Game Thread: #11 Lady Vols at #18 Fla St; Thurs Nov 9, 6PM

[DarkPhoenix]

Anyone think this tweet with this accountability would have happened a year ago at this time?
While we obviously wouldn't have been close without her, there's another play besides the last missed shot that I believe hurt us first and most. The missed chippie followed by the frustration foul was a big blow. Wouldn't have needed the last second shot without that. Of course there were many missed layups and unwise fouls before and as always, RJ was spectacular to watch. She'll bounce back.


It's a point of emphasis this year after things got so out of hand last year. They were warned. In the LSU loss, the refs were having a chat w Angel within the first 3 mins of the game and she shut her act down. And yes, it was a friendly reminder and not a tech.

BC it's so wildly uncharacteristic of Tess (only Edie getting one for taunting would surprise me more) I rewatched closely. Almost every urban legend going around on that play is wrong.

Tess actually did deserve the T, she only got routinely hacked on the arm and went right in the FSU players face with a purpose. I think it stemmed fm a play earlier where Tess bumped Bonner pretty hard accidently, offered her hand to help her up and got rejected and got the stink eye to boot. Whatever, Tess must have had an out of body experience bc it was so very unlike her to in-the-face taunt.

Also, that play was not really a momentum killer. We swapped fts and it cut the lead to 3, but we built it back to 5 or 6 early in the 4th qtr.



And for the last myth buster, Tess did not get taken right out; in fact, she played the remaining 2 mins or so of the 3rd and 3 or 4 mins of the 4th before being subbed out by Sara. So she was not being punished. While KJH is strict about those things and it certainly was a big mistake, it's the first time Tess has done anything remotely like this. I'm sure she is punishing herself enough.

She’s doing what a leader does and I’m proud of her for that. I would say that’s a positive, because she knows she’s the player that needs to lead us to the promise land. I loved seeing her be aggressive and wanting the ball, that’s one thing I said she should do, and wasn’t the case last year. If she has to take 25 shots a game for us to win, I’m good with that.

 

[mudcat1973]

I think she may have stayed in longer if she hadn't got that technical for taunting. I would have overlooked it Kellie seldom overlooks anything like that as she took her out and we didn't see her again.

Yes Tess needs play with fire but but let it get out of control. If she need to yell she should have yell at her team mates let's go.

 

[Knoxvol14]

Defense wins championships our offense looked lost a lot last night especially end of quarter situations . Ill take a great defense up 3 with 30 seconds to go versus a great offense half the time any day.

Does it still though? The championship game last year had 187 total points. Most definitely offense won the championship last year.

 

[Golfteacher]

I like your optimism but you’ll come around after the Indiana, Notre Dame and Ohio State games.

Let us not throw them down the toilet just yet, lets see this thing play out. Like most Lady Vol fans I am disappointed with the loss but not ready to throw in the towel. It was a good game played by two very good teams. Sadly, we haven't learned to defend the three since the original Lassie was a pup. We have to be more physical and defend the paint better. As I said before, we need Key to protect the rim. She is the best one at doing that on the team.

 

[madtownvol]

Only the "stars" and NIL champs get to do in-your-face taunting without repercussions from refs.

When they do it, it becomes viral ESPN highlights and is called "moving the game forward."

C'est la vie.

Spot on. Angel Reese or Catlin Clarke do that kind of stuff all the time and its showing "competitive spirit."

 

[madtownvol]

Church league coaches would have called a time out and not take it to the locker room with her/his team down 1. That's obvious , just as that church league coach or whoever the hell your referencing would NOT have played zone up 3 after a team lit them up for 10 three pointers previously. Man up and live with a 2 pointer then get fouled and win the game at the free throw line.

If Rickea hits that shot, then you don;'t complain about church league. Lots of elite coaches will close out a game without taking a time when they have the full shot clock to work with. Not taking the timeout doesn't let the defense get set.

The LVs got the exact shot (Rickear low in the post) they wanted and they would not likely gotten a better shot on an in-bounds play.

Sometimes teams just lose close games and it is not necessarily an indictment of the coaching staff.

Second half defense was better. The LVs were just too slow in their rotations in that first quarter. Could be a mix of fatigue and limited prep time but they made an adjustment.

 

[JohnnyPayne]

^agreed. This feels like when football lost to Florida this year and half of the board was saying Heupel isn’t the guy. If the shot goes in, no complaints. Sports.

 

[madtownvol]

Tess actually did deserve the T, she only got routinely hacked on the arm and went right in the FSU players face with a purpose. I think it stemmed fm a play earlier where Tess bumped Bonner pretty hard accidently, offered her hand to help her up and got rejected and got the stink eye to boot. Whatever, Tess must have had an out of body experience bc it was so very unlike her to in-the-face taunt.

