'13 JUCO DT Toby Johnson

#1,026
#1,026
ACvol3 said:
The problem is, we had a gap of a couple classes that were garbage.. We don't have RS juniors and seniors that are stars like the bamas and lsu's... We have 3 good classes that are really contributing.. They have 4-6.. It takes time guys..
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Do you seriously expect that kind of logic to be accepted here? That would require rational readers. Do not get me wrong, I think you are totally correct. However, that gets in the way of all the agendas here. Good luck. Go Big Orange! ::clapping:
 
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#1,027
#1,027
Kingston Vol said:
Top 15 still isn't good enough to win the SEC. Period. I don't care what anyone says. Especially with the coaching staff we have.

We're not going to out-coach anyone of significance, and we can't out-talent anyone of significance.
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This post proves my point exactly.
 
#1,028
#1,028
mlsoft said:
I believe Dooley really hurt himself when Fall Camp was underway and he started talking about "for the first time I really feel good about this team" and said that finally we will be able to go head to head with anybody. He also went on to talk about how good it was to have depth across the board.

By saying that, he encouraged expectations among the fan base to go sky high and every one was drinking the "Dool-ade". All of that before we even played a single down against a real opponent so our fans began the season with unrealistically high expectations -- and that came back to bite him in the butt when we lost to Florida.

While a lot of what he said was true, the place where he most exaggerated was when he spoke about our depth.

Yes, for the first time since Dooley has been here we have warm bodies to back up our starters, and some of them have SEC level talent, but for the most part there is a significant drop-off between our starters and the second unit. That is not the case with the top teams in our conference -- Alabama, LSU, Georgia, and to a lesser extent even Florida all have a two and even three deep that are equally talented as their starters.

We are probably two years away from attaining that level of talent, strength, and experience in our backups across the board. We have not attained the level where we are on a level playing field with the elite yet, but we are making huge strides in that direction.

mlsoft
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I agree with your post. Compared to the previous two seasons, Coach Dooley was correct in saying that they finally have depth. Maybe he should have said depth relative and in comparison to the first two years. He still does not have very many seniors that contribute. So by SEC standards, The UT roster is still not up to par. i do see improvement.
 
#1,030
#1,030
The enrolled rankings per Rivals show Dooley has landed the 10th, 12th, and 12th(when they come out for the 2012 class) ranked classes in the country and the 4th, 5th and 4th ranked classes in the SEC...the idea that he is not recruiting the talent necessary to win at a high level in he SEC is absurd...

Whether or not he has the ability to do anything of note with said talent is a legit question...but to imply he isn't recruiting at a level needed to win in his league is ridiculous
 
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#1,031
#1,031
thunder5 said:
The enrolled rankings per Rivals show Dooley has landed the 10th, 12th, and 12th(when they come out for the 2012 class) ranked classes in the country and the 4th, 5th and 4th ranked classes in the SEC...the idea that he is not recruiting the talent necessary to win at a high level in he SEC is absurd...

Whether or not he has the ability to do anything of note with said talent is a legit question...but to imply he isn't recruiting at a level needed to win in his league is ridiculous
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My argument is he's not recruiting well enough to beat the best teams in this league. And that's really not debatable. Alabama, LSU, and Florida all get better talent.

Now, he's recruiting well enough to beat South Carolina, Georgia and Miss. St. But whether he'll be able to do it, as you said, is still yet to be answered. I don't have any faith in it, though.
 
#1,032
#1,032
Kingston Vol said:
My argument is he's not recruiting well enough to beat the best teams in this league. And that's really not debatable. Alabama, LSU, and Florida all get better talent.

Now, he's recruiting well enough to beat South Carolina, Georgia and Miss. St. But whether he'll be able to do it, as you said, is still yet to be answered. I don't have any faith in it, though.
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We can agree to disagree then...

The level of talent suggested by those rankings is high enough to not be physically overwhelmed by anyone...a good coach could develop that level of talent to a point where it could consistently beat any team...

The real question is "is Dooley that guy"
 
#1,033
#1,033
thunder5 said:
We can agree to disagree then...

The level of talent suggested by those rankings is high enough to not be physically overwhelmed by anyone...a good coach could develop that level of talent to a point where it could consistently beat any team...

The real question is "is Dooley that guy"
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This....Dooley can recruitwell enough he just has to win. Hell he closed hard after his first year when the program had a buzz. Now he's recruiting standing in sand. He can recruit he needs to win so he can sell a good product.
 
#1,034
#1,034
The Breakerboy said:
This....Dooley can recruitwell enough he just has to win. Hell he closed hard after his first year when the program had a buzz. Now he's recruiting standing in sand. He can recruit he needs to win so he can sell a good product.
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BB...you give me Chris Peterson or Gary Patterson with 4 straight years of classes ranked 10-15th overall and 4-6th in the SEC and I'll take that team any day of the week versus any team that Miles or Muschamp ever fields at their respective school...

Now...whether or not I'll ever say that for Dooley is up in he air for me...like you said...he needs to start winning soon
 
#1,035
#1,035
Kingston Vol said:
I want UT to be better than "good enough." I'm sorry if you don't feel the same way.

