(2) Thunder vs. (3) Lakers

#151
#151
Before Lebron came did Chalmers have the ball in his hands, or was it mostly Wade still? Chalmers averaged 5.5 ap, and 4.9 ap per 36 minutes in those two seasons.
 
#152
#152
GahLee said:
Good question.

He plays more like a two guard than a point. He can be sloppy with his passing and that may be why he plays off the ball so much, that and James/Wade or so good with it in their hands.

I'll take his defense and 3 point shooting over what Sessions does no matter what the per 36 stat says.
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This. That's the way I like to see basketball done; if you can't defend, you better be able to handle the ball like Jesus.
 
#153
#153
VolsFan4Ever-11 said:
So did you see Bynums stat line yet?
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8/19 from inside 10 ft scarier for the Lakers IMO. What's even scarier is that inside of two minutes Bynum got pushed around by Ibaka like he was rag doll instead of playing like he did the whole game. Kobe's shooting night was not as abysmal as that stat line. Maybe you didn't watch the game.
 
#154
#154
SandoVOL said:
8/19 from inside 10 ft scarier for the Lakers IMO. What's even scarier is that inside of two minutes Bynum got pushed around by Ibaka like he was rag doll instead of playing like he did the whole game. Kobe's shooting night was not as abysmal as that stat line. Maybe you didn't watch the game.
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?

9/20 isn't bad, but when you miss your last 5, in a game you had locked up, I don't think 9/25 does your collapse justice.
 
#155
#155
n_huffhines said:
?

9/25 is what it is. 9/20 isn't bad, but when you miss your last 5, in a game you had locked up, I don't think 9/25 does your collapse justice.
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avoiding the issue that is the lack of any late game strategy, besides Bryant bailing out a team scared to operate, is the perfect way to make Bryant a scapegoat in everything the Lakers do.
 
#156
#156
BigPapaVol said:
avoiding the issue that is the lack of any late game strategy, besides Bryant bailing out a team scared to operate, is the perfect way to make Bryant a scapegoat in everything the Lakers do.
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This has been their only 4th quarter strategy since Shaq left. That's why the Lakers are the highest scoring team over the last 16 years, but are league average in 4th quarter scoring. Kobe doesn't share the ball well in crunch time.
 
#157
#157
Interestingly, Kobe shot only 371 times in the 4th quarter this regular season. 389 last year, 464 the year before that, and 490 the year before that.

So it seems Phil's plan was to have Kobe jack 'em up, too. I'm thinking the reason for the decline is Kobe is older, and gets more 4th quarter rest these days. He usually sits out the first 4 minutes or so.
 
#158
#158
SandoVOL said:
8/19 from inside 10 ft scarier for the Lakers IMO. What's even scarier is that inside of two minutes Bynum got pushed around by Ibaka like he was rag doll instead of playing like he did the whole game. Kobe's shooting night was not as abysmal as that stat line. Maybe you didn't watch the game.
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Yeah I watched it and saw Kobe miss his last 5 shots and have a costly to in the last 2 minutes.
 
#159
#159
n_huffhines said:
Before Lebron came did Chalmers have the ball in his hands, or was it mostly Wade still? Chalmers averaged 5.5 ap, and 4.9 ap per 36 minutes in those two seasons.
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He played more point before James' arrival but Wade played the role of primary ball-handler.

See Wade's assist numbers as an indicator of that.
 
#160
#160
BigPapaVol said:
avoiding the issue that is the lack of any late game strategy, besides Bryant bailing out a team scared to operate, is the perfect way to make Bryant a scapegoat in everything the Lakers do.
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I'm not sure they are scared to operate, it's just that's all they know.

"ok guys, two minutes left, get the ball to Kobe and be ready to get the offensive rebound if he misses".
 
#163
#163
n_huffhines said:
I can't help it with basketball. They explain too much of what is going on. I think people fall in love with their own expertise too much.
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Basketball, more than any other sport, has its fans follow the general opinion of everyone WAY too much.

Take Kobe. Kobe, by all statistical measures, is not "clutch" (even though there really isn't such thing as clutch, IMO). But no matter what stats you throw out there, they will bring up certain big plays, such as Indiana game 4 in 2000, buzzer beater against Phoenix in 2006, the five rings (though in four of the five NBA Finals he wasn't even the best player).

Then take LeBron. He's more clutch, andstats are better than Kobe's. They bring up the last three years, but I can bring up Detroit 2007, Washington his third and fourth year, 2009 Game 2 AND Game 5 against Orlando.

It's all about general opinion.
 
#164
#164
I can honestly say that I've watched a lot of Laker basketball in the last 15 years, Kobe has made some amazing game winning shots, and also cost the team their share of games. In the last two minutes of that game, the lakers pushed the ball up court and to the side of Andrew Bynum, that was the intention of the lakerr 3 possessions in a row. Of course Kobe ends up with the ball late in the shot clock. It didnt work out too well. It was plain to see, however, that the ball was meant to go into Bynum early in the shot clock.

