GAME THREAD: Tennessee at Mississippi State, Thursday, 6:30 CST, 7:30 EST, SECN+

#401
#401
glv98 said:
Really? I could be wrong, but I thought they subbed in four at times and even three a couple of times.
Click to expand...

This is AI. ChatGPT, in this case. I first copied the play-by-play from ESPN into a Word doc and saved as a pdf, then gave it to ChatGPT for analysis. May be more than anyone wants, and I don't know why it put MiaP and MyaP in bold!

Here’s the Tennessee vs. Mississippi State substitution report in the same “wave + lineup-unit code” style.

Notes on interpretation

  • I list only moments when Tennessee made at least one substitution (MSU-only subs omitted).
  • If Tennessee subbed at the same game clock time but separated by another action (e.g., free throws), I treat those as separate substitution points (example: 7:10 in Q3 shows up twice).

Tennessee starters (opening 10:00)​

S: Civil / Barker / Cooper / Robertson / MiaP

Lineup-unit codes used​

  • S (starters): Civil, Barker, Cooper, Robertson, MiaP
  • A: Latham, Prawl, MyaP, Cooper, Spearman
  • B: Civil, Barker, Hurst, Robertson, MiaP
  • C: Latham, Prawl, Cooper, Spearman, MiaP
  • D: Civil, Barker, Robertson, Spearman, MiaP
  • E: Latham, Barker, Cooper, Spearman, MiaP
  • F: Barker, Cooper, Robertson, Spearman, MiaP
  • G: Latham, Prawl, Barker, Spearman, MiaP
  • H: Latham, Barker, Robertson, Spearman, MiaP
  • X(...): one-off lineup (shown inline)

Wave counts (net changes)​

  • 5-for-5: 9
  • 4-for-4: 4
  • 3-for-3: 3
  • 2-for-2: 9
  • 1-for-1: 11

Q1 — substitution points​

  • 8:24 | 2–2 (+0) [Δ0] | S → A (4-for-4)
  • 7:12 | 2–4 (-2) [Δ-2] | A → B (5-for-5)
  • 5:38 | 6–4 (+2) [Δ+4] | B → S (1-for-1: OUT Hurst; IN Cooper)
  • 4:05 | 11–10 (+1) [Δ-1] | S → A (4-for-4)
  • 2:39 | 16–16 (+0) [Δ-1] | A → B (5-for-5)
  • 1:29 | 24–17 (+7) [Δ+7] | B → F (2-for-2: OUT Hurst, Civil; IN Spearman, Cooper)
  • 0:53 | 25–19 (+6) [Δ-1] | F → C (2-for-2: OUT Barker, Robertson; IN Prawl, Latham)
  • 0:03 | 25–19 (+6) [Δ0] | C → G (1-for-1: OUT Cooper; IN Barker)

Q2 — substitution points​

  • 10:00 | 26–19 (+7) [Δ+1] | G → B (3-for-3)
  • 8:07 | 32–26 (+6) [Δ-1] | B → A (5-for-5)
  • 5:54 | 37–26 (+11) [Δ+5] | A → D (4-for-4)
  • 4:36 | 42–29 (+13) [Δ+2] | D → X(Latham/Prawl/Barker/MyaP/Cooper) (4-for-4)
  • 4:12 | 42–31 (+11) [Δ-2] | X(Latham/Prawl/Barker/MyaP/Cooper) → A (1-for-1: OUT Barker; IN Spearman)
  • 1:40 | 46–35 (+11) [Δ0] | A → B (5-for-5)
  • 1:00 | 46–35 (+11) [Δ0] | B → X(Civil/Barker/MiaP/Cooper/Spearman) (2-for-2: OUT Robertson, Hurst; IN Cooper, Spearman)

Q3 — substitution points​

  • 8:48 | 50–37 (+13) [Δ+2] | X(Civil/Barker/MiaP/Cooper/Spearman) → B (2-for-2: OUT Spearman, Cooper; IN Robertson, Hurst)
  • 8:14 | 52–39 (+13) [Δ0] | B → D (1-for-1: OUT Hurst; IN Spearman)
  • 7:10 | 53–41 (+12) [Δ-1] | D → C (3-for-3)
  • 7:10 | 55–41 (+14) [Δ+2] | C → A (1-for-1: OUT MiaP; IN MyaP)
  • 5:14 | 60–45 (+15) [Δ+1] | A → B (5-for-5)
  • 3:54 | 63–47 (+16) [Δ+1] | B → A (5-for-5)
  • 2:39 | 66–48 (+18) [Δ+2] | A → B (5-for-5)
  • 1:49 | 66–52 (+14) [Δ-4] | B → A (5-for-5)
  • 1:28 | 66–54 (+12) [Δ-2] | A → C (1-for-1: OUT MyaP; IN MiaP)
  • 1:11 | 66–55 (+11) [Δ-1] | C → G (1-for-1: OUT Cooper; IN Barker)
  • 0:10 | 70–59 (+11) [Δ0] | G → H (1-for-1: OUT Prawl; IN Robertson)

