FWIW, last yrs Tennessee team lost @vandy

[volbeast33]

To me it has more to do with the insane love that some seem to have for him....if it wasn't for them I would barely know where he coaches. He only coached here for three yrs and had pretty much run what Bruce Pearl had built into the ground. If by the grace of God Stokes decided to stay to save him that is the only way that this season wouldn't have hit Auburn from the past few seasons type of level....

I'm not sold at all on CDT's recruiting and have complained numerous times about it. The one thing he does better than Zo is that he seems to have a better eye guys and recruits much better for his system....CDT has shown to me be the better floor coach but if in yr 3-4 he shows that he can't bring in the necessary talent to win at a high level then I will be ready to move on to the next guy....Most can't look past comparing individual seasons and look at the big picture....Zo was not building a solid program and that's what it's all about.

 

[BigZiti09]

Not only did he run a clean program for 3 years, Cuonzo was also the third winning-est coach not name Billy Donovan or Jon Calipari. His style was often boring, he dropped hewd scratching losses, and a lot of times seemed unmotivated. But still. He won 19+ games every year and did it without any suspensions or NCAA violations.

That "third winning-est" stat is true but a bit misleading. I ran the numbers on it last year. There's UK and FL and then everyone else. There's a log jam behind those front two and Cuonzo had a slightly better winning %.

I have my doubts as to whether that 3rd place % would hold beyond year 3.

 

[volbeast33]

That "third winning-est" stat is true but a bit misleading. I ran the numbers on it last year. There's UK and FL and then everyone else. There's a log jam behind those front two and Cuonzo had a slightly better winning %.

I have my doubts as to whether that 3rd place % would hold beyond year 3.

Yeah it was going to drop like a rock which is one of the reasons he left.

 

[VolsSportsFan]

To me it has more to do with the insane love that some seem to have for him....if it wasn't for them I would barely know where he coaches. He only coached here for three yrs and had pretty much run what Bruce Pearl had built into the ground. If by the grace of God Stokes decided to stay to save him that is the only way that this season wouldn't have hit Auburn from the past few seasons type of level....

I'm not sold at all on CDT's recruiting and have complained numerous times about it. The one thing he does better than Zo is that he seems to have a better eye guys and recruits much better for his system....CDT has shown to me be the better floor coach but if in yr 3-4 he shows that he can't bring in the necessary talent to win at a high level then I will be ready to move on to the next guy....Most can't look past comparing individual seasons and look at the big picture....Zo was not building a solid program and that's what it's all about.

Who has insane love for him? At most it's 3 people, and I've not heard jack for weeks about it.

I'm much more annoyed at the idiots who have to remind us each week and especially after a loss how they really want Pearl back and how we "shoulda got him instead of Tyndall.", and those far outnumber any Martin lovers.

 

[volbeast33]

Who has insane love for him? At most it's 3 people, and I've not heard jack for weeks about it.

I'm much more annoyed at the idiots who have to remind us each week and especially after a loss how they really want Pearl back and how we "shoulda got him instead of Tyndall.", and those far outnumber any Martin lovers.

I don't join in on any of that unless it's to reply back like I did right then.... I don't mind the conversation involving past coaches but the things that do bother me I ignore and don't reply too...it killse the people talking about SD but they are the ones keeping the convo going by replying back to him.

 

[SGMVols]

And in Cuonzo's first year the team lost to Austin Peay at home.

But beat Florida twice and also beat defending national champion UCONN. DT hasn't claimed a scalp anywhere near that big, and won't this year unless he miraculously stuns UK.

 

[volbeast33]

But beat Florida twice and also beat defending national champion UCONN. DT hasn't claimed a scalp anywhere near that big, and won't this year unless he miraculously stuns UK.

That's definitely true.....that was the one thing I feel like went against Zo that wasn't his fault.....he never had any....can't believe we just won that game type of victories....Neither Florida nor UCONN was great when we beat them. His biggest win was probably Virginia but it wasn't a name team like the others....CDT prob won't have any this yr either but Pearl had several that come to mind.

