Coach Caldwell Presser today

[spojo13]

I mean there is a realistic middle ground expectation between winning national championships and looking totally incompetent in a 43 point beat down. I don’t think it is entitled to expect us to be competitive.

 

[Volfan2012]

I mean there is a realistic middle ground expectation between winning national championships and looking totally incompetent in a 43 point beat down. I don’t think it is entitled to expect us to be competitive.

Totally and thus going forward we have a lot of chances to do that. Win or lose we should be able to make a game of it.

 

[glv98]

CKC is a young coach

Really? That horse gets a lot of mileage.

But Shes 37 yrs old, has been a head coach for a decade, and is completing her third year in D1. Tonight she will coach her 89th D1 game, over 100 D1 games by season’s end.

She’s relatively new to this level, but was way more new at it last year. While I definitely think she deserves more time, Im not sure how much longer we can cite inexperience as a reason for shortcomings.

I blame Danny White for part of it. He is the one that said we’re going to win Championships right away. So now everyone thinks she should be winning big. We have a lot of freshmen and the problem has been the seniors and juniors just aren't doing enough or leading enough. We shouldn't lose like we've lost some games that is what had magnified everything.

Thank you for stepping up to bat. Huckster DW and jacketgate lives on.

Seriously, in addition to DW bloviating, it’s also not helping her much that last season got so oversold.

 

[RetroVol]

It gives me hope that they did pull out of a February funk last year and made a decent tourney run.

It's interesting that, last year, the team seemed to get better after a stretch where they had more time for coaches to work in practice. Of course, the turn in the NCAAs was one, although that might have just been rest. But Spearman, in particular, I thought got better after Christmas and as we headed into the SEC schedule. This year, it has seemed much less to be the case that more practice time equals improved performance. Change in how Kim and her staff coaches? Or change in how players respond?

 

[glv98]

Caldwell said , “I told them I’m a better Coach for you guys when I’m just mad all the time, and that’s the version that we’re gonna get.”

Wonder how that will sound to prospective recruits?

Actually, I think coaching mad is the best strategy for her because I think it’s authentically her. Her default public basketball personality is slightly to completely pissed off. Always with the arms folded, the lips pursed and the eyebrows arched, even yesterday when she was walking back the disastrous weekend presser.

The words were right and I believe she meant them sincerely, but she just can’t help coming across defensive. Pretty sure that’s just part of her completely honest and authentic personality and her lack of experience suffering fools gladly. So I think it’s a good idea that she keeps it real with her team. Coach em mad if that helps.

 

[glv98]

It's interesting that, last year, the team seemed to get better after a stretch where they had more time for coaches to work in practice. Of course, the turn in the NCAAs was one, although that might have just been rest. But Spearman, in particular, I thought got better after Christmas and as we headed into the SEC schedule. This year, it has seemed much less to be the case that more practice time equals improved performance. Change in how Kim and her staff coaches? Or change in how players respond?

Both, and I don’t think how the staff coaches and how the players respond can or should be separated. And that’s sort of the issue that’s going on right now. Can those two ever be separated into sides and find success? I know the tough love approach that Kim favors is that yes they can and should be separated at some point. So we’ll see how it works out. .

 

[RetroVol]

Actually, I think coaching mad is the best strategy for her because I think it’s authentically her. Her default public basketball personality is slightly to completely pissed off. Always with the arms folded, the lips pursed and the eyebrows arched, even yesterday when she was walking back the disastrous weekend presser.

The words were right and I believe she meant them sincerely, but she just can’t help coming across defensive. Pretty sure that’s just part of her completely honest and authentic personality and her lack of experience suffering fools gladly. So I think it’s a good idea that she keeps it real with her team. Coach em mad if that helps.

I thought that part of the problem for Holly was that Pat had the "tough/mean/mad" role for the most part and Holly played "good cop/friend/encourager." I'm not sure those two roles work as well when reversed, or if no one is playing the tough/demanding role. Doesn't mean the coach doesn't love the players -- Pat did, Rick does, I think Kim does -- but it's just what's their focus and what message are they sending, especially to the team as a whole. (The conversations might be a little different when sitting down one-on-one with a player, even if challenging them to step up.)

Fair disclaimer: just me using my imagination. Never been close enough to this kind of coaching to know!

 

[glv98]

I thought that part of the problem for Holly was that Pat had the "tough/mean/mad" role for the most part and Holly played "good cop/friend/encourager." I'm not sure those two roles work as well when reversed, or if no one is playing the tough/demanding role. Doesn't mean the coach doesn't love the players -- Pat did, Rick does, I think Kim does -- but it's just what's their focus and what message are they sending, especially to the team as a whole. (The conversations might be a little different when sitting down one-on-one with a player, even if challenging them to step up.)

Fair disclaimer: just me using my imagination. Never been close enough to this kind of coaching to know!