Q4 — substitution points​

  • 10:00 | 70–59 (+11) [Δ0] | H → B (2-for-2: OUT Spearman, Latham; IN Hurst, Civil)
  • 8:51 | 70–63 (+7) [Δ-4] | B → A (5-for-5)
  • 8:21 | 70–63 (+7) [Δ0] | A → F (3-for-3)
  • 6:42 | 74–67 (+7) [Δ0] | F → E (1-for-1: OUT Robertson; IN Latham)
  • 5:32 | 76–67 (+9) [Δ+2] | E → X(Latham/Prawl/Barker/Robertson/Spearman) (2-for-2: OUT MiaP, Cooper; IN Robertson, Prawl)
  • 5:24 | 76–67 (+9) [Δ0] | X(Latham/Prawl/Barker/Robertson/Spearman) → E (2-for-2: OUT Robertson, Prawl; IN MiaP, Cooper)
  • 3:17 | 82–69 (+13) [Δ+4] | E → H (1-for-1: OUT Cooper; IN Robertson)
  • 3:02 | 82–71 (+11) [Δ-2] | H → D (1-for-1: OUT Latham; IN Civil)
  • 1:25 | 88–77 (+11) [Δ0] | D → E (2-for-2: OUT Robertson, Civil; IN Latham, Cooper)
  • 1:09 | 88–77 (+11) [Δ0] | E → X(Latham/Barker/MiaP/Robertson/Cooper) (1-for-1: OUT Spearman; IN Robertson)
0:00 | FINAL 90–80 (+10) [Δ-1] (last segment after the final Tennessee sub)
 
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#402
#402
I thought overall this was an outstanding performance by the Lady Vols. We made some huge shots when we needed to and we got tough when things got close. The positives were certainly the play of the freshmen and that we went from 25 turnovers to 11 in this game. We continue to improve the shot selection and no longer settling for early threes or even sometimes when we have a three. We instead drive the basket and make the pass out of traffic numerous times. I thought overall we defended well. Obvious to me that Miss St was ready to play they were energized and brought their A game. They made shots that I just couldn't believe went in. They couldn't make a three just 2 of 13 and for a team that shoots 33 percent that was a huge positive for us.

The negatives were that the rebounding still is not where we need it to be. They got a lot of points off of offensive rebounds. We fouled a lot, but I would say that some were not that visible to me. I thought the Refs gave them some really questionable calls later in the game. Our press was neither a positive or a negative we created a few turnovers out of it and they got a few uncontested layups out of it so I say it all evened out. From what I saw we only all out pressed on just a few possessions and were mostly just pressing some time off the 30 second clock and playing half court defense most of the time.

Mia Pauldo is finally showing the ability I thought she had and played with in high school. I think she is finally getting the trust from the Coaching Staff to be the leader on the court. I think her sister is an exceptional player as well just hasn't got the court time yet since she is playing behind Robertson and Kaniya. We starting to see less thinking and more playing free by the freshmen and the whole team. I loved the aggressive play of Pauldo, Prawl, and Civil. Look forward to seeing how they continue to grow as the season progresses.
 
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#404
#404
I thought overall this was an outstanding performance by the Lady Vols. We made some huge shots when we needed to and we got tough when things got close. The positives were certainly the play of the freshmen and that we went from 25 turnovers to 11 in this game. We continue to improve the shot selection and no longer settling for early threes or even sometimes when we have a three. We instead drive the basket and make the pass out of traffic numerous times. I thought overall we defended well. Obvious to me that Miss St was ready to play they were energized and brought their A game. They made shots that I just couldn't believe went in. They couldn't make a three just 2 of 13 and for a team that shoots 33 percent that was a huge positive for us.

The negatives were that the rebounding still is not where we need it to be. They got a lot of points off of offensive rebounds. We fouled a lot, but I would say that some were not that visible to me. I thought the Refs gave them some really questionable calls later in the game. Our press was neither a positive or a negative we created a few turnovers out of it and they got a few uncontested layups out of it so I say it all evened out. From what I saw we only all out pressed on just a few possessions and were mostly just pressing some time off the 30 second clock and playing half court defense most of the time.

