Get real guys!

[TGVol]

Johnny Majors and Phil Fulmer who started with better situations than Butch would have been fired before their SEC championships with that reasoning.

You just making stuff up? Below see Fulmer's full record at Tennessee. His worst years in his first 10 years were two 8-4 seasons. He had very few bad years overall (and lets count 4 or more loses as bad years for the sake of argument given we are criticizing Butch for going 9-4). Fulmer had two losing seasons at 5-6 and 5-7, one 8-5, two 8-4, and one 9-4 and that's it. All the rest of his 17 years were superb. No wonder the ugly curse has been all over this program after administration was dumb enough to fire a proven winner and UT legend.

Year Team Overall Conference Standing Bowl/playoffs Coaches# AP°
Tennessee Volunteers (Southeastern Conference) (1992–2008)
1992 Tennessee 4–0* 2–0* 3rd (Eastern)* W Hall of Fame 12 12
1993 Tennessee 10–2^ 7–1^ 2nd (Eastern) L Florida Citrus 11 12
1994 Tennessee 8–4 5–3 2nd (Eastern) W Gator† 18 22
1995 Tennessee 11–1 7–1 2nd (Eastern) W Florida Citrus 2 3
1996 Tennessee 10–2 7–1 2nd (Eastern) W Florida Citrus 9 9
1997 Tennessee 11–2 7–1 1st (Eastern) L Orange† 8 7
1998 Tennessee 13–0 8–0 1st (Eastern) W Fiesta† 1 1
1999 Tennessee 9–3 6–2 2nd (Eastern) L Fiesta† 9 9
2000 Tennessee 8–4 5–3 2nd (Eastern) L Cotton 25
2001 Tennessee 11–2 7–1 1st (Eastern) W Florida Citrus 4 4
2002 Tennessee 8–5 5–3 3rd (Eastern) L Peach
2003 Tennessee 10–3 6–2 T–1st (Eastern) L Peach 16 15
2004 Tennessee 10–3 7–1 1st (Eastern) W Cotton 15 13
2005 Tennessee 5–6 3–5 4th (Eastern)
2006 Tennessee 9–4 5–3 2nd (Eastern) L Outback 23 25
2007 Tennessee 10–4 6–2 T–1st (Eastern) W Outback 12 12
2008 Tennessee 5–7 3–5 5th (Eastern)
Total: 152–52
National championship Conference title Conference division title
†Indicates Bowl Coalition, Bowl Alliance, BCS, or CFP / New Years' Six bowl.
#Rankings from final Coaches Poll.
°Rankings from final AP Poll.

 

[Evet Vols]

You just making stuff up? Below see Fulmer's full record at Tennessee. His worst years in his first 10 years were two 8-4 seasons. He had very few bad years overall (and lets count 4 or more loses as bad years for the sake of argument given we are criticizing Butch for going 9-4). Fulmer had two losing seasons at 5-6 and 5-7, one 8-5, two 8-4, and one 9-4 and that's it. All the rest of his 17 years were superb. No wonder the ugly curse has been all over this program after administration was dumb enough to fire a proven winner and UT legend.

Year Team Overall Conference Standing Bowl/playoffs Coaches# AP°
Tennessee Volunteers (Southeastern Conference) (1992–2008)
1992 Tennessee 4–0* 2–0* 3rd (Eastern)* W Hall of Fame 12 12
1993 Tennessee 10–2^ 7–1^ 2nd (Eastern) L Florida Citrus 11 12
1994 Tennessee 8–4 5–3 2nd (Eastern) W Gator† 18 22
1995 Tennessee 11–1 7–1 2nd (Eastern) W Florida Citrus 2 3
1996 Tennessee 10–2 7–1 2nd (Eastern) W Florida Citrus 9 9
1997 Tennessee 11–2 7–1 1st (Eastern) L Orange† 8 7
1998 Tennessee 13–0 8–0 1st (Eastern) W Fiesta† 1 1
1999 Tennessee 9–3 6–2 2nd (Eastern) L Fiesta† 9 9
2000 Tennessee 8–4 5–3 2nd (Eastern) L Cotton 25
2001 Tennessee 11–2 7–1 1st (Eastern) W Florida Citrus 4 4
2002 Tennessee 8–5 5–3 3rd (Eastern) L Peach
2003 Tennessee 10–3 6–2 T–1st (Eastern) L Peach 16 15
2004 Tennessee 10–3 7–1 1st (Eastern) W Cotton 15 13
2005 Tennessee 5–6 3–5 4th (Eastern)
2006 Tennessee 9–4 5–3 2nd (Eastern) L Outback 23 25
2007 Tennessee 10–4 6–2 T–1st (Eastern) W Outback 12 12
2008 Tennessee 5–7 3–5 5th (Eastern)
Total: 152–52
National championship Conference title Conference division title
†Indicates Bowl Coalition, Bowl Alliance, BCS, or CFP / New Years' Six bowl.
#Rankings from final Coaches Poll.
°Rankings from final AP Poll.

