Let's Talk About Sin

#726
#726
Vol8188 said:
Your answer to my question was that god can do no wrong, because only god determines right or wrong. That's a weak answer.
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You have vastly simplified my answer, and misrepresented it.

Vol8188 said:
Yes, you have questioned some things. That doesn't mean that the vast majority of Christians are not afraid to question.
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It's easy to debate against people you've never met, by attributing motives.

Vol8188 said:
Did you miss the part were I was responding to your boyfriends...
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Is it even possible for you to respond in a manner that is not abusive and reliant on ad hominum?

Vol8188 said:
generalization of atheists?
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I guess that makes it OK for you to do?

Vol8188 said:
I guess you two must be all knowing as well.
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How does his statement have anything to do with me? You seem to operate by a faulty guilt by association?
 
#727
#727
orangeslice13 said:
The issue is pride. Having to answer to someone greater than themselves is something the prideful are not willing to do. It is that same pride and feeling better than everyone else that makes them pitty believers.
It is kinda sad really.
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C'mon slice. You're better than that.

Saying my lack of belief is an issue of pride is as foolish as me saying your belief is a product of fear.
 
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#729
#729
Orange_Crush said:
You have vastly simplified my answer, and misrepresented it.



It's easy to debate against people you've never met, by attributing motives.



Is it even possible for you to respond in a manner that is not abusive and reliant on ad hominum?



I guess that makes it OK for you to do?



How does his statement have anything to do with me? You seem to operate by a faulty guilt by association?
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You're right on all accounts. I've never met a Christian, and my abusive attacks are extremely childish for an omniscient being such as myself.
 
#736
#736
MercyPercy said:
Nah dude. God has "revealed" itself to them. But none are willing to explain or describe the revelation experience on here so far.

Imagine that.
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I've explained mine in private to several posters on here and in public in another thread. To those who want an honest discussion I'm an open book. But you are a troll and I own you nothing.
 
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#737
#737
orangeslice13 said:
I've explained mine in private to several posters on here and in public in another thread. To those who want an honest discussion I'm an open book. But you are a troll and I own you nothing.
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In other words, you had a bad trip on LSD and thought you saw the ghost of your grandpappy.

That's just what I'm gonna assume if you aren't willing to share. :whistling:
 
#741
#741
BigOrangeTrain said:
So why do you want to know things about God when you do not believe he exists?

Also why have none of you atheists answered my questions?
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To me, it's more about the mindset and reasoning. Do I care that you, specifically, believe in God? No, not at all.

I'm fascinated how 1 billion believers of one faith can dismiss the beliefs of 1 billion others as complete fantasy and wrong, yet justify their own beliefs as some how sound and reasonable. Muslims and Christians both look at the specific claims as ridiculous. Christ the son of God? Nonsense. Muhammad ascended to heaven on a winged horse? Ludicrous. Yet both are absolutely convinced they are right and the other is wrong and neither can seem to really understand how crazy it all sounds to somebody (even another believer) that doesn't subscribe to either.

I forget who said it, but we are all atheists with respect to somebody's version of a God, it's just there is a minority of us that takes it one God further than everyone else.
 
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#743
#743
rjd970 said:
I'm fascinated how 1 billion believers of one faith can dismiss the beliefs of 1 billion others as complete fantasy and wrong, yet justify their own beliefs as some how sound and reasonable. Muslims and Christians both look at the specific claims as ridiculous. Christ the son of God? Nonsense. Muhammad ascended to heaven on a winged horse? Ludicrous. Yet both are absolutely convinced they are right and the other is wrong and neither can seem to really understand how crazy it all sounds to somebody (even another believer) that doesn't subscribe to either.
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That's actually a great thought. I guess it boils down to what you view as factual evidence based on history.

Christians believe that Jesus came to the earth and died for all humans. A Christians goal is to be as "christ-like" as possible (Striving for the goal that is ahead of us all). Along the time before Christ, and during, God inspired writers to record writings that we view as inspired word. They are not mans writings, but Gods words, and we believe them.

The basic flaw in atheism (in my opinion) is that there is no viable way the worlds exist without a Creator. Saying the world was made scientifically is like throwing paint at a blank sheet and the Mona Lisa appearing. It's just not possible. So, to me, knowing that the Bible offers the most believable creationism, I'm forced to believe the whole thing.

Now, obviously I was raised in the church, and most of our young lives we just accept it. But to me, I left the church for a long time. I was stupid and hated to believe in something that controlled my life. But I realized that's what I need. I tried to look at religion objectively. And what i realized is I need to have a guide in my life. God guides me. By his teachings I become a better man, a better son, a better brother, and a better human being.

I don't care if someone doesn't believe what I believe. I simply ask someone to look at two thousands years of Christianity (recorded not only by Christians, but by non-Christians alike) compared to the history of others or the absolute illogical gibberish by some.

I hope this post made sense and I made myself understandable.
 
