Chris Low Says It Will Be “Difficult” For Pruitt To Stay As HC

[Birdie]

I think hiring Herman would be a good thing. Even if he can't win the conference, I feel he could win 7-9 games a year and consistently compete with Alabama, Florida, and Georgia. He has already beaten Georgia while at Texas.

If he does nothing else but stabilize the program for a few years and make UT a desirable job again, it would be worth what UT pays to get him here.

With everything negative swirling around the program right now, I don't think we will have a very deep pool to hire from.

Agreed! He has the highest floor of any coach available. As you well outlined, at this juncture that is a big W for TN. We can't have another dud coach. We must have stability around a competent coach. With a high floor (I think he still has a high ceiling too, he is a young HC) and no buy-out to pay, he is the lowest risk, highest reward candidate out there.

 

[Narco_vol]

I’m saying there is a chance we talked to the same people.

 

[VolArmy74]

I don't know how much more "he can't hack it in the SEC" crap I can take. This conference is elite Alabama, and a bunch of teams that wouldn't win the Big 12, Big 10 or ACC championships either.

Didn't anyone watch Florida get boat raced by Oklahoma? Clemson regularly beats every SEC team it gets to play, including Alabama and Ohio State just beat them. I don't see any reason to say Herman not winning the Big 12 in any way means he couldn't win here. Hell, Missouri left the B12 and came here and started winning the East.

 

[LittleVol]

Just maybe the ESPN reporter talked to people influential at UT to get to that conclusion. I have never said or expressed that I was extremely wealthy, with that said I don’t know any broke MIT grads.

Jeff Goldblum in Independence Day .

That's cool you went to MIT.
What do you do know if you don't mind me asking? Hopefully making the world a better place...

 

[buckfama]

Agreed! He has the highest floor of any coach available. As you well outlined, at this juncture that is a big W for TN. We can't have another dud coach. We must have stability around a competent coach. With a high floor (I think he still has a high ceiling too, he is a young HC) and no buy-out to pay, he is the lowest risk, highest reward candidate out there.

I would be happy with Herman or Freeze. I'm like you, I feel Herman may surprise some folks and do very well here.

Freeze would be so happy to be here I honestly think no one else would outwork him. Would he have some issues with his reputation to overcome? Sure... but if he can develop talent and get them to play hard I think it goes away fairly quickly. It's amazing how winning does that.

I'm not crazy about Chadwell at all. I don't think he is ready for the big stage yet.

Same for Napier or Fickell. I'm probably gun shy about Fickell because of where he coaches now and our recent Cincinnati experiment gone bad. I can say his players gave it everything they had and gave Georgia fits.

 

[thistime]

I think the investigation that started with one instance of impermissible contacts and benefits involving one staff member has started to uncover other instances of that staff member at best living in the gray area, at worst being a blatant rule-breaker.

Will Pruitt ultimately fall because of the actions of one of his staff members? I still don't believe so, but we're starting to get into the territory of how good does next season have to be to keep him and that is becoming an ever steeper hill to climb.

I know you are close and would know much more than the average Joe so would you answer this question? Is the staff in the AD making the calls or is it boosters? I know they both have different types of influence with the Admin but it just appears that the right hand and left hand are not doing what the head is telling them and if they are the head has serious issues.

 

[Narco_vol]

Jeff Goldblum in Independence Day .

That's cool you went to MIT.
What do you do know if you don't mind me asking? Hopefully making the world a better place...

 

[508mikey]

I think the investigation that started with one instance of impermissible contacts and benefits involving one staff member has started to uncover other instances of that staff member at best living in the gray area, at worst being a blatant rule-breaker.

Will Pruitt ultimately fall because of the actions of one of his staff members? I still don't believe so, but we're starting to get into the territory of how good does next season have to be to keep him and that is becoming an ever steeper hill to climb.

Im more worried about losing Gray Is that a possibility ?

 

[VolsSince78]

Na, recruiting to TN is easier imo. TAM has a strong presence there now and can sell the SEC in their own state. Texas is massive, TN is closer to more talent hotbeds than Texas who has 1.