Wasn’t saying that Kim’s pissed off demeanor isn’t effective. In fact, I was saying it is effective for her because I think it’s authentic. And I hope that’s what the players want, just someone to be honest and not blow smoke

But you’re right, usually needs to be a good cop offsetting a tough coach and I’m sure there is somewhere in all those folks sitting on the bench.

 

[madtownvol]

Actually, I think coaching mad is the best strategy for her because I think it’s authentically her. Her default public basketball personality is slightly to completely pissed off. Always with the arms folded, the lips pursed and the eyebrows arched, even yesterday when she was walking back the disastrous weekend presser.

The words were right and I believe she meant them sincerely, but she just can’t help coming across defensive. Pretty sure that’s just part of her completely honest and authentic personality and her lack of experience suffering fools gladly. So I think it’s a good idea that she keeps it real with her team. Coach em mad if that helps.

I agree. Being the mad chipmunk is her secret sauce persona. When she tries to moderate it, it is far more off putting than when she is in full-on angry rodent mode.

Having a kid might have had a mellowing effect but, it is kind of Bruce Banner, he can only control those Hulk instincts so long before his true power is revealed.

A bit of tangent. Geno seems to have mellowed a lot in recent years. I watched him do an interview with SVP last night and I honestly did not hate him (a first). I think that persona evolution comes as a necessary response to aging. The Geno of past years would now just be an angry old man screaming at the clouds, rather than a "take no prisoners tough guy" leader.

I never understood why anyone would want to play for someone who seemed so acerbic and mean-spirited but it was a vibe that obviously worked very well for him. So, perhaps being the "mad chipmunk" is CKC's equivalent. And CKC is in the perfect age bracket to do anger.

 

[chuckiepoo]

This true. We expect to have the best coaches and players, and we expect to win and win a lot. We expect to be competitive with the best teams.

It is not like we were losing a lot of games and missing the tourney with Holly and Kellie. And we were not really in a rebuilding situation - we just were not winning the big ones.

Some seem to think we were at "rock bottom" when CKC was hired. We were nowhere close to that.

So yes we expected progress.

There has been demonstrable progress in a key area. Recruiting.

Not giving a Rookie coach room for growth is where the expectations go off rail. I am happy with the performance thus far this year? Hell no, but I’m willing to ride.

I watched Karen Weekly’s presser this morning. It took her a few mistakes over the years, but she has learned the “appropriate” cliches. Of course she has a team chomping at the bit to start a season, too.

Kim’s team really never had that opportunity this year. IYKYK

 

[1reVOLver]

For those who preach patience and reference Dawn and the mellow fellow @madtownvol has learned to dislike a tiny bit less, here are some pesky things known as
factual data.

Dawn first.



Geno-

As the owner/chef of a restaurant I worked at in the 1960s used to say,
“If they're in such a f…ng hurry, tell them to go to McDonald's. Good food takes time.”

 

[chuckiepoo]

He seems to be mad in a good way though and she gets mad in a more hostile way.

…not sure what to make of this one…

Barnes is a grumpy grandpa and Kim is a gold digging betch?

 

[AllVols3]

I was not expecting a NC this year, next year or the year after. I was also not expecting two embarrassing losses on a national stage where the team looked like it had no clue how to play basketball either.

Welcome to the reality of where the LV program was/is.

 

[Volfan1017]

I mean there is a realistic middle ground expectation between winning national championships and looking totally incompetent in a 43 point beat down. I don’t think it is entitled to expect us to be competitive.

You’re spot on, particularly with the roster we have. We should expect our team to look more competitive than Auburn, Arkansas, or Texas A&M did against them with the talent we have (which we did not). I’m not asking for a national championship right away, but I am asking to not have to turn the game off half way through.

 

[brittannica]

For those who preach patience and reference Dawn and the mellow fellow @madtownvol has learned to dislike a tiny bit less, here are some pesky things known as
factual data.

Dawn first.

View attachment 813992View attachment 813993

Geno-

As the owner/chef of a restaurant I worked at in the 1960s used to say,
“If they're in such a f…ng hurry, tell them to go to McDonald's. Good food takes time.”

for the sake of argument though, couldn't we argue that the lady vols are in a different place than both of those programs were when those respective coaches took over?

 

[volsagain]

for the sake of argument though, couldn't we argue that the lady vols are in a different place than both of those programs were when those respective coaches took over?

No doubt about that. One thing that really helped Dawn out was most of the SEC was going through a lot of coaching charges. Similar to what our football team did for about 15 years just couldn't get the right coach. LSU, Texas, Oklahoma, Vandy, Kentucky and of course South Carolina all have strong coaches and support. Let's give it little more time see if she can right the ship. Next year will depend on how well we do in the portal and if we can retain all the players we want.

 

[1reVOLver]

for the sake of argument though, couldn't we argue that the lady vols are in a different place than both of those programs were when those respective coaches took over?