Also, that play was not really a momentum killer. We swapped fts and it cut the lead to 3, but we built it back to 5 or 6 early in the 4th qtr.

And for the last myth buster, Tess did not get taken right out; in fact, she played the remaining 2 mins or so of the 3rd and 3 or 4 mins of the 4th before being subbed out by Sara. So she was not being punished. While KJH is strict about those things and it certainly was a big mistake, it's the first time Tess has done anything remotely like this. I'm sure she is punishing herself enough.

I loved Tess showing some aggression,. I would bet the house, she had been getting an earful of trash talk and when she beat Gordon in the drive to the hoop, I think she was letting her know, hey "you can't guard me."

It is worth noting that Tess missed the FT (so only two points), FLST only made of the two tech shots and then turned the ball over on the next possession, so the net gain for the LVs from the whole escapade was 1 pt. (versus 2 or 3 if no tech and Tess makes the FT).

Was that the game changing play? I mean in a one-point game any play could have been the game changer.

But, it was a great game. It was a joy to watch RJ and the LV offense looking pretty formidable. I think FLST is going to be another team that proves to be better than its pre-season ranking.

 

[37620VOL]

This could be a very successful team if they can achieve just average sec defense while keeping the offensive talent on the court.

 

[LadyViking/Vol]

I have watched several games already including the Lady Vols in this early start of this basketball season.. I doubt any team this year goes undefeated with the talented teams ( including the Lady Vols) that are out there this year.. I watched the game against Florida State last night .. the key to that loss was the lack of defending the three ball especially with a team that got truly hot .. I was excited to see the offense get going and how they came back from a 14 point deficit.. proved they can put it all together .. truly excited to see how this team evolves and improves as the season goes along .. As I agree with most of you on this message board , defense has to improve .. only way to win championships for sure! I’ve been a Lady Vol fan for close to 40 years .. and always will be .. win or lose .. I have faith in these young ladies and look forward to a successful season ! Go Lady Vols!!

 

[glv98]

It is worth noting that Tess missed the FT (so only two points), A&M only made of the two tech shots and then turned the ball over on the next possession, so the net gain for the LVs from the whole escapade was 1 pt. (versus 2 or 3 if no tech and Tess makes the FT).

Was that the game changing play? I mean in a one-point game any play could have been the game changer.

Right. Which is why I said it was a myth that the tech sapped our mo. LOL who knew Tess was secretly a badass!

The LVs were just too slow in their rotations in that first quarter. Could be a mix of fatigue and limited prep time but they made an adjustment.

But we've been slow on the rotations for years, and it's many players with differing levels of speed, quickness or lack thereof. Same with staying in front of players. It's everyone, regardless perceived athleticism. I do agree that offenses have spread the floor and there's so many good shooters now. But it still seems like disasterous D happens way too often to us.

But, it was a great game. It was a joy to watch RJ and the LV offense looking pretty formidable. I think A&M is going to be another team that proves to be better than its pre-season ranking.

If by A&M you mean State, yeah I thought they were really good. Also, they had some added urgency bc this was their coach just back fm cancer surg. Credit and blessings to her.

 

[Harpethriverkid63]

This could be a very successful team if they can achieve just average sec defense while keeping the offensive talent on the court.

Average SEC defense won’t do it. A lockdown, block out at every cost defense will win more games. Offenses can and most likely do have stretches in games where nothing falls, regardless of where the shots are taken. Offense can go cold. A defense should never.

 

[brassie]

If that's the reason Tennessee kept Darby out, I would wholly disagree with it. I'm not saying my opinion counts beyond my own nose, but that seems an absolutely archaic and stubborn reaction - especially if the tone afterward was "you could have helped the team but your actions kept you on the bench." She made the mistake, she got the technical, the penalty was assessed, so keep playing. Heaven forbid they show a little fire fighting their way back into the game.

I don't think anyone outside the team knows why she was benched. With that said . . .

Pulling a player as punishment for a bad mistake can be a good teaching tool. However, when the game is on the line it would seem that winning trumps teaching every time. A coach should be able to get their point across in a different way.

 

[madtownvol]

Average SEC defense won’t do it. A lockdown, block out at every cost defense will win more games. Offenses can and most likely do have stretches in games where nothing falls, regardless of where the shots are taken. Offense can go cold. A defense should never.

Yes, the LVs are going to have to defend better but offenses are on the rise in WCBB. LSU gave up 92 to Colorado. Of course, LSU as defending champs are going to get the benefit of the doubt but the point remains that the game has changed since CPS peak years and when Vivian Stringer's Rutgers could win 17-6 or whatever.


Not many teams in the top 20 or going to get locked downed. Let's look at Florida St., we lacked the athletes and discipline to close down the three point shooters and we could not stop them from getting to the rim.

