2020 Primaries

#1,452
#1,452
zaqhhh said:
Literally those are facts, no country has ever got rid of their healthcare system to use ours as a model.

We have people who die on the streets right now cause we can't get care. Europe does not. Our taxes might go up some, but our total cost will go down per person and over the long term with the focus on preventive care. We will save compared to our current system.

Also, even my family members who still support Trump back Single Payer. One of the few crossover issues we have. Republican and Democrat, we have people struggling to afford care. Those people are fed up with both parties.[/

Just the U.K..
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#1,454
#1,454
zaqhhh said:
Many Sanders folk knew Trump could win. We knew he was tapping into a furor the American people had.

That's why there was a good number of our voters who backed Trump over Hillary.

But now Trump and his media allies are doing the same thing that others did to him in 2016.

Sanders can't win, "we want to take on Sanders"

Well you are going to get your wish.
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I'm not ruling out that there are enough malcontents to elect Sanders, however nobody has really made a concerted effort to drive up his negatives. Once that happens, he will lose some favor among the electorate.
 
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#1,455
#1,455
Bernie gets a blow out win in Nevada. Mayor Pete fading fast. The sound of Biden’s ramblings drifting away like a fart on the wind.

please please please please please please let Bernie win the Democratic nomination 😈
 
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#1,456
#1,456
0nelilreb said:
The constitution gives me the right to protect myself and my other rights that were granted in the constitution. Where does it say that health care especially free health care is a right ?
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Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of happiness encompasses both areas like guns but also the preservation of health.
 
#1,457
#1,457
hog88 said:
Can you tell me where in the Bill of Rights healthcare is mentioned.

You lost your argument in your second sentence.
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Tell me why guns are more important than healthcare?

What are you protecting with guns if you aren't able to maintain your health?

And FWIW, I'm not even anti-gun just making the point that healthcare is more important than me toting a firearm.
 
#1,458
#1,458
Weezer said:
I don't disagree, but Bernie can't even explain how he'll fund his way. His tax plan proposal doesn't pay for it.
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Our politicians are spending a lot of energy trying to explain how we are going to pay for something and not addressing what we're paying for. When an appendectomy costs $8,000,00 at one hospital and $25,000.00 at the one down the street something is not right.

I was in overnight for an outpatient procedure a couple of years ago. Even though I have insurance I asked for an itemized statement. There was something on there called "medication delivery system (or service) $75.00". I went to billing and asked what it was. They said it was for the nurse to bring me a pill. That means one nurse is probably adding tens of thousands of dollars to hospital billing every night. It also means a large hospital may have a hundred nurses doing the same 24-7.
 
#1,459
#1,459
zaqhhh said:
Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of happiness encompasses both areas like guns but also the preservation of health.
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Firearms , speech , press these are specific right laid out to and for us by some very intelligent men , you think they just forgot to include free government sponsored healthcare ?
 
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#1,460
#1,460
0nelilreb said:
Firearms , speech , press these are specific right laid out to and for us by some very intelligent men , you think they just forgot to include free government sponsored healthcare ?
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Well considering healthcare as we know it today didn't exist back then.

They certainly didn't know that a standard rifle to protect your house and private property would become an ak47 that could now down 40 people in a matter of seconds.
 
#1,461
#1,461
zaqhhh said:
Tell me why guns are more important than healthcare?

What are you protecting with guns if you aren't able to maintain your health?

And FWIW, I'm not even anti-gun just making the point that healthcare is more important than me toting a firearm.
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You do know why the 2a is there right ? It’s not for hunting reasons . It’s to be able to forcibly defends all your rights from a tyrannical government trying to take them .
 
#1,462
#1,462
zaqhhh said:
Well considering healthcare as we know it today didn't exist back then.

They certainly didn't know that a standard rifle to protect your house and private property would become an ak47 that could now down 40 people in a matter of seconds.
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No you don’t , don’t pull the “well it didn’t exist then card “ healthcare and Drs did exist . They actually killed Washington with their “ cures and treatments “
 
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#1,463
#1,463
0nelilreb said:
You do know why the 2a is there right ? It’s not for hunting reasons . It’s to be able to forcibly defends all your rights from a tyrannical government trying to take them .
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Yes because you onelilreb are going to be able to stave off an arsenal of nukes with your pistol.