Absolutely! Temple and Lower Carolina were in bad shape, and CT barely had a WBB program when Dawn and Mr. Mellow arrived. Our program was, despite revisionist history, in a pretty solid B++ to A- condition.

 

[Puppeteer]

I agree. Being the mad chipmunk is her secret sauce persona. When she tries to moderate it, it is far more off putting than when she is in full-on angry rodent mode.

Having a kid might have had a mellowing effect but, it is kind of Bruce Banner, he can only control those Hulk instincts so long before his true power is revealed.

A bit of tangent. Geno seems to have mellowed a lot in recent years. I watched him do an interview with SVP last night and I honestly did not hate him (a first). I think that persona evolution comes a necessary response to aging. The Geno of past years would now just be an angry old man screaming at the clouds, rather than a "take no prisoners tough guy" leader.

I never understood why anyone would want to play for someone who seemed so acerbic and mean-spirited butwever it was a vibe that obviously worked very well for him. So, perhaps being the "mad chipmunk" is CKC's equivalent. And CKC is in the perfect age bracket to do anger.

All the great coaches come across as mean spirited, tough assed, no nonsense dictators! Pat, Geno, Mulkey, Dawn, Muffet. Not one projects/projected sunshine and rainbows! However, behind closed doors and outside of games and practices, they must be completely different people because all seem to be well liked and respected by peers and players...current and former. However, I do think while he has mellowed quite a bit over the years that Geno took that obnoxious, tough assed attitude to the extreme.

 

[Chipperbones]

I blame Danny White for part of it. He is the one that said were going to win Championships right away. So now everyone thinks she should be winning big. We have a lot of freshmen and the problem has been the seniors and juniors just aren't doing enough or leading enough. We shouldn't lose like we've lost some games that is what had magnified everything.

To everyone who says give it time maybe 7,10, 13 years to win a big one, why did we hire a coach with that as an expectation? I don’t think Kim thinks the fan base would be that patient regardless of how long it took Dawn, Geno etc. I hope she can succeed but if we went in with that expectation for her we should have hired a proven coach. The brand deserves it.

 

[chuckiepoo]

for the sake of argument though, couldn't we argue that the lady vols are in a different place than both of those programs were when those respective coaches took over?

On the other side of that spectrum, let’s take a look at the program when Pat Head took the reins. Joan Cronan, while maturing into an excellent AD, absolutely sucked at coaching roundyball. 8-12, ‘69-70.
Margaret Hutson, on the other hand, was a master, 60-19 over four years, handing Pat a team with a 25-2 record.

Former WBB Coach Hutson Dies - University of Tennessee Athletics

June 12, 2017

utsports.com

 

[madtownvol]

Absolutely! Temple and Lower Carolina were in bad shape, and CT barely had a WBB program when Dawn and Mr. Mellow arrived. Our program was, despite revisionist history, in a pretty solid B++ to A- condition.

On that point, Texas might be the better comparison. Vic Schaefer replaced Karen Ashton who had a record of 184-83 and numerous S16 appearances but she also had a rep for not being able to win big games.

Vic Schaefer came in and took his team to the elite 8 in his first season, a bridge that the former coach could never cross.

Of course, V.S. type coaches don't grown on trees but what makes the LVs situation unusual is that DW went for a relatively inexperienced coach (I know, we all know this).

At the time, Kenny Brooks was probably the most experienced coach on the market (though he was hired by KY before KJH was fired).

KY's AD looked like he made a pretty good choice last season but at 5-6 in conference probably some questions are now being asked about Brooks by that fan base.

Two years ago, DW hiring Brooks would have likely been well-received; I don't think that would be the case now.

So, there are no sure bets...

 

[chuckiepoo]

Two years ago, DW hiring Brooks would have likely been well-received; I don't think that would be the case now.

So, there are no sure bets...

Kudos.

Prolly why they let him dress hissef…

 

[VolTenn25]

& how many years did it take the outsider known as Pat Summitt to start winning big? Y’all wanna compare everyone to her so badly… go ahead & run that comparison. Never mind the fact that basketball changes every year & the talent changes every year & now NIL changes everything. Gonna be harder to decipher who wants to come to play & who wants to just come here for money & a little recognition. These bad losses are bad. No doubt. No excuse for that. But unfortunately. That happens sometimes. Did they miss on the portal acquisitions? No doubt. Hopefully they learn from it & dig deeper on the people they recruit next year.

 

[1reVOLver]

Kudos.

Prolly why they let him dress hissef…

Kenny or Mr. Jaquettes?

 

[chuckiepoo]

Kenny or Mr. Jaquettes?

The Jackettootitus. Rarely seen in public. Almost always incognito behind dark sunglasses. The jacket is always the tell…

I personally wouldn’t place Kenny on any list of snappy dressers either.