 

[CAVol]

Everyone sure celebrated like Florida and Uconn were great when we beat them.

 

[VolsSportsFan]

I think it's clear that a valid criticism of Martin is for whatever reason he can't get his team playing consistent until the last month or so of the season.

He did it all 3 seasons at UT and currently is doing it again right now at Cal. After being left for dead Cal has now won 5 straight.

Had he been able to even win 2-3 more earlier games each season, he would have made the NCAAT all 3 seasons and we wouldn't be having this conversation at all.

 

[volbeast33]

Everyone sure celebrated like Florida and Uconn were great when we beat them.

I can't speak for everyone else....I was at the UCONN game and enjoyed the win thoroughly but UCONN wasn't their beat team and I didn't walk into the stadium thinking we couldn't win....It's just a different level if u don't think u have a chance and can't believe that we won the game.

 

[volbeast33]

I think it's clear that a valid criticism of Martin is for whatever reason he can't get his team playing consistent until the last month or so of the season.

He did it all 3 seasons at UT and currently is doing it again right now at Cal. After being left for dead Cal has now won 5 straight.

Had he been able to even win 2-3 more earlier games each season, he would have made the NCAAT all 3 seasons and we wouldn't be having this conversation at all.

We would be soon bc the talent level was dropping significantly here at Tennessee.
There are a lot of comparisons there....the PAC 12 has become almost as bad as what the SEC was when he was here.

 

[VolsSportsFan]

We would be soon bc the talent level was dropping significantly here at Tennessee.
There are a lot of comparisons there....the PAC 12 has become almost as bad as what the SEC was when he was here.

Maybe, maybe not. I believe Stokes would have stayed his senior year had he come back and I'd like to have some of the guys that left. And like I said, the opinion of him would be different.

 

[volbeast33]

Maybe, maybe not. I believe Stokes would have stayed his senior year had he come back and I'd like to have some of the guys that left. And like I said, the opinion of him would be different.

Probably so......but The NIT trips didn't have anything to do with my opinion of him.....I really think he was going to be like Devoe....good enough to not get fired but not good enough to do anything special.

 

[VolsSportsFan]

Probably so......but The NIT trips didn't have anything to do with my opinion of him.....I really think he was going to be like Devoe....good enough to not get fired but not good enough to do anything special.

Possibly so but like I said, had he made the NCAA all 3 years, it would be very hard to not like him. He wasn't a jerk like Jerry Green.

 

[volbeast33]

Possibly so but like I said, had he made the NCAA all 3 years, it would be very hard to not like him. He wasn't a jerk like Jerry Green.

Probably to most but I look at the big picture and the most important thing is a coach that can build a program....jerry Green was decent a coaching another coaches recruits but it was getting ready to end....I saw a lot of the same qualities in Zo......McRae, Maymon, and even stokes to a lesser degree was helped by circumstances.....we basically only got production from our starting five during our sweet sixteen run bc Zo was so poor at identifying talent to fit in his system with no back up plan whatsoever if Stokes decided to leave early.

 

[Daloth]

Maybe, maybe not. I believe Stokes would have stayed his senior year had he come back and I'd like to have some of the guys that left. And like I said, the opinion of him would be different.

Stokes wouldn't have stayed for anyone short of Phil Jackson, and he'd have been dumb to.

 

[volbeast33]

Stokes wouldn't have stayed for anyone short of Phil Jackson, and he'd have been dumb to.

I agree....he was ready to go......would loves to have had him though

 

[oryankees]

He fiinished above preseason expectations each year and a made a Sweet 16 and almost Elite Eight. He had a coupleof five stars. I hope CDT can match those or surpass them. He hasn't shown he can or will yet though . Its not so much sticking up for Zo as it is correcting inaccuracies and hypocritical statements. CDT has worse o and has done worse recruiting. The two biggest complaints against Martin. Yet people keep bashing Martin in comparison to someone who he out performed up to the same point in their tenures.

I understand that people like him and say he was a good coach because we got to the Sweet 16 and we won 20 games 2 out of the 3 years he was here, and he got 2 5 stars. But besides that, what did he do?