Like I said, Bynum let himself get pushed around and essentially that wrenched the entire offensive possession. Go back and watch Ibaka fronting Bynum in the mid post and watch Andrew's reaction. If it had been shaq it would have been three dunks on three possessions.
 
#165
#165
zjcvols said:
Basketball, more than any other sport, has its fans follow the general opinion of everyone WAY too much.

Take Kobe. Kobe, by all statistical measures, is not "clutch" (even though there really isn't such thing as clutch, IMO). But no matter what stats you throw out there, they will bring up certain big plays, such as Indiana game 4 in 2000, buzzer beater against Phoenix in 2006, the five rings (though in four of the five NBA Finals he wasn't even the best player).

Then take LeBron. He's more clutch, andstats are better than Kobe's. They bring up the last three years, but I can bring up Detroit 2007, Washington his third and fourth year, 2009 Game 2 AND Game 5 against Orlando.

It's all about general opinion.
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I can't honestly believe that you think Lebron is more Clutch then Kobe, or any superstar for that matter. He's not a killer and doesn't want the ball in crunch time. I'll take Durant Mello Kobe Wade Robert Horry over Lebron any day. The sheer number of game winnin shots Kobe has put up should be enough IMO, of course. Statistics should go out the window, I would say the same about Jordan. He wasn't the greatest shooter but you want him to have the ball when it matters.
 
#166
#166
SandoVOL said:
I can't honestly believe that you think Lebron is more Clutch then Kobe, or any superstar for that matter. He's not a killer and doesn't want the ball in crunch time. I'll take Durant Mello Kobe Wade Robert Horry over Lebron any day. The sheer number of game winnin shots Kobe has put up should be enough IMO, of course. Statistics should go out the window, I would say the same about Jordan. He wasn't the greatest shooter but you want him to have the ball when it matters.
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The first two sentences in your post prove the first sentence in his post.

With the game tied or his team behind ( and within one possesion and the game clock under 24 seconds ) Kobe Bryant has hit 9 game tying/game winning shots in the playoffs.

While James has hit 7.

In 116 fewer playoff games and on 12 fewer shots.

Just saying.
 
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#167
#167
SandoVOL said:
I can't honestly believe that you think Lebron is more Clutch then Kobe, or any superstar for that matter. He's not a killer and doesn't want the ball in crunch time. I'll take Durant Mello Kobe Wade Robert Horry over Lebron any day. The sheer number of game winnin shots Kobe has put up should be enough IMO, of course. Statistics should go out the window, I would say the same about Jordan. He wasn't the greatest shooter but you want him to have the ball when it matters.
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How many is that? I was under the impression the number is a lot smaller than fans would guess.
 
#168
#168
This shows clutch stats over a 6 year period. These all came with under 24 seconds left, with the player in question being in a tie game, or at the most down by 2.

Lebron: 17/50 FG, 14/20 FT, 6 assists, 4 turnovers
Kobe: 14/56 FG, 12/15 FT, 1 assist, 5 turnovers

The saddest stat of all is that Kobe only had 1 assist, IMO.

NBA Game Winning Shots -- leading players
 
#169
#169
SandoVOL said:
I can't honestly believe that you think Lebron is more Clutch then Kobe, or any superstar for that matter. He's not a killer and doesn't want the ball in crunch time. I'll take Durant Mello Kobe Wade Robert Horry over Lebron any day. The sheer number of game winnin shots Kobe has put up should be enough IMO, of course. Statistics should go out the window, I would say the same about Jordan. He wasn't the greatest shooter but you want him to have the ball when it matters.
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Gilbert Arenas' Wizards, 2007 Detroit Pistons, and 2009 Orlando Magic would think otherwise.
 
#170
#170
n_huffhines said:
This shows clutch stats over a 6 year period. These all came with under 24 seconds left, with the player in question being in a tie game, or at the most down by 2.

Lebron: 17/50 FG, 14/20 FT, 6 assists, 4 turnovers
Kobe: 14/56 FG, 12/15 FT, 1 assist, 5 turnovers

The saddest stat of all is that Kobe only had 1 assist, IMO.

NBA Game Winning Shots -- leading players
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Lol. A random game mid season means nothing.
 
#171
#171
n_huffhines said:
This shows clutch stats over a 6 year period. These all came with under 24 seconds left, with the player in question being in a tie game, or at the most down by 2.

Lebron: 17/50 FG, 14/20 FT, 6 assists, 4 turnovers
Kobe: 14/56 FG, 12/15 FT, 1 assist, 5 turnovers

The saddest stat of all is that Kobe only had 1 assist, IMO.

NBA Game Winning Shots -- leading players
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As his playoff percentage is tied 1st.
 
#175
#175
Kendrick Perkins looks like Charlie Chaplin kicking his hat out there...hold onto the damn ball you goon.
 
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