Can the Vols be relevant while Saban is at the helm in Alabama?

[99gator]

Has anybody considered that Tennessee is the only team in the Eastern Division of the SEC, that would have to beat Alabama twice to win the SEC Championship? Tennessee is the only one in the East,who plays Alabama every stinkin' year! So, we will always be at a greater disadvantage than other teams. We haven't figured out how to beat Alabama once!

So tired of this argument. So, so tired.

Florida is 21-5 against Tennessee since 1993.

In most of these 26 seasons, the east race was effectively over for Tennessee before toe ever met leather on the third Saturday in October.

Since 2000, in 11 of 19 seasons, Tennessee has lost to both Florida and Georgia. They have beaten them both in the same season twice. Once, (2004) they went to the SEC title game. The other time, 2016, Butch happened.

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

Alabama owns us.....

duuuuuh

 

[Devo182]

?? Isn't UGA relevant?? cmon man! We just need development and better recruiting. Pruitt seems to be doing well, long way to go.

 

[Johncarter53]

Alabama isn’t the problem, it’s georgia. While we were dicking around with MAC coaches, Georgia went out and got a real coach who could recruit in the sec. And Kirby just added even more talent than they already had. We won’t be competitive until we start beating Kirby in recruiting and that’s not happening anytime soon.

To make matters worse, Mullen looks like he’s getting Florida back to relevance. So now we have 3 juggernauts on our already tough SEC schedule every year.

Pruitt has an Incredibly tough job getting us back to relevance. IMO he’s gonna need to sign at least 4 top ten classes because right now we’ve got the talent of a MAC team.

 

[76HuggieBear]

Better, yes but not where we want to be. If you're not competing for championships what's the point?

If you look at Tennessee and Wisconsin historically, they do kindly mirror each other as far as success. By this I mean a constant roller coaster of yearly win totals...not their overall wins. Tennessee holds a comfortable lead of over 100 more wins currently between the 2 schools.

Short of Fulmer’s and Neyland’s best runs, we are a 8 & 4 - 11 & 1 historic team that will win the conference and Natty every so often.

Do I want more, heck yeah...but would I take what we have been in the past...without a doubt.

 

[Brave Volunteer]

If you look at Tennessee and Wisconsin historically, they do kindly mirror each other as far as success. By this I mean a constant roller coaster of yearly win totals...not their overall wins. Tennessee holds a comfortable lead of over 100 more wins currently between the 2 schools.

Short of Fulmer’s and Neyland’s best runs, we are a 8 & 4 - 11 & 1 historic team that will win the conference and Natty every so often.

Do I want more, heck yeah...but would I take what we have been in the past...without a doubt.

The way I see it, the SEC East should ALWAYS be won by 1 of 3 programs; Georgia, Tennessee, and Florida. Allowing any other East program to even be mentioned in the running is just nonsense. We should always be in the hunt for the East title every single year, going to the championship game about 2 out of every 5 years and winning it once. We should also be in the top 10 in recruiting every year on average. To me, realistically that's the success this program is capable of if everything is managed the way it's supposed to be.

 

[Devo182]

So tired of this argument. So, so tired.

Florida is 21-5 against Tennessee since 1993.

In most of these 26 seasons, the east race was effectively over for Tennessee before toe ever met leather on the third Saturday in October.

Since 2000, in 11 of 19 seasons, Tennessee has lost to both Florida and Georgia. They have beaten them both in the same season twice. Once, (2004) they went to the SEC title game. The other time, 2016, Butch happened.

Missing the "big picture". If we rotated or played anyone but Bama, we get an extra win every other year or so. That means a few extra bowls, rather than 5-7 seasons, which leads to more practices, records look better, helping with recruiting, stability, etc. 2016 is probably a NY6 bowl, maybe same for 2015. An instant loss every year has overall effects greater than what you describe. Go back and add an extra loss to every one of your seasons and see what it does, see how your records look, not quite as good huh?

 

[99gator]

Missing the "big picture". If we rotated or played anyone but Bama, we get an extra win every other year or so. That means a few extra bowls, rather than 5-7 seasons, which leads to more practices, records look better, helping with recruiting, stability, etc. 2016 is probably a NY6 bowl, maybe same for 2015. An instant loss every year has overall effects greater than what you describe. Go back and add an extra loss to every one of your seasons and see what it does, see how your records look, not quite as good huh?

So, not only is Alabama responsible for Tennessee not winning the East, they are responsible for keeping Tennessee from being bowl eligible?