What do you consider struggle? 7-3 this year. 2-4 against Oklahoma his entire career (including Houston) and has never lost to them by more than 12pts. He beat no.6 Georgia in the Sugar Bowl. He has multiple wins against top 10 and top 5 opponents in his career. Has 1 bad loss in 4yrs at Texas; a 20pt loss in his first game against a ranked Maryland team.

He hasn't been perfect for sure. But he has consistently fielded a team that can compete with and beat anyone they play at each of his HC stops. That includes a no.3 Oklahoma team with Baker Mayfield who went to the CFP.

He's young with a high ceiling, fields great offenses, and we know he puts competitive teams on the field. Maybe Napier or someone else is the next Dabo, maybe they are Butch Jones or Jeremy Pruitt... I take the guy who has proven he can put a competitive team on the field consistently and hope he has learned from his past mistakes and fulfills the potential he has shown to be a great HC.

I’d for sure support Herman if/when he is hired here.

However, the combo of the Houston area and the DFW area is WAY better recruiting grounds than the Knoxville region extended. And I’m not excluding the Atlanta area or Charlotte area from my “Knoxville region”.

I think Herman would recruit well here given the right staff.

 

[johnsonbrewer]

View attachment 336831

 

[jacobyvoln27]

I will get roasted for this, but let’s ride with Phil look at North Carolina this year with Mack Btown?

 

[VolArmy74]

I’d for sure support Herman if/when he is hired here.

However, the combo of the Houston area and the DFW area is WAY better recruiting grounds than the Knoxville region extended. And I’m not excluding the Atlanta area or Charlotte area from my “Knoxville region”.

I think Herman would recruit well here given the right staff.

The recruiting base here is strong and getting better every year. We are at the point that players are leaving Tennessee to star on national championship teams. That's why UT football is cratering in no small part. Extremely talented in-state guys playing elsewhere.

 

[Birdie]

I would be happy with Herman or Freeze. I'm like you, I feel Herman may surprise some folks and do very well here.

Freeze would be so happy to be here I honestly think no one else would outwork him. Would he have some issues with his reputation to overcome? Sure... but if he can develop talent and get them to play hard I think it goes away fairly quickly. It's amazing how winning does that.

I'm not crazy about Chadwell at all. I don't think he is ready for the big stage yet.

Same for Napier or Fickell. I'm probably gun shy about Fickell because of where he coaches now and our recent Cincinnati experiment gone bad. I can say his players gave it everything they had and gave Georgia fits.

I'm with you. Would take either. Herman would be my first option but Freeze would have success here too.

I don't disagree, with a fall like his and an opportunity like TN, that is motivation for a man. I don't see it happening though. I don’t see how we could use the breaking of rules to fire a coach then hire a coach who so blatantly broke the rules. Talk about hypocrisy.

Share same opinion on the others too. Fickell is probably the best option of those but I just really think having an offensive minded HC is important in the modern game due to the rule changes and likely future changes too. To establish an offensive identity that stays with the program regardless of coordinator is big due to that, imo. It is how Clemson, Oklahoma, and Ohio State have operated. Even Saban runs Bama with a bigger emphasis on offense now.

 

[Birdie]

I’d for sure support Herman if/when he is hired here.

However, the combo of the Houston area and the DFW area is WAY better recruiting grounds than the Knoxville region extended. And I’m not excluding the Atlanta area or Charlotte area from my “Knoxville region”.

I think Herman would recruit well here given the right staff.

Agree. Who hasn't recruited well at TN right.. Butch freaking Jones inked a top 5 class. Win, and TN can recruit as well as any program in the country. Has been proven numerous times.

 

[TNvolsFanCrook22]

Anyone mentioning Marrone, stop it. Get some help.

Chris Low said he’d be on the short list so get ready

 

[OldVol]

I don’t see where he couldn’t hack the Big 12. His record was solid even if he didn’t win the conference title. He was 5-0 in bowl games so he should receive credit there. A definite upgrade over Pruitt.

I just can't believe we're allowing the Billion Dollar Baby to run us down yet another coaching rabbit hole after only giving a man 2 years and a pandemic year to see what he can do...... we are perpetuating insanity and hoping for better results. If we're going to do this let's at least go after a guy who has proven he can win in this league. Malzahn has beaten Saban more than anyone. Why not go after a guy who could recruit Alabama, Arkansas and Louisianna? I'm firmly, completely opposed to Herman. If he couldn't get it done in a hotbed of talent that is Texas, how in the world do we think he could recruit well enough here to beat Bama? This is just insane. I'm fine with anyone who wants Herman, I'm totllay opposed to it. He is far, far from a sure thing.