You didn't catch what I was saying in previous posts. I was responding to someone who was saying if a coach can't win the SEC in 4 years that coach isn't "the guy". I told him by that reasoning Johnny and Phil weren't "the guys". Thanks for Phil's record in black and white. Looks nice. Too bad we fired him.

 

[Evet Vols]

Here is the post I was responding to:

 

[tennrich1]

Did you just say that lsu lost 4 games this year but didn't panic? Uh...they fired their coach this season. After less than a quarter of the year complete. And that guy by the way averaged about 9 wins a year. I think expecting Butch to win the weakest sece with the best talent we've had in a decade wasn't all that crazy. I'd say we are pretty "real"

Totally different situation. Surprised someone who knew the Win/Lose etc at LSU didn't know that. LSU and Miles hardly compares to ours....my aching back!!'

 

[TGVol]

You didn't catch what I was saying in previous posts. I was responding to someone who was saying if a coach can't win the SEC in 4 years that coach isn't "the guy". I told him by that reasoning Johnny and Phil weren't "the guys". Thanks for Phil's record in black and white. Looks nice. Too bad we fired him.

My bad - you are correct in that I did not read you post carefully enough before responding.

 

[SayNoToJorts]

Worked for Bama

Touche. Let me know when a Saban is available and willing to come to UT and I am on board slick

 

[GoVols#18]

I LIKE your attitude. I really do. I was for hanging Butch after the Sc game , so I can see how people get so angry. But - who you gonna get? Even Petrino ( he of the bad karma) lost badly at seasons end. There aint no Supercoaches out there that would come here and endure the criticism and pissin and moaning from our fans. Not gonna happen.

Chip Kelly is now looking for a job and he has dealt with all kinds of difficult fan bases.

 

[Brasszilla]

Touche. Let me know when a Saban is available and willing to come to UT and I am on board slick

exactly! saban's aren't exactly growing on trees these days. and saban is really unique really. i've seen numerous saying harbaugh is great, namely because of his success in the nfl. yet saban absolutely bombed out of the nfl and he will probably go down as one of the best college coaches ever with this run at bama. just goes to show nfl success doesn't necessarily equate to college success, just like college doesn't equate to nfl (ahem.. spurrier).

 

[tallvolball98]

Hell, in the final years of Fulmer's time, this fanbase seemed split straight down the middle; half trying to still trust him, and the other half just fed up with his excuses and passing the buck.

If you want to make a saint outta him in your mind, go ahead, but don't think every last poster here shares your admiration.

Coach Fulmer is snickering behind all our backs!

 

[CAVPUT]

Chip Kelly is now looking for a job and he has dealt with all kinds of difficult fan bases.

Butch isn't hiring a slam dunk replacement as his OC. No way no how.

 

[powerTvol]

Butch isn't hiring a slam dunk replacement as his OC. No way no how.

Birds of a feather flock together.

 

[therealitytheory]

Why did Saban go to a place coming off the NCAA microscope where everything you do is gonna be compared to a legend?

He obviously went for the dough. An obscene amount of cash for the time - 4 mil... bammers got ridiculed early on for being fiscally reckless. It wasn't too much later their favorite phrase became "worth every cent."

 

[knucklehead_vol]

those 5 happened in a 14 year period

And just think it has been almost 20 since the last.

 

[KBVol]

I think looking at history will put this into context. I get that some on here want Tennessee to be Alabama and in doing so you are asking Coach Jones to dominate at a level that Tennessee has NEVER dominated at.

In terms of the history of the SEC title Tennessee has won the second most of all teams. Tennessee last won the SEC in 1998. Yes it has been that long.

