Another reported assault

#51
#51
UTBME said:
Stop embarrassing yourself. How anyone deals with sexual assault is their business and not yours. Practice some empathy.
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They took it to the media. I'm not at all embarrassed discussing what is in a published story. Did you create an account simply to reply to this story?
 
#52
#52
BowlBrother85 said:
Okay, then...if we are splitting hairs - the reporter didn't give scrutiny to a very weak answer as to why the police weren't notified. She didn't ask follow up questions and pursue an answer that is going to satisfy a reasonable person... Now, THIS victim clearly did want someone to be notified of this incident and she wanted her alleged assailant held accountable for what she claims occurred. We have seen how the AJ Johnson case has been handled and have taken note of Butch Jones' swift and thorough handling of the matter. Johnson ( a high profile player) and Williams were immediately suspended. The name of their alleged accuser has not been disclosed and they will have to go through criminal proceedings to defend themselves against allegations which have been taken very seriously from the start. Basically, an accuser's claim of not calling the police because they don't want publicity just doesn't hold water. Neither does expecting a body outside of law enforcement to handle a crime. If she wants her alleged sexual assailant held accountable for his actions, then all she has to do is call the police. He would be suspended immediately pending the investigation from what we have seen from Jones.
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Actually, if I remember correctly, her name was disclosed on this very mb, but the mods acted swiftly to remove it. We also know who her bf was. So her identity is out there more than it should be.
 
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#53
#53
Thunder Good-Oil said:
The story did infer that she wasn't drinking at the first party. I think it said that she accepted a cup of punch. I will speculate that the newspaper is trying to portray her as a poor innocent child that is being abused by the big bad football program.

I find the following statement tacked on to the end of the story strange as well. If 17 of 19 didn't result in completed university proceedings, why is it so unusual that this case involving a football player didn't either?

Only two of 19 sexual assaults between 2011 and 2013 that the University of Tennessee reported to federal authorities led to a completed student disciplinary proceeding.
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Well I'm pretty sure (although I didn't go back and read it) when they say "reported to federal authorities" they don't mean for any type of investigation purposes, they are talking about meeting Title IX requirements of disclosing reported incidents. So when I read that the University found a reason to have a completed disciplinary proceeding in only 2 out of 19 instances, that does sound strange- but not because I believe 17 out of 19 people were making false claims.

EDIT: I just realized you were making the point that since only 2 out of 19 had discipline proceedings, there doesn't seem to be favoritism being shown to a football player by his case also not going to a proceeding.
The only problem with that is, we can say with some certainty that the 1 of the 2 taken to completion was NOT an athlete (other being Yemi), or we would have heard about it through his suspension. So that would seem to mean that out of the 17 reported but not taken to proceeding incidences, AT LEAST four of those would likely be football players- Johnson, Williams, Lane, this as yet unidentified player. (Obviously this could be incomplete/completely bull**** data-we are having to rely on someone else's info). If that is the case, and even if these are the only instances involving athletes, 4 out of 17 is a pretty high ratio. And the discipline taken against Yemi was apparently AFTER he had left school.
 
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#54
#54
Weezer said:
This is where we as a society have failed. Victims should never feel shame when stepping forward. If a crime was indeed committed, they should feel the desire to report it.
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I think that society doesn't stigmatize victims as it used to. However accusers are highly scrutinized in social media and lawyers will always get sleazy to protect their clients.
 
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#55
#55
All it takes is one case (legitimate or not, guilty or not) to receive a mass media attention and droves more will come up directly after. Happens in too many situations now. Hopefully, the correct actions are taken and this is resolved quickly.
 
#56
#56
Thunder Good-Oil said:
They took it to the media. I'm not at all embarrassed discussing what is in a published story. Did you create an account simply to reply to this story?
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Not that it matters but I have have had an account for a while, but generally have no desire to post.

Discussing the story is fine, I guess. But the position and tenor of your argument is why so many victims feel uncomfortable reporting such crimes. The best thing we can do is practice empathy and create a society where victims feel comfortable reporting such crimes. Instead we are on message boards bantering what ifs like we were actually involved in any of the process.
 