So, why was it a one point game that LVs missed winning by friendly bounce on the rim-- because Florida could not close out our three point shooters or stop us from getting into the paint.

Historically, the LVs have been slow to find any offensive rhythm but were better defensively. This season seems to be the opposite (as it is for a lot of ranked teams). Defense, when teams can spread you out, is about coordination, timing, and switching,. That will come around.

 

[37620VOL]

Average SEC defense won’t do it. A lockdown, block out at every cost defense will win more games. Offenses can and most likely do have stretches in games where nothing falls, regardless of where the shots are taken. Offense can go cold. A defense should never.

This team is not capable of that. It will have to look more like the Vols 2022 football team.

 

[glv98]

I don't think anyone outside the team knows why she was benched. With that said . . .

Pulling a player as punishment for a bad mistake can be a good teaching tool. However, when the game is on the line it would seem that winning trumps teaching every time. A coach should be able to get their point across in a different way.

Again, Tess wasn't "benched". Nor punished, that we know of. The T happened late in the 3rd qtr. Tess finished the qtr and played the early part of the 4th before being subbed by Sara. If she was being "pulled", she never would have gone back in to start the 4th qtr.

 

[Deebowbear]

I don't think anyone outside the team knows why she was benched. With that said . . .

Pulling a player as punishment for a bad mistake can be a good teaching tool. However, when the game is on the line it would seem that winning trumps teaching every time. A coach should be able to get their point across in a different way.

Why pull a player that helped score to bring the team back. she was hot then bring slow Puckett in and why was wells not playing much thought she was a difference maker at point. Also why does Jordan go in the forest with her size to shoot

 

[Deebowbear]

Why pull a player that helped score to bring the team back. she was hot then bring slow Puckett in and why was wells not playing much thought she was a difference maker at point. Also why does Jordan go in the forest with her size to shoot

Meant Powell sorry

 

[glv98]

Why pull a player that helped score to bring the team back. she was hot then bring slow Puckett in and why was wells not playing much thought she was a difference maker at point. Also why does Jordan go in the forest with her size to shoot

For the 3rd time, and just one lil post above yours, Tess WAS NOT PULLED!!! That is incorrect. She played about 5 or 6 more mins, crossing over a quarter break, after the hoopla.

Also regarding Wells/Powell, Wells (and Spear) were getting killed on D, even moreso than everyone else. JP actually played good on ball D most of the time the second half. Generally I agree Wells runs the O better, but she was a bit overwhelmed last night. Eventually I think she'll be fine but it's going to take a min for her to adjust to this level.

As far as JP in the forest, so far this season she's been better about that and in fact got a very nice basket off it last night. I really think she and Wells are going to be a good combo.

 

[Volfan2012]

If we could get just a little better on defense say hold elite teams to 75 then were going to win many of the games cause doubt there will be many games where we score less than 75

 

[volnationnj]

If we could get just a little better on defense say hold elite teams to 75 then were going to win many of the games cause doubt there will be many games where we score less than 75

While the offense certainly looks improved, the fast pace of the Florida St game contributed to the high score.
It will be interesting to see what the scores are in 4 game streak, starting later this month, against what will probably be all ranked teams.

 

[DarkPhoenix]

If we could get just a little better on defense say hold elite teams to 75 then were going to win many of the games cause doubt there will be many games where we score less than 75

The thing is we are very small at Pg and have some slow footed players, so I’m not sure what else u can do with this roster defensively.

 

[glv98]

The thing is we are very small at Pg and have some slow footed players, so I’m not sure what else u can do with this roster defensively.

Size and speed don't seem to have much effect on our defensive success. Everyone gets blown by and no one can close on a 3.

I think somethings wrong w the scheme.

 

[VA_VOLFAN]

Size and speed don't seem to have much effect on our defensive success. Everyone gets blown by and no one can close on a 3.

I think somethings wrong w the scheme.

A better team defense would help. Scheme would def help personnel while i'm usually more on the positive beat. Our defense also is marshmallow soft in the post. I saw multiple post players not even be physical. I even saw one not even go toward the rebound or step over to try and get a block. Until people step up there we won't be anywhere near our potential.

 

[Golfteacher]

Really hard for me to accept that our offense was lost since we scored 91 and shot 50 percent from both the field overall and the three point line. I can concede the defense is not very good. The end of the quarter situations you have to run it down to ten seconds and hope you get a decent shot as you can't allow time for them to get up another shot. We need to work on what were going to do in that 10 seconds cause those were bad possessions.

Our offense is fine but the defense needs a lot of work. We have to learn how to guard against the three and learn how to guard the paint when playing woman to woman defense. On offense we need to set better picks and we need to control the rim on both offense and defense. Sadly, some of our players are not quick or fast enough to guard quick and speedy players in woman to woman defense. That is a coaching recognition issue.