 

[Devo182]

The way I see it, the SEC East should ALWAYS be won by 1 of 3 programs; Georgia, Tennessee, and Florida. Allowing any other East program to even be mentioned in the running is just nonsense. We should always be in the hunt for the East title every single year, going to the championship game about 2 out of every 5 years and winning it once. We should also be in the top 10 in recruiting every year on average. To me, realistically that's the success this program is capable of if everything is managed the way it's supposed to be.

You do realize you're describing a great ~15 year stretch in the half century since integration, right? You're describing best possible outcome, not averages. Not saying we could never return to that peak, but right now (outside of the hope that the midstate keeps blowing up and producing in-state talent) I see no major systematic advantages vs our rivals.

And once Saban retires, UGA is certainly in line to become the next possible dynasty. Hell, their most talented class is their Freshman...

 

[Devo182]

So, not only is Alabama responsible for Tennessee not winning the East, they are responsible for keeping Tennessee from being bowl eligible?

As a contributing factor? Obviously. Don't be so dull.

 

[Devo182]

We are one of only two conference teams that have to play Bama and UGA every year. Winning championships ain’t happening any time soon, if ever, as long as Saban is there. Even 10 win seasons would be rare because it would require being flawless on the other 10 games.

We are at best a perennial 9 win team until there is some sort of power shift in the SEC.

A bit fatalist there. What if Pruitt can simply bump up recruiting to a new level? If we could even recruit like Auburn or LSU (we are within reasonable grasp of them) and develop better than CBJ did, then we should have every opportunity to at least beat one of them here and there. Aub and LSU have been able to. He's already shown himself quite the recruiter, so let's see how it plays out.

 

[Devo182]

Yeah I don’t see TN winning another title in my lifetime and it sucks. Major issues would need to be addressed and fixed before this program wins titles again but yes I could easily see 10 win seasons again no doubt....will TN ever challenge for the CFP? MAYBE in 10 years if they get lucky....

Why ten years? Pragmatically (unless you absolutely think Pruitt can't win), what is different between a 5 year outlook and a 10 year outlook? Either one is absolutely all new players and the opportunity to follow some period of continuity. Don't see the practical difference of blindly hoping it will be in 10 or 5 years.

 

[volfannbama]

Alabama isn’t the problem, it’s georgia. While we were dicking around with MAC coaches, Georgia went out and got a real coach who could recruit in the sec. And Kirby just added even more talent than they already had. We won’t be competitive until we start beating Kirby in recruiting and that’s not happening anytime soon.

To make matters worse, Mullen looks like he’s getting Florida back to relevance. So now we have 3 juggernauts on our already tough SEC schedule every year.

Pruitt has an Incredibly tough job getting us back to relevance. IMO he’s gonna need to sign at least 4 top ten classes because right now we’ve got the talent of a MAC team.

Have you compared our record against georgia to that of florida? Perhaps the problem isnt florida, georgia or alabama.....its Tennessee.

 

[Devo182]

I’m probably 50/50 on year 3 myself

On 8 wins? I would hope so. SR JG, Chandler, 2 elite CBs, Wanya & Wright on the ends with 3 5th year guys on the interior, Peterson (and Pappoe?) wreaking havoc, Keyton/Palmer stretching the field, only concern is if we can flip the DL...

The 1 thing that hurts us is playing in Norman. Huge win or another coach losing the big game in year 3 and starting 2-2 possibly. So many similatiries between him and CBJ's 1st and 3rd year. Both failed to beat Vandy to make a bowl in year 1. We will see if CJP can pass his year 3 vs OU game.

 

[Johncarter53]

Have you compared our record against georgia to that of florida? Perhaps the problem isnt florida, georgia or alabama.....its Tennessee.

Yes, it was Tennessee’s problem when they decided to hire coaches who couldn’t develop players or recruit top talent.

The problem now is that we let Alabama, Georgia, and Florida build up their programs to the point where it’s almost impossible to catch up unless our recruiting classes start to look like theirs.

 

[MikeVol44]

Georgia is relevant. Florida is relevant. At times, Auburn has been relevant while Saban has been at Alabama and so has TAM and Ole Miss and Miss State.

Yes. Auburn has played in 3 SEC and 2 NC games since Saban has been there....so yes, We can be relevant and will be relevant again in a few years.

I hate Jimbo, but he will have aTm competing in the West, too.

We'll get there....

 

[volfannbama]

Yes, it was Tennessee’s problem when they decided to hire coaches who couldn’t develop players or recruit top talent.

The problem now is that we let Alabama, Georgia, and Florida build up their programs to the point where it’s almost impossible to catch up unless our recruiting classes start to look like theirs.

