If Butch Can't...

[kiddiedoc]

Freeze inherited a very, very similar situation. He never posted a losing record and has worked his team into the top 5 nationally now. Mullen took 4 years after taking over an absolute disaster at MSU. He had a losing record the first year and none since in spite of playing in the SEC West which is unarguably the most difficult division in college football. Sumlin made his mark immediately. Arkansas is much improved. Stoops just beat USCe in his second year at Kentucky!


MOST of those situations were worse than the one Jones took over. It SHOULD NOT take 4 years before we can start expecting him to win games like last Saturday.

I am too busy to research all the statistics, but I would bet good money that neither this team has less to work with on the OL, which is crippling the offense. Not only do we have first time starters and true freshmen, we don't even have enough of them to fill the right positions in the one-deep! Let that sink in. We don't have one single competent, healthy left tackle on the roster.

 

[darn2ten]

At some point you really got to stop and wonder. So many screaming fire the OC! Really... Everything goes through CBJ. He is ultimately the big dog and certainly has a say in play calling. Especially in the red zone and late in the game. Butch was a OC from 92-97 and again from 02-04 at Central Michigan. Sure looks like he'd be making better decisions when it counts. Great recruiter, smooth talker, and gimmicks...maybe? Great SEC caliber game day coach...maybe not?

 

[oregonvol]

I am to busy to research all the statistics, but I would bet good money that neither this team has less to work with on the OL, which is crippling the offense. Not only do we have first time starters and true freshmen, we don't even have enough of them to fill the right positions in the one-deep! Let that sink in. We don't have one single competent, healthy left tackle on the roster.

Remember last year when we lost to Vanderbilt and everyone wanted to say it was all due to skill position players?

There will always be an excuse. If a coach needs talent and experience at every position to put a good product on the field, then they are not the right coach for us. Because we will never have talent and experience at every single position. As is, we have more highly ranked recruits overall than most teams in the top 25 and once again, we'll struggle to even make a bowl game.

 

[VFLinbama]

I am not saying CBJ is or isn't the guy. I am hoping he is. He can recruit like a mad man, he is a pro at the pressers, can come up with the right verbiage and optics..but what is it about his actual coaching that makes you think he is the guy? What is it about him that makes him the only one who can win here? You said "if he's not, no one is"...so, what specifically is it about his coaching and his x's and o's that you see? I am genuinely curious because I may be overlooking something you are obviously seeing

Butch can coach, plan and simple. Example, two superior talented teams last year in Georgia and South Carolina, we not only out played but both were out coached. Ask anyone. I believe in Butch. he has a vision and he bleeds Orange!!!:salute:

 

[VolFreakJosh]

I sware we could have Peyton Manning as our coach and if he would have lost to Florida this year like Jones did, everybody on Volnation would be calling for his head too. We have no patience for anything and we expect Jones to turn into Saban after barely being here almost 2 years. It's almost laughable.

 

[DERELICK_MY_VOLS]

So, we should only expect to win big games when UT had significantly better players at each position?

That's dumb, even for here.

A good coach coaches players up.
A great coach gets players to do things greater than expected.
A great recruiting/bad gameday coach brings in great classes and loses games that have no business being lost.

Which one does ut have?

Hurd fumbled the hand off in the endzone that gave Georgia the game. Worley threw an interception in the endzone that cost us at least 3 points and Peterman fumbled a hand off that may have cost us 3 points. Players have to make it happen on the field at the end of the day. Sounds like Butch had the team in positions to win games...players have to make plays and not pull Arian Fosters in key moments.

 

[landscapingvol]

They are not suggesting that he should be "replaced" just that they don't think he can get it done. So, in other words we should keep a coach who "can't" get it done.

 

[DERELICK_MY_VOLS]

I sware we could have Peyton Manning as our coach and if he would have lost to Florida this year like Jones did, everybody on Volnation would be calling for his head too. We have no patience for anything and we expect Jones to turn into Saban after barely being here almost 2 years. It's almost laughable.

People want to win yesterday....we all do. But in to his 5th game of season #2...we lose a game we should have won...we need to fire the head coach? I mean season #3 I get it...start really questioning things...but starting that many freshmen and an O-line that EVERYONE knew coming in was going to be the Achilles heel of the team...it is just insane. Don't get me wrong...if he holds onto this recruiting class...maybe closes on a couple more big time recruits that are still curious of UT...I don't think we will have anything to worry about. But if next season we are losing repeatedly...I don't blame fans for getting restless....but this early is just nuts.

And if we can manage some decent offense next season...with the defense we will be putting on the field with Tuttle and McKenzie in the mix...it should be a shut down type D.

