ESPN’s Love Fest with Kentucky

#51

volfanbill

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#51
Truthful is what LouderVol said, not what you are saying. You really think UT would have lost at home with Azubuike not playing when they took them to overtime on a neutral court when Azubuike was playing? Does it hurt after spending so much time on your knees slobbering over Calipari?
Has absolutely squat to do with what I said. This is more of the inferiority complex shining like a beacon on a cold dark night. Especially your ridiculously goofy and childish dig.
 
#52

IPleadInsanity

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#52
I don't consider Uk a college basketball program, more like semi-pro team. Most of the participants will only be in college 6 months before entering the draft. I have my doubts they live like normal students with an academic workload as well as a sports workload. Have my doubts they attend much class if they even go to class. It's not a level playing field with them involved.
 
#53

hUTch2002

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#53
Has absolutely squat to do with what I said. This is more of the inferiority complex shining like a beacon on a cold dark night. Especially your ridiculously goofy and childish dig.
You are saying this poster made a childish dig but didn’t you just ask if someone else was butthurt?
 
#55
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#55
Why should they do this "of course"? Wouldn't it make for a better story line to praise a bunch of guys that came in fairly lowly ranked, remained humble, bought into what their coach was teaching, played as a team, and actually stayed in college (since technically they are consider "student athletes") rather than a bunch of one-and-doners who likely are using Kentucky and Duke as a stepping stone to the NBA. And I'm not even saying that them using this as a stepping stone is necessarily a bad look on the players since that's the stupid rules that they are currently forced into by the NBA and the NCAA. And some of them may actually appreciate Kentucky and Duke and come back to support them. But to my mind the UT players make for a much more feel good story and one that I would think a lot of Americans would pull for.
No. Sadly the average donk doesnt value development. They value a 17 or 18 year old who plays like a 30 year nba vet.
 
#57

Shaun1985

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#57
As for Cals coaching, what exactly did I say that sounded butthurt. He reloads every year with the best hs talent in the country. How many banners has he hung in Rupp again? He has a generic system that works well with the players he has. We've seen Cal teams fall when he doesn't have certain pieces. A good coach can adjust and he rarely does. It's not sour grapes just my opinion.
 
#58

05_never_again

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#58
Why should they do this "of course"? Wouldn't it make for a better story line to praise a bunch of guys that came in fairly lowly ranked, remained humble, bought into what their coach was teaching, played as a team, and actually stayed in college (since technically they are consider "student athletes") rather than a bunch of one-and-doners who likely are using Kentucky and Duke as a stepping stone to the NBA. And I'm not even saying that them using this as a stepping stone is necessarily a bad look on the players since that's the stupid rules that they are currently forced into by the NBA and the NCAA. And some of them may actually appreciate Kentucky and Duke and come back to support them. But to my mind the UT players make for a much more feel good story and one that I would think a lot of Americans would pull for.
They're forced into it purely because of the NBA's rule. NCAA has nothing to do with it.
 
#59

05_never_again

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#59
Judging Cal's coaching is impossible. He gets elite talent every year. You can't see progression because it's the same story every year. I don't think he is a good Xs and Os coach but JMO. And whatever love Kentucky is getting from ESPN, it doesn't compare to the slobbering they give Duke.
There are very few great Xs and Os coaches in college sports. College sports is more about the talent you have (recruiting) than out-scheming opponents. There's a quote from Roy Williams, maybe apocryphal, where he said something to the effect of "I work so hard recruiting kids so I don't have to outcoach anybody."

Since the 09-10 season (9 full seasons), Cal has made the Elite Eight 6 times with one title. Coach K has made it 4 times with 2 titles, Bill Self has made it 5 times with zero titles, Roy Williams has made it 4 times with a title. Among his fellow blue blood coaches, his record is Kentucky is only surpassed by Coach K in terms of titles, and he's actually made more deep runs in the tourney than any other blue blood coach has since 09-10.

Cal is a very polarizing figure and simultaneously overrated and underrated. It does "feel" like Cal should have more than just a single title at Kentucky. However, Self has zero titles at Kansas and Roy Williams has just one title at UNC over the same period. A lot of Kentucky fans will say "But Cal's job is so hard because he has to rebuild the team every year." That's an intentional decision on Cal's part - he shouldn't get credit for working through any adversity that causes. Many other top coaches deal with the same adversity. However, a lot of Cal haters try to say he's clearly behind most other top coaches in some regard, and he just isn't, at least in terms of NCAAT performance.