In our 2 NIT Tournaments we had BAD losses at home, in the first and second rounds to teams we shouldn't have lost to. Besides getting Hubbs and Stokes, he got Richardson and Moore and those are the only decent players he recruited to Tennessee out of the 13 total players in his signing classes who actually qualified to get on campus.

When Cuonzo got the job he already had Jordan McRae, Cam Tatum, Trae Golden, Jeronne Maymon, and later got Jarnell Stokes because he wanted to play immediately instead of waiting until the next school year like he would've had to do if he went to Memphis. That is a MUCH better starting lineup in terms of talent then what Tyndall has to work with right now. When Tyndall got here, he had 4 scholarship players returning and he basically rebuilt the ENTIRE roster with Freshmen and JUCO's in about a month or 2 which is incredible.

Now in Cuonzo's first year we lost to Austin Peay, Oakland, and College of Charleston then barely beat ETSU and UNC Asheville towards the end of out of conference play. I think our worst loss this year is what... Mississippi State?

 

[OrangeBalls]

But beat Florida twice and also beat defending national champion UCONN. DT hasn't claimed a scalp anywhere near that big, and won't this year unless he miraculously stuns UK.

As others have stated, UCONN wasn't that great. Fla were his best wins. Tyndall's wins over Butler and Ark have the chance to be as good as those wins.

 

[OrangeBalls]

I think it's clear that a valid criticism of Martin is for whatever reason he can't get his team playing consistent until the last month or so of the season.

He did it all 3 seasons at UT and currently is doing it again right now at Cal. After being left for dead Cal has now won 5 straight.

Had he been able to even win 2-3 more earlier games each season, he would have made the NCAAT all 3 seasons and we wouldn't be having this conversation at all.

Bingo. We'd get behind the 8 ball by losing in Dec and Jan and then have to scratch and claw to even get back on the bubble.

 

[VolsSportsFan]

Bingo. We'd get behind the 8 ball by losing in Dec and Jan and then have to scratch and claw to even get back on the bubble.

Plus the notion that he wasn't supported I take issue with. His first 2 seasons especially, the last month of the season TBA was pretty rocking. I still remember the atmosphere at the Vandy game in 2012 and Missouri in 2013 and both times the place was going crazy at the end.

His last season when it started out the same way is when fans started to sour.

 

[OrangeBalls]

Plus the notion that he wasn't supported I take issue with. His first 2 seasons especially, the last month of the season TBA was pretty rocking. I still remember the atmosphere at the Vandy game in 2012 and Missouri in 2013 and both times the place was going crazy at the end.

His last season when it started out the same way is when fans started to sour.

Yep, I was at BWW watching the game and it was loud. That was one of Martin's better wins in his first year IMO. That Vandy team had some talent and should've done more in the NCAA tourney. They did knock off eventual NCAA champion Ky, but they underachieved in the NCAA tourney.

We had high expectations in his 3rd year and continued to underachieve in Dec-Jan. Martin just didn't/couldn't adjust as the game went along IMO. If he had a good game plan, you usually knew it right away. If he didn't, we'd rarely adjust and end up winning.

 

[volbeast33]

Plus the notion that he wasn't supported I take issue with. His first 2 seasons especially, the last month of the season TBA was pretty rocking. I still remember the atmosphere at the Vandy game in 2012 and Missouri in 2013 and both times the place was going crazy at the end.

His last season when it started out the same way is when fans started to sour.

Yep there is much less support this yr then the three yrs Zo was here....win and it will get back to the way it was though.

 

[butchna]

Everyone sure celebrated like Florida and Uconn were great when we beat them.

We were just ecstatic about not having to face Austin Peay again. :yahoo:

 

[SGMVols]

That's definitely true.....that was the one thing I feel like went against Zo that wasn't his fault.....he never had any....can't believe we just won that game type of victories....Neither Florida nor UCONN was great when we beat them. His biggest win was probably Virginia but it wasn't a name team like the others....CDT prob won't have any this yr either but Pearl had several that come to mind.

That Florida team went to the Elite Eight. They were really good.