#57
#57
FTR, I also don't buy into the "she was drunk so it equals rape" arguement that gets portrayed in some cases. Most parties I went to, I was drinking heavy myself. Was I raped when I woke up the next morning with nothing but blurry memories and a girl I would never have slept with sober? Man or woman, when you go to a party, you're still responsble for your actions. It's one thing if someone drugs you, but if you willingly drink yourself into a stupor, you're acting with reckless abandonment. People in general need to be smart and take responsibility for their actions. Know your limit, and stop drinking before you reach it.
 
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#58
#58
UTBME said:
Not that it matters but I have have had an account for a while, but generally have no desire to post.

Discussing the story is fine, I guess. But the position and tenor of your argument is why so many victims feel uncomfortable reporting such crimes. The best thing we can do is practice empathy and create a society where victims feel comfortable reporting such crimes. Instead we are on message boards bantering what ifs like we were actually involved in any of the process.
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I'm not sure that I've been arguing anything. We're bantering and involved to the extent that it's apparently being tried in the media instead of through legal channels. That kind of makes us the jury, correct? I had very little to say about the AJ and MW case.
 
#59
#59
Weezer said:
FTR, I also don't buy into the "she was drunk so it equals rape" arguement that gets portrayed in some cases. Most parties I went to, I was drinking heavy myself. Was I raped when I woke up the next morning with nothing but blurry memories and a girl I would never have slept with sober? Man or woman, when you go to a party, you're still responsble for your actions. It's one thing if someone drugs you, but if you willingly drink yourself into a stupor, you're acting with reckless abandonment. People in general need to be smart and take responsibility for their actions. Know your limit, and stop drinking before you reach it.
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The article says that witnesses state that she was not drinking. It also says that she had three or four servings of "punch". I keep saying it... that's strange.
 
#60
#60
Thunder Good-Oil said:
The article says that witnesses state that she was not drinking. It also says that she had three or four servings of "punch". I keep saying it... that's strange.
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That's not what the witnesses are reported to have said. They said they didn't see signs of intoxication, not that she wasn't drinking.
 
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#61
#61
The last few words below look to me like an unnecessary shot taken by the writer. Why include "with the well wishes" of the athletics department staff? I'd guess they released a standard "don't include anything that we can be sued over" statement.

A fourth proceeding in 2013 involving Yemi Makanjuola found the former UT basketball player had violated student conduct standards by sexually assaulting a female student and indefinitely suspended him. The finding came after Makanjuola had transferred to the University of North Carolina at Wilmington with the well wishes of the UT athletics department staff.
 
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#62
#62
volgrad500 said:
Well I'm pretty sure (although I didn't go back and read it) when they say "reported to federal authorities" they don't mean for any type of investigation purposes, they are talking about meeting Title IX requirements of disclosing reported incidents. So when I read that the University found a reason to have a completed disciplinary proceeding in only 2 out of 19 instances, that does sound strange- but not because I believe 17 out of 19 people were making false claims.

EDIT: I just realized you were making the point that since only 2 out of 19 had discipline proceedings, there doesn't seem to be favoritism being shown to a football player by his case also not going to a proceeding.
The only problem with that is, we can say with some certainty that the 2 taken to completion were NOT athletes, or we would have heard about it through their suspensions. So that would seem to mean that out of the 17 reported but not taken to proceeding incidences, AT LEAST five of those would likely be football or basketball players- Johnson, Williams, Lane, this as yet unidentified player, and Yemi. (Obviously this could be incomplete/completely bull**** data-we are having to rely on someone else's info). If that is the case, and even if these are the only instances involving athletes, 5 out of 17 is a pretty high ratio.
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The story is very confusing. 2 of 19 assaults taken to the assault center that were reported to the Feds went to the disciplinary board. Do we even know if any of the accused football players cases were reported to the Feds? AJ/MW happened off campus... are they excluded from the report to the Feds?
 
#63
#63
Thunder Good-Oil said:
The story is very confusing. 2 of 19 assaults taken to the assault center that were reported to the Feds went to the disciplinary board. Do we even know if any of the accused football players cases were reported to the Feds? AJ/MW happened off campus... are they excluded from the report to the Feds?
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Honestly, we don't know anything haha. Title IX is supposed to include both on campus and off campus reports, but really, who knows how accurate this story is. It will be interesting to see how it all shakes out in the next few days. I sure wouldn't want to be that player right now-if he did nothing wrong, he is about to have a very difficult week ahead. If he did do something, he better start getting worried, because the spotlight is about to get very bright.
 