Mia Pauldo is finally showing the ability I thought she had and played with in high school. I think she is finally getting the trust from the Coaching Staff to be the leader on the court. I think her sister is an exceptional player as well just hasn't got the court time yet since she is playing behind Robertson and Kaniya. We starting to see less thinking and more playing free by the freshmen and the whole team. I loved the aggressive play of Pauldo, Prawl, and Civil. Look forward to seeing how they continue to grow as the season progresses.
 
#409
#409
PineyBluff Vol said:
Click to expand...

Thank you, PineyBluff, for posting. I'm fixin' to b & m about the video itself--not about you! ;)

Chàng Trai Miền Tây 66 has evidently found a legal way of getting around the normal barriers to posting game videos, but they are AWFUL! I hope we can soon find another recording source for full game Lady Vol videos.

Chàng's videos are recorded in zoom mode, so you miss a lot of action and critical spacing in the cut off margins. Zoom also plays havoc with any special graphics generated by the network's producers.

Worst of all, there is no game-related rhyme or reason to the 1-minute cuts removed from the recording. So, for example, you can (and do) miss two Pauldo made shots while getting to watch every boring second of a referees' timeout.

I'm sure it's all just an algorythm designed to get around legal issues and YouTube rules. But in a free market, the bottom has now been established. Plenty of room remains for someone to excel.
 
#410
#410
Volfan2012 said:
We fouled a lot, but I would say that some were not that visible to me. I thought the Refs gave them some really questionable calls later in the game.
Click to expand...

I wonder if, when we play pressing, close, physical defense all game, the refs don't start to think, "They are making a lot of contact." It's not that we're making more egregious contact than the other team, we're just on them all the time, all over the court, and it looks "off." So, once that belief starts to form in the refs' minds, the start seeing fouls, especially if we are head (sense of fairness kicks in). After all, "Believing is seeing," a/k/a "confirmation bias."

Volfan2012 said:
From what I saw we only all out pressed on just a few possessions and were mostly just pressing some time off the 30 second clock and playing half court defense most of the time.
Click to expand...

And yet we still got at least one 10-second call and forced them to take a time out to avoid another. We've gotten used to it, but those are incredibly rare. And demoralizing to the other team. It's not something they are used to having to think about. Mental pressure, added to physical pressure, often leading to mistakes.
 
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#411
#411
RetroVol said:
[...]
And yet we still got at least one 10-second call and forced them to take a time out to avoid another. We've gotten used to it, but those are incredibly rare. And demoralizing to the other team. It's not something they are used to having to think about. Mental pressure, added to physical pressure, often leading to mistakes.
Click to expand...
I agree. Now, instead of looking for proof in the press-generated numerical stats, I'm thinking of our press as more of a psyop whose effects creep into many other areas of the opponent's game.
 
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#412
#412
RetroVol said:
I was worried going into this game that MissST, at home, would come out determined to shoot better than at Oklahoma, and they did, at least on 2s - 52.8% on TOUGH shots. Also 18-21, 86% on FTs. Only 2-13 on 3s for 15%. The 3s are below their season average, but that's two games in a row when, under pressure, they didn't fall. Will be interesting when we play them again to see how that develops for them.

That said, the LVs went on the road in the SEC against a team with something to prove and who had a good night statistically for the most part and walked out with a double-digit win. Not bad, not bad at all. On the whole "low floor, high ceiling" aspect of that team, I think the floor is starting to rise. Won't really know their ceiling until we hit the February part of their schedule.

The Freshmen: As was said above about Mia, wowsie! Mia, as she said in the post-game (then, cutely, tried to take it back or spread to her team), knows she can compete. The others are getting there. Four are just exceptional defensively. I'm really comfortable when Mia is on the ball handler -- she's quick, fast, and works at it. Mya seems to be the same, just haven't seen her as much. I expect as they continue to get comfortable we'll see them getting more steals as they anticipate passes, collapse on dribbling bigs, etc. Jaida has been a defensive force since she started and still is. Deniya is a very physical 6-2 and last night looked quicker than I had thought. Plus, like the others, she works. Lauren doesn't seem as athletic as the other four, but she's smart, aware, has good hands, and also seems to work at it. I think she will continue to improve.

Offensively, Mia is becoming a force. I bet she's getting featured in some scouting reports. Mya has shown she can explode. Jaida still seems a little out of control, but she makes some really athletic shots. Still think she needs to learn to vary her speed more. Coop is a great role model for her. Deniya looks great going to the rim -- I think she's just been too focused on the "going" to attend to the "finishing." As she gets more comfortable and realizes she can "go" at this level, she'll get better at finishing. Already seeing it some. Lauren is showing some ability to rebound and put back, plus i like the look of her 3pt shot. Wish I knew what she's shooting in practice.