 

[89 VOLS grad]

I had no idea Pruitt didn’t get fired from Alabama...
Plenty of fired coaches finish out the season with their teams. Zook at Florida and Phillips at Kentucky come to mind. Even some guy named Fulmer at Tennessee finished out the season after getting fired. Coordinators on the other hand (Cutcliffe at Tennessee for instance) usually leave to focus on their HC positions once hired. As you seem to be aware, Pruitt did not...
On a side note, you need to look up what the term “get your head out of the sand” means to use in the correct context in the future

Ok, so you were pretending it did happen, not that it didn't. LOL The point is that coaches don't finish the season when fired. Otherwise, there wouldn't be interim coaches taking their place. Be safe out there, sir!

 

[89 VOLS grad]

I'm with you. Would take either. Herman would be my first option but Freeze would have success here too.

I don't disagree, with a fall like his and an opportunity like TN, that is motivation for a man. I don't see it happening though. I don’t see how we could use the breaking of rules to fire a coach then hire a coach who so blatantly broke the rules. Talk about hypocrisy.

Share same opinion on the others too. Fickell is probably the best option of those but I just really think having an offensive minded HC is important in the modern game due to the rule changes and likely future changes too. To establish an offensive identity that stays with the program regardless of coordinator is big due to that, imo. It is how Clemson, Oklahoma, and Ohio State have operated. Even Saban runs Bama with a bigger emphasis on offense now.

You guys need to stop with the Fickle talk. UT isn't paying a 20 million buyout!!!

 

[LittleVol]

I’d for sure support Herman if/when he is hired here.

However, the combo of the Houston area and the DFW area is WAY better recruiting grounds than the Knoxville region extended. And I’m not excluding the Atlanta area or Charlotte area from my “Knoxville region”.

I think Herman would recruit well here given the right staff.

Texas talent availability or abudance is deceptive in my opinion. What was Tom Herman really having to deal with recruiting to Austin. Most people think recruiting to Austin should be a cake walk. Well...lets look at the numbers

Of the 50 states it produces the most or one of the most top football prospects in the entire country
For the sake of this argument I will use number of 4 and 5 star players per state.

In 2021 class:
Texas- 52 (Herman)
Georgia- 28 (Pruitt)
Tennessee- 12 (Pruitt)
North Carolina- 19 ( Pruitt)

Name in () means the coach's recruiting territory more or less.

So it looks like Herman has the advantage.
Pruitt has to recruit 3 states in order to have the same amount of talent as Herman does in his "backyard ".
59 for 3 states. 52 for 1 BIG state.

But there in lies the deception. Texas is BIG. Herman's backyard was mostly an empty lot that didn't have a property line into the wheat fields.

Geography is real. Especially in recruiting. Kids want their family's to be there in person if all possible to see then perform.

Texas- 269,000 sq miles
Total sq miles ----

Georgia- 60,000 sq miles
North Carolina- 51,000 sq miles
Tennessee - 42,000 sq miles
Total- 153,000 sq miles

# OF Blue Chip Recruit per area
Pruitt has 1 per 2,593 sq miles
Herman had 1 per 5,170 sq miles


If you made one whole state out of North Carolina, Georgia and Tennessee. You would get a T shape state, with Knoxville being snap dab in the middle.

What am I saying?
Pruitt has a better recruiting ground than Herman.

The University of Tennessee has a superior recruiting footprint than The University of Texas.
I didn't even count Alabama or South Carolina, which area wise still fits inside Texas...

 

[OldVol]

7-3 isn't winning. Going to the Big 12 title game isn't winning? He is not an improvement over Jeremy Pruitt?

Ok..

