By year 2...

#51
#51
bigorangecrush89 said:
I don't know anything about that. I Didnt follow alabama that close in the mid 2000's. I cant imagine it was that good considering the fiasco that had gone on with their coach being fired.
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We moved to AL in the mid 2000's; Shula inherited a mess...from coaching hires, fires and moves to sanctions. He wasn't the greatest, but did enough to start righting the ship....including a 10 win / top 10 ranking season. Later vacated.

I wasn't a follower then (or now) but don't think they had many if any embarrassing blowouts while he coached either. Perhaps his biggest issue was his inability to beat Tubs at AU and Saban at LSU....and 1 win I think v. Fulmer at UT. SEC record was not too good, but since I'm not a UA fan....thought he got a worse rap than maybe necessarily earned.

Funny thing to me, at the time....and I was loving it btw, was the paucity of bama crap flying compared to today....their fans were way down during that period. Today, you can't swing a dead cat w/out hitting bama paraphernalia.

I don't think the team Saban inherited was anywhere near as close to the bottom as our guys. There has to be a spark left.....I thought CJP alluded, post game presser, to seeing it in some of the players during the FL game. At this point, I can only hope the coaching staff can relight the flame and passion needed to see some better football in the weeks ahead.
 
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#52
#52
Anything less than 8 wins next season will be a bad omen. People keep talking about what a mess Pruitt has inherited, but Butch had a much thinner roster to start with and won 7 games in Year 2 and 9 games in Year 3. With next season's schedule, anything less than 8 wins will cast doubt on whether or not Pruitt is the guy.
 
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#55
#55
gasguy98 said:
I have heard some pundits state that by year 2 you will know if you have the "right guy (coach)." As I recall Saban had bubba in contender form in his second year. He had a mess to deal with, lack of depth etc. The barely able to speak Smart had jawja looking like Natty contenders by year 2. I am sure there are many other examples to cite across the country.

With this in mind, what should we expect next year? I for one will expect a massive leap, expect to compete in every single game and have at least 8 wins. This of course assumes Pruitt is indeed "the right guy".

Thoughts?
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It took Dabo several years to get Clemson where they are at the moment. Remember, Clemsoning was a real thing.

As far as what to expect, we should see a significant improvement in the line of scrimmage on both sides of the ball. The pieces are in place at pretty much every other level, but if the LOS doesn't get better it won't matter.
 
#59
#59
SaintLouisVol said:
"We're at year zero." :)
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this got a lot of run in the off season about there being no year zero, and we were all fired up about it. lol.

but really, that's what it's turned in to unfortunately. many of us overvalued the roster, by a lot. and we underestimated by a wide margin, the learning curve for all the "new". new coaches, new players, new schemes, new support staff, new s&c....

it was, and still is, a lot to ask for all of htat to come to gether, at least come together enough for it to translate to W's, in one off season.

and we also dismissed the mental health of this team. i don't think this team has shaken the "here we go again" mentality when things go badly. when they start wrong, they end wrong.
 
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#60
#60
gasguy98 said:
Saban? Maybe not as bad as what we are now but they were pretty bad.
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Saban also had a long history as a head coach beforehand, and had also won a championship at LSU. Pruitt has been involved with multiple championships, but not as a head coach. So I’m not really defending Pruitt, but I think the circumstances are very different and as someone stated above, I think Pruitt has also just inherited a worse overall situation than Saban or (especially) Smart did.

I’m not one for putting ultimatums on a coach. And in our case, unfortunately, I don’t think we can afford to go through another head coaching search if he isn’t “the guy” by year 2, which is totally subjective at this point. JMO.
 
#61
#61
Saban followed Shula to alaBummer and the player roster that saTan got was much better than what Pruitt just got, by far.

Smart walked into UGa that was a 10 win season before he got there and the player roster he walked into was loaded with starter depth at 2 levels.

Compared to what both UGa and alabubba have for a player roster then both of those teams are close to NFL level and Tennessee is a very good high school level team right now.

Right now alaBummer is the rock solid gold standard of college football beyond any doubt.

Both UGa and alaBubba are both in the serious conversations for a National Championship and rightfully so since they played each other in the NC game last season.