- Alabama (2016), 26 SEC titles, 12 Divisional Titles
- Tennessee (1998), 13 SEC titles, 6 Divisional Titles
- Georgia (2005), 12 SEC titles, 7 Divisional Titles
- LSU (2011), 11 SEC titles, 8 Divisional Titles
- Florida (2008), 8 SEC titles, 14 Divisional Titles
- Auburn (2013), 8 SEC titles, 8 Divisional Titles
- Ole Miss (1963), 6 SEC titles, 1 Divisional Title
- Kentucky (1976), 2 SEC titles, 0 Divisional Titles
- Mississippi State (1941), 1 SEC Title, 1 Divisional Title
- Arkansas (Never), 0 SEC titles, 4 Divisional Titles
- Missouri (Never), 0 SEC titles, 2 Divisional Titles
- South Carolina (Never), 0 SEC titles, 1 Divisional Title
- Texas A&M (Never), 0 SEC titles, 0 Divisional Titles
- Vanderbilt (Never), 0 SEC titles, 0 Divisional Titles

The SEC Conference Championship game was started in 1993. Since that time the #of appearances are as follows:

- Florida 12
- Alabama 11
- LSU, Auburn, Georgia and Tennessee all with 5
- Arkansas 3
- Missouri 2
- Mississippi State 1
- South Carolina 1

The 5 appearances for Tennessee were from 1997-2007 with wins in 1997 and 1998. In the last 10 years, 5 different teams have won the east, Tennessee (1), Florida (4), Georgia (2), Missouri (2) and South Carolina (1). During that same time frame 3 different teams have won the west, Auburn (2), LSU (2), Alabama (6). The rep from the east has not won the title game since 2008.

In the last 31 years, the SEC title has been won by 6 different SEC teams (Tennessee, Florida and Georgia from the east and Alabama, Auburn and LSU from the west).

In that 31 year period:

- Tennessee has won the SEC outright only 4 times (1985, 1990, 1997 and 1998). We claimed a shared title in 1989 with Alabama and Auburn.
- Alabama has won 7 plus the tie in 1989, 5 of those are with Saban.
- Florida has won 8 (most of those were with Spurrier and when the East dominated the west)
- Auburn has won 4 + a couple of ties
- LSU has won 5 with a couple of ties (2 of the wins were with Saban)
- Georgia has won 2

I don't see anybody asking Jones to "dominate" anything.....simply win the bad DIVISION that he was overwhelmingly favorited to win. Just get to SECCG, no expectation to win it. Not sure how that's "dominating" and it's surely not unreasonable for Jones or any Tennessee coach after 4 seasons.

 

[Evet Vols]

I don't see anybody asking Jones to "dominate" anything.....simply win the bad DIVISION that he was overwhelmingly favorited to win. Just get to SECCG, no expectation to win it. Not sure how that's "dominating" and it's surely not unreasonable for Jones or any Tennessee coach after 4 seasons.

Like I told UTK - Johnny Majors and Phil Fulmer couldn't get it done in 4 years and Butch came in to a worse situation. I wonder if Butch wishes he hadn't turned it around so quick?

 

[bignewt]

Did you just say that lsu lost 4 games this year but didn't panic? Uh...they fired their coach this season. After less than a quarter of the year complete. And that guy by the way averaged about 9 wins a year. I think expecting Butch to win the weakest sece with the best talent we've had in a decade wasn't all that crazy. I'd say we are pretty "real"

And hired a career assistant. In a few years they will be crying about why in the hell did they ever fire Miles.

 

[IknoxvolsI]

It's not just Saban! Look at last years Oklahoma and Florida losses then couple that with the down spiral this year. That's what we have with Butch!

 

[BeecherVol]

Like I told UTK - Johnny Majors and Phil Fulmer couldn't get it done in 4 years and Butch came in to a worse situation. I wonder if Butch wishes he hadn't turned it around so quick?

Jones is still trying to figure out Muschamp and getting back above .500 against Vandy.

Until he manages the lesser of Fulmers accomplishments in winning the division (which Fulmer did the year before he got fired) he's just "better than Dooley".

 

[Evet Vols]

It's not just Saban! Look at last years Oklahoma and Florida losses then couple that with the down spiral this year. That's what we have with Butch!

Downward spiral? 9 wins again - beat Georgia for 2nd time in a row and Florida for first time in more than a decade. Beat a Big 10 team in a bowl for 3rd year in a row. GO VOLS!

 

[jakez4ut]

Here is the post I was responding to:

that post said to win the SEC E, not the SEC Title.

