For those still on the fence about Jones....

#251
#251
ReaderVol said:
Everybody KNEW Dobbs was better? Really because I don't recall seeing people on this or other sites saying that early in the year.
Revisionist history is. A funny thing.
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You're right. Not everyone knew Dobbs was better, including Jones himself.
 
#252
#252
I wouldn't be surprised if this team finds a way to lose a game this year they shouldn't. That's what inexperience causes. Again, I think we're a year away from greatness.
I think OU beats us by 10. Can we win it? Yes but if I was betting now I'd put my coin on the visitors. If we played them later in the season this year I'd like our chances a lot better. KMAC, Tuttle etc are great freshman. But they are still frosh and I think it could (and I stress could) take a few games for them to really get the feel of big time football.
 
#253
#253
VoL The Impaler said:
Remember that Josh Dobbs and his family requested a redshirt also.. That factored in also. More dynamics involved here..
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No facts, no proof, no logic will ever slow the "shoulda been Dobbs" crowd down.
The large majority of Vol fans are enjoying the ride and thankful Dobbs is a gamer. But there will always be some that will only see yet another reason to whine and moan.
I could pretend to be shocked but I would be lying.

I'm still "wait and see" on Jones gameday but it has nothing to do with the never ending revisionist b.s. about the old qb situation.
 
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#255
#255
VKAman said:
You're right. Not everyone knew Dobbs was better, including Jones himself.
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I agree there. Some players are lights out in practice (remember Crompton) and some aren't spectacular in practice but when the lights come on it's a different story (Matt Jones at Arky).
 
#256
#256
chargervol said:
No facts, no proof, no logic will ever slow the "shoulda been Dobbs" crowd down.
The large majority of Vol fans are enjoying the ride and thankful Dobbs is a gamer. But there will always be some that will only see yet another reason to whine and moan.
I could pretend to be shocked but I would be lying.

I'm still "wait and see" on Jones gameday but it has nothing to do with the never ending revisionist b.s. about the old qb situation.
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Thank you...I'd say it's TIRING, but that's the wrong tense...LONG PAST that! :pinch:
 
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#258
#258
ReaderVol said:
I agree there. Some players are lights out in practice (remember Crompton) and some aren't spectacular in practice but when the lights come on it's a different story (Matt Jones at Arky).
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That was my entire point. If Jones redshirted Dobbs, it was because he thought Worley gave us the best chance to win at the time, not because he thought Dobbs did but wanted to save him for later.
 
#259
#259
VKAman said:
No, it doesn't. Any coach dumb enough to sacrifice wins to "save" a player's eligibility is not a smart coach.
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Maybe it wasn't a "sacrifice"...you KNEW Dobbs was better but you weren't better than Butch at coaching so you didn't get to recruit/flip Dobbs and make decisions. I blame you for Florida. :yu:
 
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#260
#260
VKAman said:
That was my entire point. If Jones redshirted Dobbs, it was because he thought Worley gave us the best chance to win at the time, not because he thought Dobbs did but wanted to save him for later.
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It's your theory...wish you was good at stuff so you could think for the Vols...but you're not...but you're not. :no:
 
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#261
#261
VKAman said:
That was my entire point. If Jones redshirted Dobbs, it was because he thought Worley gave us the best chance to win at the time, not because he thought Dobbs did but wanted to save him for later.
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He knew Dobbs had potential. But needed a little more time. Look how much better he is after working spring and fall camp.
So it was a combination of multiple things.
I have zero issue with him redshirting Dobbs.
 
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#262
#262
butchna said:
It's your theory...wish you was good at stuff so you could think for the Vols...but you're not...but you're not. :no:
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It's my theory that coaches are trying to win games. It's ReaderVol's theory that Jones was looking five years down the road when he may not even be here then, that Jones thought he was good enough to still have this job in 2018 but also didn't think he was good enough to recruit another QB by then, and that our coach decided to redshirt the guy he thought was the best player on our team, at the most important position, essentially not even really trying to beat Florida in 2014. Which theory makes more sense?
 
#263
#263
ReaderVol said:
He knew Dobbs had potential. But needed a little more time. Look how much better he is after working spring and fall camp.
So it was a combination of multiple things.
I have zero issue with him redshirting Dobbs.
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.. And Coach Jones was trying to spare Dobbs life behind the Oline... /bluefont
 
#264
#264
ReaderVol said:
He knew Dobbs had potential. But needed a little more time. Look how much better he is after working spring and fall camp.
So it was a combination of multiple things.
I have zero issue with him redshirting Dobbs.
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So you agree with me. He would have been redshirted because he wasn't ready, not because he was ready but we wanted to hide him from everyone. If it were the latter, I'd have a huge problem with it, as should everyone, which was my point.
 