We're all entitled to our opinion and mine is that Herman will be a complete and total failure if he comes to the SEC. With all that talent in Texas he should have gotten them to the top in a hurry but he didn't. Wait till he has to play 5 or 6 top 15 teams in the nation year in and year out. Sorry, I just don't see it. He was 32/18 at Texas. He played 2 teams this year that were ranked at the time they played. His teams were more competitive this year, but to much inferior competition. Some of his losses were as folows: A 5/7 Maryland team, A 4/8 Maryland team, a 6/7 TT team, he beat a 2/9 Kansas team by 2. I'm just not as carried away with what he did at Texas as you are. That's fine. I never denigrate people for their opinions. If I think they're wrong, I do point it out. There's a monumental difference between the Big12 and the SEC. If he's hired, he will have spent not one season in the SEC at any level. He'll have to start all over building relationships with our recruiting base. He'll find that the work he has to do to land a top 5 class here will be munificently more difficult than anything he's ever faced at Texas.

His resume does not resonate with me that he's up for the rigors of SEC football.

 

[OldVol]

I don’t see where he couldn’t hack the Big 12. His record was solid even if he didn’t win the conference title. He was 5-0 in bowl games so he should receive credit there. A definite upgrade over Pruitt.

I just can't believe we're allowing the Billion Dollar Baby to run us down yet another coaching rabbit hole after only giving a man 2 years and a pandemic year to see what he can do...... we are perpetuating insanity and hoping for better results. If we're going to do this let's at least go after a guy who has proven he can win in this league. Malzahn has beaten Saban more than anyone. Why not go after a guy who could recruit Alabama, Arkansas and Louisianna? I'm firmly, completely opposed to Herman. If he couldn't get it done in a hotbed of talent that is Texas, how in the world do we think he could recruit well enough here to beat Bama? This is just insane. I'm fine with anyone who wants Herman, I'm totllay opposed to it. He is far, far from a sure thing.

 

[OldVol]

t

Texas talent availability or abudance is deceptive in my opinion. What was Tom Herman really having to deal with recruiting to Austin. Most people think recruiting to Austin should be a cake walk. Well...lets look at the numbers

Of the 50 states it produces the most or one of the most top football prospects in the entire country
For the sake of this argument I will use number of 4 and 5 star players per state.

In 2021 class:
Texas- 52 (Herman)
Georgia- 28 (Pruitt)
Tennessee- 12 (Pruitt)
North Carolina- 19 ( Pruitt)

Name in () means the coach's recruiting territory more or less.

So it looks like Herman has the advantage.
Pruitt has to recruit 3 states in order to have the same amount of talent as Herman does in his "backyard ".
59 for 3 states. 52 for 1 BIG state.

But there in lies the deception. Texas is BIG. Herman's backyard was mostly an empty lot that didn't have a property line into the wheat fields.

Geography is real. Especially in recruiting. Kids want their family's to be there in person if all possible to see then perform.

Texas- 269,000 sq miles
Total sq miles ----

Georgia- 60,000 sq miles
North Carolina- 51,000 sq miles
Tennessee - 42,000 sq miles
Total- 153,000 sq miles

# OF Blue Chip Recruit per area
Pruitt has 1 per 2,593 sq miles
Herman had 1 per 5,170 sq miles


If you made one whole state out of North Carolina, Georgia and Tennessee. You would get a T shape state, with Knoxville being snap dab in the middle.

What am I saying?
Pruitt has a better recruiting ground than Herman.

The University of Tennessee has a superior recruiting footprint than The University of Texas.
I didn't even count Alabama or South Carolina, which area wise still fits inside Texas...

I would argue that the allure for Texas in-state kids is far greater than the allure TN presents for our kids now. None of the kids we're recruitinig in state weren't even born the last time we won an SEC title. My mom is from Texas and there's that Texas thing that exists and it's very real. If Herman comes here he will be totally overwhelmed trying to recruit here. He has zero ties to the SEC. None. He'll have to build all new relationships in every area of our recruiting base. I think it would be a disaster.

 

[PruittEra]

Na, recruiting to TN is easier imo. TAM has a strong presence there now and can sell the SEC in their own state. Texas is massive, TN is closer to more talent hotbeds than Texas who has 1.

What do you consider struggle? 7-3 this year. 2-4 against Oklahoma his entire career (including Houston) and has never lost to them by more than 12pts. He beat no.6 Georgia in the Sugar Bowl. He has multiple wins against top 10 and top 5 opponents in his career. Has 1 bad loss in 4yrs at Texas; a 20pt loss in his first game against a ranked Maryland team.