 

[vol73]

Win here, nobody can. Butch Jones is the real deal. I understand the irrationality of this board that comes from mainly high emotional investment to the team, but after calming down, if you seriously are questioning Butch as a coach, then you might want to root for another team.

He invests way more than even most other great coaches do. He "puts up" with the fan base and media and you can tell he is constantly trying to manage even outside things. I saw in the press conference where he even said he would have a session in the spring where he will seriously teach the media the difference in what's zone read and what's not since they along with a lot of the fan base don't seem to be able to tell the difference.


My point is Butch is a superstar coach in the making. Yes, there may be certain tweaks that need to be made, but overall, he's the guy, and I will support Butch to the bitter end because his recruiting is far superior to anything we've had in the last decade or more, and he's not even winning big yet, I love his coaching and in game management philosophies and overall, he is just extremely impressive in almost every aspect on and off the field. I see the development. I see the progress being made. I think we are an offensive line from being a ranked team and a dual threat quarterback (next year, dobbs) away from being able to fully do on offense everything that we want to do.

I know the loss at Florida hurts, but Butch isn't responsible for a decade of losses, this was his second, and he had it in the bag. Just a few costly mistakes from a young football team hurt us. No excuses, it is what it is. But I didn't see a scared team Saturday like I have seen most of the last decade. We aren't scared of anyone, just less experienced and deep than everyone. But we have to keep moving forward, and I know we'll get there. And all of this coming from a guy who did not like the Butch Jones hire at the time. He has proved me wrong. He's the guy. If he's not, no one is. Let him work, and don't think to compare other coaches' time frame of success with his. He's having to do a whole lot more than just come in and coach. He's having to clean up 5 years of suck and instill and teach a winning culture that's been lost. It's coming Volnation. I promise you that. Just hang in there. Oh, and I know, tl;dr

Yeah , and a lot of people on here don't seem to do much research on the depth chart. This time last year I was looking at who we had coming in the next year for the OL. After seeing that I knew we were going to struggle this year, because you can't win with that many freshmen/inexperienced guys on the OL. It's just not possible in the SEC. Dooley is to blame for our lack of depth and experience on the OL if you look at it objectively. The funny thing is the same people who are criticizing Butch now will be praising him next year or in 2 years, once we've got the experience. Common sense goes out the window for some of these fans. Butch Jones will be winning championships in 2 to 3 years. Look at his recruiting!

 

[indian rick]

Just remember you bunch of ready for a change lug heads. If we change now; we won't be able to get another coach worth a cap again for a long time.
We got a good coach who will pay dividends in the long run. So in order to make money you have to invest for the short term to reap for the long term . So shut up your crying and put your money where your mouth is. Invest now! Celebrate in the near future.

 

[champyvol]

Remember last year when we lost to Vanderbilt and everyone wanted to say it was all due to skill position players?

There will always be an excuse. If a coach needs talent and experience at every position to put a good product on the field, then they are not the right coach for us. Because we will never have talent and experience at every single position. As is, we have more highly ranked recruits overall than most teams in the top 25 and once again, we'll struggle to even make a bowl game.

exactly, always some excuse from the pumpers. they were there for fulmer, then with dooley, now with jones. jones may turn into a great coach someday, but right now he isn't one.

 

[OrngeChkrboardVFL]

Yes, I'd say the jury is still out on Coach Jones "gameday coaching" skills, but any benefit of the doubt I had is now gone. A great coach doesn't lose a 9-0 lead with 8 mins left!

This week Spurrier was up 38 to 24 in the 4th and lost. Bama was up 14 to 3 late in the 3rd and lost. Who would be considered a great coach?

 

[MedicT]

This week Spurrier was up 38 to 24 in the 4th and lost. Bama was up 14 to 3 late in the 3rd and lost. Who would be considered a great coach?

You can't use logic on the "15%." They just want someone (anyone) FAHRED!

 

[AllforTenn]

Look kids, this is a perfect example of jumping to conclusions despite a lack of evidence. We see this type of thing far more from the coach-worshippers than from any negavol (I'm still looking for all those posts demanding Butch be fired that all the coach-worshippers keep referencing).

Fact is plenty of coaches have won here. Several have won championships here. So far, Butch hasn't shown anything to lead anyone to logically conclude that he will do the same.

On another note - is there another active head coach in college football who has a losing, winless record against both Muschamp and Dooley?

Asinine comments. I remember well Doug Dickey's first two years, and then you:loco: could recruit all the players you wanted - no limit. It takes a little time, stupid.