Again I'm not even anti-gun, but my health matters much more than my ability to own a gun. And I say that as a gun owner.
 
#1,464
#1,464
zaqhhh said:
Tell me why guns are more important than healthcare?

What are you protecting with guns if you aren't able to maintain your health?

And FWIW, I'm not even anti-gun just making the point that healthcare is more important than me toting a firearm.
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I never said that guns are more important than healthcare. All of our rights are of equal importance and healthcare isn’t one of them.

If you and those like you that believe healthcare is a right why hasn’t anyone introduced a constitutional amendment to make it it so? I’ll give you the same advice I give the anti-gunners, go about the process to get what you want the right way and quit trying to endrun the constitution.
 
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#1,466
#1,466
0nelilreb said:
No you don’t , don’t pull the “well it didn’t exist then card “ healthcare and Drs did exist . They actually killed Washington with their “ cures and treatments “
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LMAO you think because ancient health remedies might have killed Washington, that we shouldn't give modern scientific healthcare to people today...
 
#1,467
#1,467
zaqhhh said:
Yes because you onelilreb are going to be able to stave off an arsenal of nukes with your pistol.

Again I'm not even anti-gun, but my health matters much more than my ability to own a gun. And I say that as a gun owner.
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How many years have we been in the sand box fighting camel riders in sandals with AKs made in the 60s ?
 
#1,471
#1,471
hog88 said:
I never said that guns are more important than healthcare. All of our rights are of equal importance and healthcare isn’t one of them.

If you and those like you that believe healthcare is a right why hasn’t anyone introduced a constitutional amendment to make it it so? I’ll give you the same advice I give the anti-gunners, go about the process to get what you want the right way and quit trying to endrun the constitution.
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So even though healthcare is more important or as important... We shouldn't recognize it as a right because our founders didn't?

Our founders did a great job, but time evolves. The UN recognizes healthcare as a right, many nations do. I believe it is implicitly stated in our constitution. I'm sure there will be issues in 2300 that we don't plan for and I hope to God they don't have the attitude of "Well, they didn't write it down back then so guess it doesn't matter."
 
#1,472
#1,472
zaqhhh said:
Tell me why guns are more important than healthcare?

What are you protecting with guns if you aren't able to maintain your health?

And FWIW, I'm not even anti-gun just making the point that healthcare is more important than me toting a firearm.
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The Constitution allows for one and not the other. If you don't like it, change the Constitution.
 
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#1,473
#1,473
zaqhhh said:
So even though healthcare is more important or as important... We shouldn't recognize it as a right because our founders didn't?

Our founders did a great job, but time evolves. The UN recognizes healthcare as a right, many nations do. I believe it is implicitly stated in our constitution. I'm sure there will be issues in 2300 that we don't plan for and I hope to God they don't have the attitude of "Well, they didn't write it down back then so guess it doesn't matter."
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Get a constitutional amendment going then which puts healthcare on an equal footing as a right as compared to the right to bear arms. Until then you’ve got no argument
 
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#1,474
#1,474
Alright so I have things around the house to get done today so I will leave you with what I learned today.

-Hospitals should have the right to refuse people who can't pay.

-Other countries don't actually like their healthcare system despite polling saying otherwise. I can't however provide any evidence of any country switching to our system.

-Our healthcare costs more per person than "socialism" but it's "socialism" which is bad so I don't want it.

Have a good day and can't wait until we fast forward to Sanders-Trump and the absolute meltdown that you all will have when Sanders wins because "Socialism."
 
#1,475
#1,475
zaqhhh said:
So even though healthcare is more important or as important... We shouldn't recognize it as a right because our founders didn't?

Our founders did a great job, but time evolves. The UN recognizes healthcare as a right, many nations do. I believe it is implicitly stated in our constitution. I'm sure there will be issues in 2300 that we don't plan for and I hope to God they don't have the attitude of "Well, they didn't write it down back then so guess it doesn't matter."
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I do not believe healthcare is a right, well as a fact it is not. If you want to make it a right go through the process of amending the constitution to make it a right. Sure it’s a complicated process but if it’s that important to you why not make the effort? The path to making healthcare an unquestioned right is spelled out in detail.

IDGAF what the UN says.
 
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