#64
#64
volgrad500 said:
Honestly, we don't know anything haha. Title IX is supposed to include both on campus and off campus reports, but really, who knows how accurate this story is. It will be interesting to see how it all shakes out in the next few days. I sure wouldn't want to be that player right now-if he did nothing wrong, he is about to have a very difficult week ahead. If he did do something, he better start getting worried, because the spotlight is about to get very bright.
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I wonder what they report? Only those cases that have victims go to the Sexual Assault Crisis Center or anything that the center gets wind of?
 
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#65
#65
Well that was a disturbing. If nothing else the fact that there are that many incidents sets alarm bells off. The university and the football program need to get a handle on this. It's one of those "where there's smoke there's fire" situations. The accusations against AJ have made this "news worthy". But, that doesn't change that there is a problem. We could all debate what the main factor is. But all these women can't be lying.
 
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#68
#68
I hate these stories but fact is if evidence exists then something happens to the athlete. Just ask two young men now facing trial. I have two girls so I take this seriously but I also know the outrage at Duke that was made up and the ridiculous outrage at UVA that has been debunked nationally. One thing I do know is that Butch doesn't take this crap and give the player the benefit of the doubt, probably the exact opposite. 99% of colleges would not have suspended Johnson and Williams awaiting the legal outcome. Butch did what Jimbo Fisher, James Franklin and endless others did not do and that was kick them off the team. J Winston ring a bell?
 
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#70
#70
f77f00 said:
I would encourage anyone who has been assaulted to bypass the university police and dial 911.
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Absolutely, get the rape kit from KPD immediately. How complete is the UT assualt center? Some young lady is not thinking clearly. Somebody robs or beats me I'm calling coppers asap and not campus police. They sound like clowns.:hi::lolabove::rock:
 
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#72
#72
I'm not buying the story. She doesn't tell the police because she doesn't want the attention, but she alerts the largest newspaper in the state of TN? Riiiiiiiight.
 
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#73
#73
crusse10 said:
I said this months ago, but I think that there is rampant sexual assault issues across the landscape of the NCAA. I think that a lot of players get laid in less than 100% consensual ways at an upsettingly frequent clip. A lot of it is attributed to a sense of entitlement because "don't you know who I am?"

As for updating the recruiting profile, there's just no way to pinpoint this kind of behavior. You can't look at a high school kid and say "sometime during college he's gonna get a girl drunk and bang her when she's barely lucid." You just can't know that. You can teach the kids, you can explicitly state what they should do in certain scenarios or what have you. But in the end, if he wants to get it and all it takes is another 3 drinks before she just isn't going to stop him, then that might happen. And it's terrifying.

Don't get me wrong. This is a serious issue in college as a whole. I just believe the percentage of sexual assault crimes/person is far higher in the athlete community than in the student body as a whole.
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My zero tolerance of this issue has arrived. The societal response/disgust with this growing college problem puts us in the same conversation with the Florida States.

If there is any merit to this claim (along with recent incidents) my respect for the athletic administration has taken a big hit.

With the blessings of daughters (no sons yet), I'm taking it all in with a sick feeling in my stomach.
 
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#74
#74
"If there aren't blue lights and badges constantly surrounding you program you aren't winning" Lee Corso.



Don't get mad I do not condone criminal activity in any shape or form.
 
#75
#75
davethevol said:
I'm not buying the story. She doesn't tell the police because she doesn't want the attention, but she alerts the largest newspaper in the state of TN? Riiiiiiiight.
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A lot of crimes go unreported for various reasons

Ridicule, fear of retaliation, shame

Rape and Sexual assault are a very demeaning crime for the victim. Depending on the person, it can be very hard to talk about, especially if its against a person you thought was a friend or the victim looked up to that person. The victim can also be in a situation where they believe if they report the crime it will be detrimental to themselves or another person they love. Perps often tell the victim they will kill them or worse, someone they care about, like a mother/father or child.

People who commit rape or Sexual Assault are sadistic people
 
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