Florida was 4-8 last year. We beat Georgia two of the last four years. We are the problem and we have developed a loser mentality to go with it. One thing you can bet on, tennessee will always be full of excuses.

 

[Devo182]

The heyday of the 90's is gone and likely never to return. I don't see an SEC title in the next 10 years at least. Much less a NC. We are a mid to lower tier program now. It is what it is.

Lol ok, sure. Guess our revenues, facilities, and recruiting are mid tier, huh? What did turn a great program into a midding team WAS an out touch administration, divisivness between power brokers, and, therefore a lack of consistency. But with Fulmer at head, I feel much better that the administration knows what we need to do to win and is protecting those aspects as much as he can from the know-nothing boosters.

Only those sort of idiots at the top could have ever thought hiring a losing La Tech attorney would be suitable for an SEC hc position. If we have future hires, I feel future candiates would love to come to a pro-football AD that is ready and willing to open the pocketbook and make things happen.

 

[BigOrangeTrain]

Lol ok, sure. Guess our revenues, facilities, and recruiting are mid tier, huh? What did turn a great program into a midding team WAS an out touch administration, divisivness between power brokers, and, therefore a lack of consistency. But with Fulmer at head, I feel much better that the administration knows what we need to do to win and is protecting those aspects as much as he can from the know-nothing boosters.

Only those sort of idiots at the top could have ever thought hiring a losing La Tech attorney would be suitable for an SEC hc position. If we have future hires, I feel future candiates would love to come to a pro-football AD that is ready and willing to open the pocketbook and make things happen.

You just reiterated my point. The powers that be have turned us into a mid tier program. Our facilities arent the cream of the crop anymore. Many other teams have caught up. Our recruiting? Mid level in the SEC. This downward spiral started when the idiots who run things thought it was smart to replace a HoF coach with a loser who wasnt qualified to take the job and that was Kiffin. From there its all history.

How are we going to realistically get back to the point where winning 10 games was the norm? UF is getting better and will probably thrive under Mullen. Georgia rules the East for the next 5-7 years. So we can hope tp finish what, 3rd in the East for awhile? Thats mid tier level. Winning the SEC? I mean thats a complete joke and fantasy.

 

[87&91ALUM]

Personally, I think the day Saban retires is when the Vols will have a chance to once again be relevant in SEC play. His recruiting year after year, and his production on the football field is very hard to overcome. The more I think about it, I’m glad Georgia lost. They need to lose momentum in recruiting. Alabama may indeed be on top for another 5-10 years but once Saban leaves, they won’t have the same kind of dominant success. Not that I think Smart is in the same league, but we don’t need a young Saban disciple creating his own legacy just because he’s the student of one of the best coaches in the game today (unless it’s Pruitt at UT) but I just don’t see that happening with either team. At some point, the Saban bubble is going to burst.

Yes

 

[Johncarter53]

Florida was 4-8 last year. We beat Georgia two of the last four years. We are the problem and we have developed a loser mentality to go with it. One thing you can bet on, tennessee will always be full of excuses.

Could the players have put in more effort and preparation, sure. Maybe they would have won an extra game or two - I don’t really know for sure, But I do know theres lot of NFL talent playing on those Florida and Georgia teams. There is zero on Tennessee’s. You’ll see that on draft day for the next few years.

 

[SobeVol]

So tired of this argument. So, so tired.

Florida is 21-5 against Tennessee since 1993.

In most of these 26 seasons, the east race was effectively over for Tennessee before toe ever met leather on the third Saturday in October.

Since 2000, in 11 of 19 seasons, Tennessee has lost to both Florida and Georgia. They have beaten them both in the same season twice. Once, (2004) they went to the SEC title game. The other time, 2016, Butch happened.

All this being said! I know deep down you are glad you don’t play Bama every year because the last decade they would be stomping you too

 

[volfannbama]

Could the players have put in more effort and preparation, sure. Maybe they would have won an extra game or two - I don’t really know for sure, But I do know theres lot of NFL talent playing on those Florida and Georgia teams. There is zero on Tennessee’s. You’ll see that on draft day for the next few years.

Yeah I heard that last year too.....and then the draft happened.

 

[Boca Vol]

Florida was 4-8 last year. We beat Georgia two of the last four years. We are the problem and we have developed a loser mentality to go with it. One thing you can bet on, tennessee will always be full of excuses.

UF was 4-7 last season...but the rest of your post was spot on. UT fans will always have the excuses on hand.

 

[Roustabout]

Not winning another championship in my lifetime.

Just felt it should be said again

My dad mentioned this the other day. He said, “I’m running out of time for the Vols to be relevant again.”
I said I was worried about that for myself as well.