The player rosters of both of those schools are light years ahead of the kids we have playing and it's going to take several years of really good recruiting to build back up to a 2 deep roster that can play with and WIN against those 2 teams and we have to play both of them every year which makes it harder on us and Pruitt.

saTan trained coach Smart so he's copying the Bama systems.

Pruitt was trained by both Jimbo and saTan, 2 of the best in the business, so he knows beyond any doubt what it takes to WIN at the highest levels but he 1st has to get the right guys on our roster and then we'll see the old Tennessee footVol Team we want so badly to see again.

I'm expecting 4 to 5 years and maybe longer before we're able to talk SEC and National Championship level roster for our Vols.

I also want that in year 2 but being realistic I know it's going to take much longer.

I just hope our very impatient fans don't run off Pruitt and this very good coaching staff before they can rebuild us the right ways.

VFL...GBO!!!
 
#62
#62
supersmo18 said:
Saban also had a long history as a head coach beforehand, and had also won a championship at LSU. Pruitt has been involved with multiple championships, but not as a head coach. So I’m not really defending Pruitt, but I think the circumstances are very different and as someone stated above, I think Pruitt has also just inherited a worse overall situation than Saban or (especially) Smart did.

I’m not one for putting ultimatums on a coach. And in our case, unfortunately, I don’t think we can afford to go through another head coaching search if he isn’t “the guy” by year 2, which is totally subjective at this point. JMO.
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i had my first real concerns with Butch in year 3. the first two years, i just wrote off to be honest. year 2 was better than year 1, so you move on.

but when we lost the OU and FL games in 2015, that's when i had my moment.

i haven't had any such moment with Pruitt. i don't anticipate having one next year.

i don't want to have one any year after that. but you absolutely cannot hitch your wagon to a guy that you know isn't the guy, just for the sake of stability.

it sounds nice to look at Mark Stoops and say "see patience is virtue"...but the fact that it took 6 years to get to this point for him is solely on the fact that he's Mark Stoops, not Bob, and he's at KY, not TN. so situationally, you can applaud th job Stoops has done at KY, and mean it. for them, that is good. for him, that is good.

but i don't think any coach can come here and hang around 5-7 wins a year, for 5 years and keep his job.
 
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#64
#64
volfannbama said:
I do like our schedule next year....

But its awesome we already assume uk, mizz and vandy are automatic wins again. It is highly likely that by the time we play them next year they will all own winning streaks against us.
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Crazy how people think those are still sure wins.
 
#65
#65
jakez4ut said:
i jsut think our situation is wholly different than both GA's and Bama's when smart and saban got to town. rosters were better, administrations were waayyy more settled, and neither were coming in to programs that were in as bad a shapes as ours is mentally and physically.

i'd also contend that both took over at a time in their respective divisions, where it wasn't quite as daunting. so there were some builts ins on the schedule that made getting to 7 or 8 wins that first year, a little more acheivable, than what we've had to deal with.

we got the best Ole Miss team in 30 years in 2013. we got 2 national championship contenders in OU and Oregon. a conf title contender in WVU. we get to play Auburn, LSU from the West during rebuilds. we are having to put up with the some of the best USCe, Vand and KY teams they've had in YEARS.

they didn't have to deal with as much of that in their first couple years and when they did by year 2, they were doing it with better rosters.

i think year 2 for pruitt will be better than year 1. the schedule does lighten up. some of those teams i mentioned earlier will be losing some of their cache as star players depart. we avoid the big bad national title contender OOC game.

but we will still have roster issues. depth will still be an issue in spots, and next year's team gets younger in spots that matter.

i think if you can get to 7-5 next year, it's probably a success and shows improvement over this year. you can still recruit like crazy, and by 2020, we may have a team that can compete with anyone in the middle of the conf, and at least stand eye to eye with some of hte ones at the top of the conf....and you see if you can get to that 9+ win regular season in 20 and 21.

if things are going in that direction by then, then we should be reloading.

that's the hope anyway. i don't see any quick turnarounds with this particular rebuild, long story short....we're at least a year behind what Bama and GA did in year two, and i don't see us competing for championships in year 3 necessarily either.
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Tend to agree with your premise. Our situation is different than UA/Saban and UGA/Smart.
Most of us will feel a lot more confident in the Vols future as long as improvement can be seen (even if the W/L record isnt good). Game day, recruiting, staff upgrades (potentially) need to be seen.
 