Like I told UTK - Johnny Majors and Phil Fulmer couldn't get it done in 4 years and Butch came in to a worse situation. I wonder if Butch wishes he hadn't turned it around so quick?

Johnny took over a pretty rough situation after Battle. debatable as to which was worse, but Johnny didn't walk in to a program ready to win.

PHil, on the other hand....stepped in when things were humming pretty good. butch got a dumpster fire no doubt.

but is the standard simply "be better than the worst ever"?

The SEC E hasn't been good in a hot minute...and the last two years in particular, we allowed CJM and FL to win it, when it was every bit out there for us to do.

i think there's a disconnect for some when talking about what's really expected. there are many here that would consider me to be a negavol, but the reality is my expectations are/were pretty simple....while FL and GA are in transition, and while we've got the most talented roster we've had in a decade, returning 18 starters in a season where GA has a 1st year coach, FL has an offense starting a Purdue retread, and questions everywhere on offense, USCe has a 1st year coach, MO has a 1st year coach, and you beat GA and FL in the same season........

go to ATL and get your butt kicked by Bama. that was my expectation.

instead, i ihave to settle for getting my butt kicked by Vandy.:banghead2:

 

[Evet Vols]

Jones is still trying to figure out Muschamp and getting back above .500 against Vandy.

Until he manages the lesser of Fulmers accomplishments in winning the division (which Fulmer did the year before he got fired) he's just "better than Dooley".

He will win the SEC. Have some patience. Unfortunately this year we lost our Defensive Tackles, Linebackers, star Corner Back and our "star" running back turned out to be a fruit loop.

 

[Evet Vols]

that post said to win the SEC E, not the SEC Title.

Johnny took over a pretty rough situation after Battle. debatable as to which was worse, but Johnny didn't walk in to a program ready to win.

PHil, on the other hand....stepped in when things were humming pretty good. butch got a dumpster fire no doubt.

but is the standard simply "be better than the worst ever"?

The SEC E hasn't been good in a hot minute...and the last two years in particular, we allowed CJM and FL to win it, when it was every bit out there for us to do.

i think there's a disconnect for some when talking about what's really expected. there are many here that would consider me to be a negavol, but the reality is my expectations are/were pretty simple....while FL and GA are in transition, and while we've got the most talented roster we've had in a decade, returning 18 starters in a season where GA has a 1st year coach, FL has an offense starting a Purdue retread, and questions everywhere on offense, USCe has a 1st year coach, MO has a 1st year coach, and you beat GA and FL in the same season........

go to ATL and get your butt kicked by Bama. that was my expectation.

instead, i ihave to settle for getting my butt kicked by Vandy.:banghead2:

I agree Phil took over when UT was good and still couldn't win the East in 4 years. There wasn't a SEC East when Majors took over but didn't win the SEC in 4 or 5 or 6 or 7 or ....

Anyways people's memories are short and forget how bad TN was and Butch turned it around and is now in contention without the problems Ole Miss has.

 

[BeecherVol]

He will win the SEC. Have some patience. Unfortunately this year we lost our Defensive Tackles, Linebackers, star Corner Back and our "star" running back turned out to be a fruit loop.

You can have patience. I ll stick with him being a mediocre coach that can't win a bad division.

He wasn't winning the conference with everyone available an in their right mind.

 

[BeecherVol]

I agree Phil took over when UT was good and still couldn't win the East in 4 years. There wasn't a SEC East when Majors took over but didn't win the SEC in 4 or 5 or 6 or 7 or ....

Anyways people's memories are short and forget how bad TN was and Butch turned it around and is now in contention without the problems Ole Miss has.

Yeah short and selective. They also forget Fulmer was losing the division to Spurrier and later Meyer and not Jim McElwain that just got beat by 40 in the championship game.

 

[jakez4ut]

I agree Phil took over when UT was good and still couldn't win the East in 4 years. There wasn't a SEC East when Majors took over but didn't win the SEC in 4 or 5 or 6 or 7 or ....

Anyways people's memories are short and forget how bad TN was and Butch turned it around and is now in contention without the problems Ole Miss has.

no, the memories are just fine. it's just a matter of where you find yourself in a given season. and there's no debating the position we had in front of us in both of the last two years. context still matters in a given season.


you beat FL and GA in the same season, there's no reason not to expect to win the East THAT year, no matter what year you're in, in your tenure.