If you want to talk overrated CBB coaches, I think it is easier to make that argument about Bill Self or Jim Boeheim.
 
#60

VolFreakJosh

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#60
There are very few great Xs and Os coaches in college sports. College sports is more about the talent you have (recruiting) than out-scheming opponents. There's a quote from Roy Williams, maybe apocryphal, where he said something to the effect of "I work so hard recruiting kids so I don't have to outcoach anybody."

Since the 09-10 season (9 full seasons), Cal has made the Elite Eight 6 times with one title. Coach K has made it 4 times with 2 titles, Bill Self has made it 5 times with zero titles, Roy Williams has made it 4 times with a title. Among his fellow blue blood coaches, his record is Kentucky is only surpassed by Coach K in terms of titles, and he's actually made more deep runs in the tourney than any other blue blood coach has since 09-10.

Cal is a very polarizing figure and simultaneously overrated and underrated. It does "feel" like Cal should have more than just a single title at Kentucky. However, Self has zero titles at Kansas and Roy Williams has just one title at UNC over the same period. A lot of Kentucky fans will say "But Cal's job is so hard because he has to rebuild the team every year." That's an intentional decision on Cal's part - he shouldn't get credit for working through any adversity that causes. Many other top coaches deal with the same adversity. However, a lot of Cal haters try to say he's clearly behind most other top coaches in some regard, and he just isn't, at least in terms of NCAAT performance.

If you want to talk overrated CBB coaches, I think it is easier to make that argument about Bill Self or Jim Boeheim.
Do you think Barnes is better at X’s & O’s and player development than Calipari?
 
#61

05_never_again

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#61
Do you think Barnes is better at X’s & O’s and player development than Calipari?
That's really tough to say. Barnes pretty clearly has done a great job developing this current Vols squad, either that or they all were just underrated by the recruiting services (almost definitely the former). At Texas, he recruited a lot of top talent and was always perceived as not getting enough out of it.

I think it is pretty clear that someone like Tom Izzo, over the balance of his career, is a better developer than Cal. Izzo isn't recruiting scrubs, obviously, but he also doesn't have these uber-talented one-and-dones every year. Beilein also doesn't recruit highly recruited guys either his teams have been good the last several years.
 
#63

volfanbill

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#63
Meanwhile, the Cats are improving. The theory that Cal can't coach is veritable horse****.
I’d argue Coach Cal is a great practice coach. He can really mold and shape players throughout a season. Never been overly impressed with his game day on the fly adjustments.
 
#64

VolFreakJosh

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#64
Meanwhile, the Cats are improving. The theory that Cal can't coach is veritable horse****.
Excellent recruiter that’s able to get a handful of McDonald’s All Americans to play together every year.

Just isn’t a very good X’s & O’s coach and sucks at making the right adjustments when his team isn’t clicking.
 
#66

McCat

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#66
Excellent recruiter that’s able to get a handful of McDonald’s All Americans to play together every year.

Just isn’t a very good X’s & O’s coach and sucks at making the right adjustments when his team isn’t clicking.
"Able to get a handful of McDonald's All Americans to play together every year" sounds like good coaching to me.

He's probably not elite at X's and O's but "sucks at making the right adjustments" is patently untrue.
 
#68

volfanbill

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#68
"Able to get a handful of McDonald's All Americans to play together every year" sounds like good coaching to me.

He's probably not elite at X's and O's but "sucks at making the right adjustments" is patently untrue.
It’s a lot closer to sucks than good. If you give him 4-5 days to game plan, there’s only two current coaches I’m taking over him. If I need someone making decisions that day on the fly, he’s nowhere close to even seeing the top of the list.
 
#70

Boca Vol

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#70
Why should they do this "of course"? Wouldn't it make for a better story line to praise a bunch of guys that came in fairly lowly ranked, remained humble, bought into what their coach was teaching, played as a team, and actually stayed in college (since technically they are consider "student athletes") rather than a bunch of one-and-doners who likely are using Kentucky and Duke as a stepping stone to the NBA. And I'm not even saying that them using this as a stepping stone is necessarily a bad look on the players since that's the stupid rules that they are currently forced into by the NBA and the NCAA. And some of them may actually appreciate Kentucky and Duke and come back to support them. But to my mind the UT players make for a much more feel good story and one that I would think a lot of Americans would pull for.
Agree it makes for a better storyline but ESPN also has an NBA contract. They are going to promote the new crop of 1st rounders as it pertains to their bottom line.
 
#71

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