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#66
#66
McDad said:
Tend to agree with your premise. Our situation is different than UA/Saban and UGA/Smart.
Most of us will feel a lot more confident in the Vols future as long as improvement can be seen (even if the W/L record isnt good). Game day, recruiting, staff upgrades (potentially) need to be seen.
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too early to tell if there's upgrades needed on the staff.

i think they just need to start looking like they know what they're supposed to be doing, especially on the O Line, that includes the TE's in blocking situations.

there's way too much thinking going on, and not enough reacting to what you see because you already know the answer. they're still trying to figure out what the question is in some cases.

that's something that can, and probably will, improve as the season goes on.
 
#67
#67
jakez4ut said:
too early to tell if there's upgrades needed on the staff.

i think they just need to start looking like they know what they're supposed to be doing, especially on the O Line, that includes the TE's in blocking situations.

there's way too much thinking going on, and not enough reacting to what you see because you already know the answer. they're still trying to figure out what the question is in some cases.

that's something that can, and probably will, improve as the season goes on.
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That better be seen as the season proceeds or the other improvements become more urgent.
 
#68
#68
McDad said:
That better be seen as the season proceeds or the other improvements become more urgent.
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maybe, maybe not. we still have roster issues any way you slice it. even if they start to get it, and they may be playing better, it may not show up like many would like. especially given who they'll be going up against over the next month and a half or so.

siap, but to me, i do think you can expect next year to be better than this year. but we aren't challenging GA for the division.

i think year 3 and 4, much like with Butch, will be the seasons you will see TN in position to win some games of note, and really put a stamp on where the program is then, vs. now. will this staff be able avoid the types of losses we experienced against FL, GA, OU, and even Bama in 2015? or can they find a way to win games like that?

i don't see that really happening in year 2. but year 3 and 4, yeah, those opportunities are going to present themselves.

and at some point, if we're ever going to get "back", we have to win games like that. period.
 
#69
#69
@Jake, your 1st and 2nd paragraphs confused me. Youre saying we will still have significant roster issues but should expect more wins???

Can you clarify?
 
#70
#70
Our schedule next year is favorable for us to have an improvement in our record.
 
#71
#71
joevol33 said:
Our schedule next year is favorable for us to have an improvement in our record.
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Should be. But predicting where our opponents will be next year is extremely difficult.

I just wanna see improvement over time. And not the smoke n mirrors improvement that CBJ showed. Real tangible improvement.

That's not too much to ask is it?
 
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#72
#72
McDad said:
@Jake, your 1st and 2nd paragraphs confused me. Youre saying we will still have significant roster issues but should expect more wins???

Can you clarify?
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the roster issues are in regards to being at the top of the conference, and still having some depth concerns in certain spots.

i don't expect us to win more than about 5 games this season at this point.

so, while i think we still have some roster issues, i do think year two with people returning, having 2 years in all the new systems, s&c etc....will have it's own set of dividends, even if not so much to mean that we're going to be what we would consider "good".

i think the schedule is easier as well with some of the teams in the middle of the conference maybe coming back down to earth a bit...MISS st loses a good chunk of guys after this year, as does KY and MO. i think those 3 games will be more winnable next year vs. this year.

so i could see us going from 5-7 to 7-5 next year.....not a huge jump, but improvement....get to the post season, and that's about it.
 
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#74
#74
jakez4ut said:
the roster issues are in regards to being at the top of the conference, and still having some depth concerns in certain spots.

i don't expect us to win more than about 5 games this season at this point.

so, while i think we still have some roster issues, i do think year two with people returning, having 2 years in all the new systems, s&c etc....will have it's own set of dividends, even if not so much to mean that we're going to be what we would consider "good".

i think the schedule is easier as well with some of the teams in the middle of the conference maybe coming back down to earth a bit...MISS st loses a good chunk of guys after this year, as does KY and MO. i think those 3 games will be more winnable next year vs. this year.

so i could see us going from 5-7 to 7-5 next year.....not a huge jump, but improvement....get to the post season, and that's about it.
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Thanks. That help me understand.

I CAN see that too but not sure I WILL see it next year. And, furthermore, we could lose some heartbreaking games while compiling a lackluster record...and still show improvement compares to this year so far.
 
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