He hasn't been perfect for sure. But he has consistently fielded a team that can compete with and beat anyone they play at each of his HC stops. That includes a no.3 Oklahoma team with Baker Mayfield who went to the CFP.

He's young with a high ceiling, fields great offenses, and we know he puts competitive teams on the field. Maybe Napier or someone else is the next Dabo, maybe they are Butch Jones or Jeremy Pruitt... I take the guy who has proven he can put a competitive team on the field consistently and hope he has learned from his past mistakes and fulfills the potential he has shown to be a great HC.

I'll definitely agree that herman would be a massive improvement. Ill also agree that texas a&m are threats in recruiting but the longhorns should be the biggest draw for recruits in texas. They have the history and better facilities than a&m. And yes he's lost mostly to Oklahoma but those are the same Oklahoma teams that have lost badly against the top SEC teams. Which is my main concern. He was also just fired because he wasn't meeting expectations. Granted our expectations would be lower at this point. In the end I'd gladly accept him as head coach. Or Napier or pretty much anyone else at this point...

 

[VolsSince78]

Texas talent availability or abudance is deceptive in my opinion. What was Tom Herman really having to deal with recruiting to Austin. Most people think recruiting to Austin should be a cake walk. Well...lets look at the numbers

Of the 50 states it produces the most or one of the most top football prospects in the entire country
For the sake of this argument I will use number of 4 and 5 star players per state.

In 2021 class:
Texas- 52 (Herman)
Georgia- 28 (Pruitt)
Tennessee- 12 (Pruitt)
North Carolina- 19 ( Pruitt)

Name in () means the coach's recruiting territory more or less.

So it looks like Herman has the advantage.
Pruitt has to recruit 3 states in order to have the same amount of talent as Herman does in his "backyard ".
59 for 3 states. 52 for 1 BIG state.

But there in lies the deception. Texas is BIG. Herman's backyard was mostly an empty lot that didn't have a property line into the wheat fields.

Geography is real. Especially in recruiting. Kids want their family's to be there in person if all possible to see then perform.

Texas- 269,000 sq miles
Total sq miles ----

Georgia- 60,000 sq miles
North Carolina- 51,000 sq miles
Tennessee - 42,000 sq miles
Total- 153,000 sq miles

# OF Blue Chip Recruit per area
Pruitt has 1 per 2,593 sq miles
Herman had 1 per 5,170 sq miles


If you made one whole state out of North Carolina, Georgia and Tennessee. You would get a T shape state, with Knoxville being snap dab in the middle.

What am I saying?
Pruitt has a better recruiting ground than Herman.

The University of Tennessee has a superior recruiting footprint than The University of Texas.
I didn't even count Alabama or South Carolina, which area wise still fits inside Texas...

I’ve lived in 7 different towns in Texas including West Texas and the Valley below San Antonio. You can basically narrow UTexas’ recruiting area to exclude south of San Antonio and about 50-100 miles west of Austin and Ft Worth. There are more cattle, cactus, and oil rigs than people (much less football players) below San Antonio and in West Texas. There are exceptions, but this is the rule. So, half the square miles in Texas is almost excluded from football recruiting.

My earlier post specified Houston and DFW as rich high school recruiting grounds, deeper than anything around Knoxville. Both areas are 3 hours or less drive from Austin. These facts remain.

The real difference is that recruits in Houston and DFW will always consider UTexas as the first or second “local” option along with aTm more recently. Recruits in Atlanta and Charlotte don’t look at the Vols as first local option, even when our program is humming.

 

[PruittEra]

I’ve lived in 7 different towns in Texas including West Texas and the Valley below San Antonio. You can basically narrow UTexas’ recruiting area to exclude south of San Antonio and about 50-100 miles west of Austin and Ft Worth. There are more cattle, cactus, and oil rigs than people (much less football players) below San Antonio and in West Texas. There are exceptions, but this is the rule. So, half the square miles in Texas is almost excluded from football recruiting.

My earlier post specified Houston and DFW as rich high school recruiting grounds, deeper than anything around Knoxville. Both areas are 3 hours or less drive from Austin. These facts remain.

This is all a moo point until we fire Pruitt. I forsee another Dooley type hire.