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#744
#744
Vol8188 said:
If at some point in your incoherent babbling I missed a question, please repost it.
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Why does it bother atheists so much that people believe in God? What's the big deal? Why must you atheists bash, mock and ridicule us who believe in God? Why are we stupid and illogical for our beliefs? What makes your non belief so much more special?
 
#745
#745
BigOrangeTrain said:
Why does it bother atheists so much that people believe in God? What's the big deal? Why must you atheists bash, mock and ridicule us who believe in God? Why are we stupid and illogical for our beliefs? What makes your non belief so much more special?
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That was one question? But I'll have some time later today and I'll try to address all questions then.
 
#746
#746
MercyPercy said:
In other words, you had a bad trip on LSD and thought you saw the ghost of your grandpappy.

That's just what I'm gonna assume if you aren't willing to share. :whistling:
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You should ask Thrasher, TRUT, OR PKT about what I shared with them. Maybe they will let you in on it although they probably see you as the same waste of space that I do.
 
#749
#749
BigOrangeTrain said:
Why does it bother atheists so much that people believe in God? What's the big deal? Why must you atheists bash, mock and ridicule us who believe in God? Why are we stupid and illogical for our beliefs? What makes your non belief so much more special?
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I'll take a stab at some of these and then probably follow up with what most will deem "TLDR" but will contain some points of my own and a few questions for you and yours.

Speaking for myself it doesn't bother me what people believe as long as it doesn't harm others. The problem that occurs though is that people of faith use their interpretation of whatever holy book their particular religion holds dear and use their interpretation and doctrine to try and affect social policy and or laws that govern us.

Not all atheists are alike and there are many empty headed atheists that have put little thought into why they don't believe in god so they can also be stupid and be made fun of for their own illogical beliefs.

So me personally; I grew up in church. I have two uncles that are preachers. I taught Sunday school, bible school and was also a camp counselor at a Christian summer camp. I am an atheist.

I remember it being quite hard when I first began to question, but now it's pretty easy. I wont go into why because in having these conversations with my religious family members on the regular I know that my reasons will come across as condescending.

So I have a few points to make and since I assume I'm dealing with Christians on this board I'll keep my focus on that particular religion.

Why do Christians constantly need affirmation and reinforcement in their faith from other Christians?
If you believe that god made the whole universe, knew you in your mothers womb before you were even born, sent his only son through an amazing set of circumstances to die for your sins ect ect..(not to diminish but no need for me to cover all the works and miracles of god and Jesus as listed in the bible) how can you ever even for an instance forget that>
I've never in my life, on a day when I've felt light on my feet or tossed a ball way up in the air for that matter ever doubted gravity. God is bigger than gravity right?

Secondly, for a group of people that believe in such an amazing thing there sure does seem to be a lot of disconnect. In so much as; there is so much as stake with what you state as your mantra yet there is less loyalty and dedication involved than many have for their favorite sports team.

Third,I find many Christians are severely lacking in having a knowledge or comprehension on how the bible was put together and how many contradictory and downright obscenely gross acts of genocide occur not only within its pages but by those who have promoted what those pages contain.
 
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#750
#750
LittleCat said:
That's actually a great thought. I guess it boils down to what you view as factual evidence based on history.

Christians believe that Jesus came to the earth and died for all humans. A Christians goal is to be as "christ-like" as possible (Striving for the goal that is ahead of us all). Along the time before Christ, and during, God inspired writers to record writings that we view as inspired word. They are not mans writings, but Gods words, and we believe them.

The basic flaw in atheism (in my opinion) is that there is no viable way the worlds exist without a Creator. Saying the world was made scientifically is like throwing paint at a blank sheet and the Mona Lisa appearing. It's just not possible. So, to me, knowing that the Bible offers the most believable creationism, I'm forced to believe the whole thing.

Now, obviously I was raised in the church, and most of our young lives we just accept it. But to me, I left the church for a long time. I was stupid and hated to believe in something that controlled my life. But I realized that's what I need. I tried to look at religion objectively. And what i realized is I need to have a guide in my life. God guides me. By his teachings I become a better man, a better son, a better brother, and a better human being.

I don't care if someone doesn't believe what I believe. I simply ask someone to look at two thousands years of Christianity (recorded not only by Christians, but by non-Christians alike) compared to the history of others or the absolute illogical gibberish by some.

I hope this post made sense and I made myself understandable.
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Sorry nothing personal, but this is what I mean. You lack knowledge. The story of Jesus is so plagiarized from other cultures that it's sad. Cultures around thousands of years with real documented history. History that doesn't come from one book edited by the crazy Emperor Nero and than rewritten and added to by King James.

As for your 2000 years of recorded history there is not even recorded proof that Jesus existed. Other than the bible that is, and even there the gospels were written 60-150 years in some cases after the actual events.

I'm not going to break down everything you said there because I don't want to come across as captain douche bag, but if I garner that you don't mind the debate we can continue on down the line.
 
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