Yeah, Dooley is "good enough" to get top 15 classes.
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I'm pretty sure NOBODY is happy with "good enough" but you have to realize you don't go from a historical low point to a championship level team overnight.

Everybody with a lick of damned sense knew it was going to be a rebuilding process, and a difficult one at that.

Just because a few unrealistic, impatient, immature fans aren't happy with the rate of improvement doesn't mean that improvement isn't occurring. We are getting better. There is no doubt about that.

We have scored more points in the first 4 games than any similar stretch dating back to 1996. We have amassed more yards on offense in the first 4 games than any team in Tennessee history. You don't think that's showing progress? Get a *****ing grip.

Do we still have a lot of work to do? Hell yeah. Are we performing at 110% of our potential? HELL NO. We still have to build on our depth, talent, and execution. But FFS, be realistic with your expectations.

I'm getting sick of reading this sh!t. Our fanbase looks like a bunch of morons calling for the head coach's head after EVERY. SINGLE. miscue.
 
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#1,036
#1,036
Kingston Vol said:
Top 15 still isn't good enough to win the SEC. Period. I don't care what anyone says. Especially with the coaching staff we have.

We're not going to out-coach anyone of significance, and we can't out-talent anyone of significance.
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Naw bro, once Rivals' new rankings come out we will be top 3.
 
#1,037
#1,037
chavisut said:
Naw bro, once Rivals' new rankings come out we will be top 3.
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My favorite excuse: "Dooley sees things others don't in recruits. He's very detail oriented. Learned it from Saban." Did Saban offer? "Well, no. But everybody misses a couple. Even Nick Satan."
 
#1,038
#1,038
thunder5 said:
We can agree to disagree then...

The level of talent suggested by those rankings is high enough to not be physically overwhelmed by anyone...a good coach could develop that level of talent to a point where it could consistently beat any team...

The real question is "is Dooley that guy"
Click to expand...

Exactly. We can be fine pulling in the classes we have, especially with the impact players included in those classes. Each class needs 1 to 2, maybe 3, guys that can impact the roster right away, IMO.

But, coaching is what makes up the difference. If anyone expects UT to out-recruit UF, Bama, and LSU given the state of their programs and the state of UTs program is delusional. Moreover, let's not forget about the states we are talking about. It should go without being said that those programs have elite talent intheir backyard. We have to win first to even have a chance, IMO.
 
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#1,040
#1,040
Top 15 is good enough, if you have won 23 games in 3 years. Cause you know, top recruits beat down the doors for poor recruiters who don't win...

Fact is, Dooley can recruit. Those Top 15's turn into Top 5's if he proves he can coach.
 
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#1,044
#1,044
Kingston Vol said:
Top 15 still isn't good enough to win the SEC. Period. I don't care what anyone says. Especially with the coaching staff we have.

We're not going to out-coach anyone of significance, and we can't out-talent anyone of significance.
Click to expand...

The difference b/w top 15 and top 5 is very subjective often times.

Remember that #3 ranking we had in '07? Worked out great didn't it?

Remember that #10 class Kiffin pulled in? Yeah...we're reaping the benefits.

Meanwhile, Dooley has brought in top 15 classes each year he's been here and restocked the pantry with SEC caliber players, sprinkled in with some real stars.

Granted, I'll take top 5 classes everyday but evaluation services are not the end-all-be-all.
 
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#1,045
#1,045
Top 15 classes should lead to a better record, which in turn would lead to top 5 to 10 classes. We just haven't won enough to see that jump. I hope it happens soon.
 
#1,046
#1,046
Auburn's Class Rankings - According to Rivals

2010 - #4

2011 - #7

2012 - #10

According to Kingston, they should be ranked. These polls that come out every week are so stupid, they aren't even taking into account previous recruiting class rankings. Auburn fans can rest easy knowing that the current polls are completely bogus.
 
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#1,047
#1,047
orangeblood79 said:
Remember that #3 ranking we had in '07? Worked out great didn't it?
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ACvol3 said:
The problem is, we had a gap of a couple classes that were garbage.. We don't have RS juniors and seniors that are stars like the bamas and lsu's... We have 3 good classes that are really contributing.. They have 4-6.. It takes time guys..
Click to expand...

Actually closer to three years... '07 thru '09, 3 of 31 four star recruits went on to be multi year starters.....

That's essentially a great big whif in recruiting for 3 straight years... Very difficult to overcome especially in the SEC with three to four of your rivals consistantly recruiting in the top 10...

I don't care who the coach is...
 
#1,048
#1,048
thunderduck17 said:
Auburn's Class Rankings - According to Rivals

2010 - #4

2011 - #7

2012 - #10

According to Kingston, they should be ranked. These polls that come out every week are so stupid, they aren't even taking into account previous recruiting class rankings. Auburn fans can rest easy knowing that the current polls are completely bogus.
Click to expand...

Look at Texas right now. Even though they are ranked now, they have been completely irrelevant the past 2-3 years in terms of the NC picture, even in their own conference.
 
#1,050
#1,050
Why do the two things (coaching and recruiting) have to be mutually exclusive for you all to prove your points? I want both. Refuse to settle for less.
 
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