#265
#265
VKAman said:
It's my theory that coaches are trying to win games. It's ReaderVol's theory that Jones was looking five years down the road when he may not even be here then, that Jones thought he was good enough to still have this job in 2018 but also didn't think he was good enough to recruit another QB by then, and that our coach decided to redshirt the guy he thought was the best player on our team, at the most important position, essentially not even really trying to beat Florida in 2014. Which theory makes more sense?
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Lol 5 years down the road? Man you're really good at this.
 
#266
#266
VKAman said:
So you agree with me. He would have been redshirted because he wasn't ready, not because he was ready but we wanted to hide him from everyone. If it were the latter, I'd have a huge problem with it, as should everyone, which was my point.
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There were multiple reasons he was going to redshirt Dobbs.
 
#267
#267
VKAman said:
It's my theory that coaches are trying to win games. It's ReaderVol's theory that Jones was looking five years down the road when he may not even be here then, that Jones thought he was good enough to still have this job in 2018 but also didn't think he was good enough to recruit another QB by then, and that our coach decided to redshirt the guy he thought was the best player on our team, at the most important position, essentially not even really trying to beat Florida in 2014. Which theory makes more sense?
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Where did you see "five years"? Missing a lot when I read redshirt SEASON. And if losing by 1 to Florida "not even really trying"? You got me excited about our future. :yahoo: If Butch REALLY TRIES, skies the limit! :W00t:







Still doesn't get you off the hook for failing to be our coach. Bear your responsibility and apologize for your failure...we'll START with that. :aggressive:
 
#269
#269
VKAman said:
So you agree with me. He would have been redshirted because he wasn't ready, not because he was ready but we wanted to hide him from everyone. If it were the latter, I'd have a huge problem with it, as should everyone, which was my point.
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He wasn't ready...then he was. Easy stuff. :)
 
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#270
#270
VKAman said:
So you agree with me. He would have been redshirted because he wasn't ready, not because he was ready but we wanted to hide him from everyone. If it were the latter, I'd have a huge problem with it, as should everyone, which was my point.
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You're exaggerating what was said.
Dobbs didn't show signs of being better than the competition at the beginning of the season. Therefor, you don't burn a redshirt for no reason. You have every reason to believe he will be here for 5 years so you try to keep him eligible for his last year. He just keeps getting better with time.

There is also no reason that anyone would have known Peterman would freeze like a deer in headlights, in front of a crowd. This isn't an either/or situation. It was several individual circumstances that made it the right call. Had Worley stayed healthy and as productive as the UGA game, no coach would have pulled him.
Circumstances changed and Jones burned his redshirt when necessary. A little late because the extent of Worleys injury wasn't known but that's just life. It happens.
 
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#271
#271
VKAman said:
And if sacrificing wins was one of them (hint: it wasn't), we should be concerned about Jones' future at Tennessee, because that's monumentally stupid.
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He didn't sacrifice wins. They lost games. Wins aren't a decision. You would know that...if you hadn't failed to be our coach. :sad:
 
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#272
#272
butchna said:
He didn't sacrifice wins. They lost games. Wins aren't a decision. You would know that...if you hadn't failed to be our coach. :sad:
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I swear people can't read. Suppose someone said, "I think Butch lost to Alabama on purpose last year. He wanted to let them get cocky before coming back to beat them this year." And I said, "That's really dumb. No coach would do that, including Butch." How is calling a hypothetical stupid, and saying the coach would NOT do it, an example of me questioning the coach?
 
#273
#273
VKAman said:
I swear people can't read. Suppose someone said, "I think Butch lost to Alabama on purpose last year. He wanted to let them get cocky before coming back to beat them this year." And I said, "That's really dumb. No coach would do that, including Butch." How is calling a hypothetical stupid, and saying the coach would NOT do it, an example of me questioning the coach?
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Hard to follow...so Butch "sacrificed a win" but it's stupid to take that literally? :huh: You're on a higher plane of thinking than us...so take five and let us catch up. :)
 
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#275
#275
butchna said:
Hard to follow...so Butch "sacrificed a win" but it's stupid to take that literally? :huh: You're on a higher plane of thinking than us...so take five and let us catch up. :)
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Now refer to my previous post, and replace the first quote with, "Suppose someone said, 'Butch knew Dobbs would make us more likely to beat Florida, but elected to keep him on the sidelines anyway.' To which I would say, 'That's a really dumb idea, because any given coach is going to do whatever it takes to beat Florida in that situation. It's more likely that Butch thought Dobbs wasn't ready to outplay Worley at that point.'" Am I criticizing Butch? Am I saying I should be the coach? Not if you have reading comprehension
 
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