesn’t finish the deal.

Not everyone is dumb if we slightly disagree with you.

Because it’s a dumb argument to try and say Rick Barnes is a better coach than John Calipari. It’s simply not true.

-Calipari has made 8 S16 since Barnes last made a S16.

-Rick Barnes has one conference tournament title (back during Clinton’s presidency) Calipari has 16 in his career (6 at Kentucky).

-Barnes has ONE outright regular season conference title. Calipari has 15 (5 at Kentucky)

-Barnes has one Final Four. Calipari has 6 (one unfairly vacated, one fairly vacated)

-Barnes has 2 30 win seasons. Calipari has 10 30 win seasons (4 at Kentucky)

You can try and justify however you want about “floor general” or “developing players” or “gameplanner”. You can take the better “basketball coach”. I’ll take Calipari’s results, championships, final fours, and hang banners.

 

[wmcovol]

I don't really want to turn this into a Calipari thread, but your points have been countered a million times.

In 10 years, since 2009, he has more Final Fours than anyone. Maybe more Elite Eights (I'd have to check). Has he ever lost in the first round like Self, Williams, Coach K? I hate to play what-ifs, but I doubt most coaches could have kept the consistency he has had in the last decade. Titles are what matters, but it's the whole body of work that should make it obvious Calipari is a very good coach. The whole script is flipped if you change a couple plays and we win another title.

He lost in first round of the NIT. Does that count?

 

[zjcvols]

Barnes outcoached Cal in Knoxville and at Rupp last year despite having a team filled with a bunch of 3* players.

Imagine Barnes having Cal’s talent to work with.

Yet when it really matters Calipari beats him. Barnes wins games, but Calipari wins championships. Cal is clutch, Barnes is a choker. I think that’s fair since we are working strictly with narratives and nobody is posting stats or facts.

I can imagine Barnes with an NBA stacked team. I saw Barnes have four NBA players on his 2007 team, including one of the 25 greatest players to ever play basketball, and not win his conference or make the sweet 16

 

[VolFreakJosh]

Talent is subjective and we are basing it off production as teenagers in high school.

Grant and Admiral are as talented as any duo in college basketball. Just like a lot of underrated high schoolers, they would have been good regardless of who coached them. You act Barnes is coaching a team of bums lol.

He’s had to develop them.

Schofield was on thin ice until Barnes finally straightened him out. I remember a few posters saying that Williams didn’t deserve a scholarship when Barnes was recruiting him.

We weren’t getting all these one & done talent like UK & Duke were getting. It doesn’t make Barnes a bad recruiter, he wants specific guys that will let him coach them into the player he wants them to be.

There’s no denying Cal is good at what he does and that’s recruiting potential future NBA players where he’s able to get all of them to play together.

But if you want to talk about pure coaching, Barnes is simply a better X’s & O’s coach.

If Cal could combine his recruiting while also being a good floor coach, he could easily have 2-3 National Championships at Kentucky right now.

 

[zjcvols]

He’s had to develop them.

Schofield was on thin ice until Barnes finally straightened him out. I remember a few posters saying that Williams didn’t deserve a scholarship when Barnes was recruiting him.

We weren’t getting all these one & done talent like UK & Duke were getting. It doesn’t make Barnes a bad recruiter, he wants specific guys that will let him coach them into the player he wants them to be.

There’s no denying Cal is good at what he does and that’s recruiting potential future NBA players where he’s able to get all of them to play together.

But if you want to talk about pure coaching, Barnes is simply a better X’s & O’s coach.

If Cal could combine his recruiting while also being a good floor coach, he could easily have 2-3 National Championships at Kentucky right now.

And if Barnes could combine his coaching while also being an excellent recruiter, he could have had 2-3 national titles at Texas

 

[wmcovol]

Because it’s a dumb argument to try and say Rick Barnes is a better coach than John Calipari. It’s simply not true.

-Calipari has made 8 S16 since Barnes last made a S16.

-Rick Barnes has one conference tournament title (back during Clinton’s presidency) Calipari has 16 in his career (6 at Kentucky).

-Barnes has ONE outright regular season conference title. Calipari has 15 (5 at Kentucky)

-Barnes has one Final Four. Calipari has 6 (one unfairly vacated, one fairly vacated)

-Barnes has 2 30 win seasons. Calipari has 10 30 win seasons (4 at Kentucky)

You can try and justify however you want about “floor general” or “developing players” or “gameplanner”. You can take the better “basketball coach”. I’ll take Calipari’s results, championships, final fours, and hang banners.

Your stats are impressive but one has to consider Cal has only coached at the premier BB school in his conference the last 2stops. Barnes never has. Being in leagues with UNC, Duke, Kansas & Ky makes his win loss record pretty good. Now, I’m not saying Barnes is the better than Cal but those stats are somewhat misleading for Cal.

 

[VolFreakJosh]

Yet when it really matters Calipari beats him. Barnes wins games, but Calipari wins championships. Cal is clutch, Barnes is a choker. I think that’s fair since we are working strictly with narratives and nobody is posting stats or facts.

I can imagine Barnes with an NBA stacked team. I saw Barnes have four NBA players on his 2007 team, including one of the 25 greatest players to ever play basketball, and not win his conference or make the sweet 16

Cal arguably had the best team in 2014 with Karl Anthony Towns and lost to Wisconsin in the Final 4.

That team went 38-0.

You could easily say that Cal should have brought that team to a National Title.

 

[zjcvols]

My overall point is this: in collegiate sports you cannot separate recruiting and coaching. They’re equally important. You have to be good at both. Barnes could be better at floor game, developing players, etc. Whatever narrative you want to push. But if Calipari gets that much better recruits and gets that much better results he is still the better coach.

It’s not even a situation where it’s a program thing because Calipari’s accomplishments absolutely blow Barnes’ away by a mile. Calipari is the better coach than Barnes because he gets by far better results.

 

[cardvolfan]

You don’t have to come off arrogant. I said he’s a good coach. But your previous post said people’s views are wrong because we don’t like him. Maybe some, but he has clearly put himself in position to where he has great players and has one title to show for it. I agree with your position about players, but he doesn’t finish the deal.

Not everyone is dumb if we slightly disagree with you.

My sentiments exactly. Bottom line is, I have a number of relatives living in Kentucky who love KY basketball. With the talent that comes to Lexington annually, they're very disappointed in their performances. The guy doesn't coach to his recruiting level.