But, overall, this group is rapidly living up to expectations as the #1/2 recruiting class. Kudos to Coach Kim and her staff! It's no small feat to bring five talented freshmen along together while assessing and integrating three transfers into a different style of play. I credit the system's ability to give meaningful minutes to players 8-10 with a lot of this. And, of course, coaching on lessons learned from those minutes.

The Transfers: Janiah is a force and seems to be settling in more and more. Robertson is still a little out-of-control, but she works at defense and I think still has upside. That said, Mia's the PG right now. I'm so sad for Jersey. It's just not working out, and we're rapidly getting to the part of the season where it's going to be hard for her to find herself.

The Stalwarts: Coop's a star; even better than last year. I so want another year! Kaniya is an excellent defender, and her offensive skills are sometimes underappreciated. Zee started the year "off" for whatever reason, but has improved, though last night wasn't her best. I think she's still got another gear, and we're going to need it. Love Kaia for sticking it out and giving the effort, but perhaps she just lost too much ground in experience and development due to the injury. I don't see her as much of a factor going forward.

The Coaches: Yeah, yeah -- tougher games coming. But Kim and her staff have held this team together, integrating all the new pieces through a pre-season that offered challenges we weren't ready for. Losing Ruby, that missed opportunity at NC State. Then the debacles at UCLA and Louisville. But, they sandwiched Stanford in their and have come back and are playing their best basketball as we start the SEC run. And it's more than "the system." Someone mentioned how much better Coop's 3pt shot looks, and she's hitting better. The analytics clearly helped Deniya start to find her role, and may be helping others. As noted, she's varying the intensity o the press, etc. I admit -- I'm a Kim Caldwell fan because I like interesting things, and Kim's system is interesting. But I hope I'm setting aside my positive bias about Kim and her staff in saying that this is starting to look like a well-coached team, though "the system" will always make "well-coached" look a little different than how it looks for more traditional teams.

Looking forward to the rest of the season!
Click to expand...
You keep talking 😉 really like your write ups. Great job I rarely read extra long posts but really enjoy your prospective. Never to high or to low not seen through orange colored glasses.
 
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#413
#413
Miss St played four players over 30 minutes. Tennessee's top was 27 and out 10th place (Lauren Hurst) played 10, a full quarter. Someone earlier commented about how teams play in the game after they play us. I don't know about that overall, but Miss St had a tough game against OK, then gave it their all against us burning a lot of energy for extended minutes. Plus they shot 2s out of their minds. Sunday in Oxford could be ugly.
 
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#415
#415
RetroVol said:
Miss St played four players over 30 minutes. Tennessee's top was 27 and out 10th place (Lauren Hurst) played 10, a full quarter. Someone earlier commented about how teams play in the game after they play us. I don't know about that overall, but Miss St had a tough game against OK, then gave it their all against us burning a lot of energy for extended minutes. Plus they shot 2s out of their minds. Sunday in Oxford could be ugly.
Click to expand...
To that point, playing us limits how much they can do and how hard they can in their subsequent practices practicing for their next game.

In the postgame presser, State's coach said, "But you know what I love about this team? Is how they practice. We practice hard. [...] Tomorrow, I've got to be smart because I have a lot of heavy minutes."
 
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#416
#416
Volfan2012 said:
I thought overall this was an outstanding performance by the Lady Vols. We made some huge shots when we needed to and we got tough when things got close. The positives were certainly the play of the freshmen and that we went from 25 turnovers to 11 in this game. We continue to improve the shot selection and no longer settling for early threes or even sometimes when we have a three. We instead drive the basket and make the pass out of traffic numerous times. I thought overall we defended well. Obvious to me that Miss St was ready to play they were energized and brought their A game. They made shots that I just couldn't believe went in. They couldn't make a three just 2 of 13 and for a team that shoots 33 percent that was a huge positive for us.

The negatives were that the rebounding still is not where we need it to be. They got a lot of points off of offensive rebounds. We fouled a lot, but I would say that some were not that visible to me. I thought the Refs gave them some really questionable calls later in the game. Our press was neither a positive or a negative we created a few turnovers out of it and they got a few uncontested layups out of it so I say it all evened out. From what I saw we only all out pressed on just a few possessions and were mostly just pressing some time off the 30 second clock and playing half court defense most of the time.

Mia Pauldo is finally showing the ability I thought she had and played with in high school. I think she is finally getting the trust from the Coaching Staff to be the leader on the court. I think her sister is an exceptional player as well just hasn't got the court time yet since she is playing behind Robertson and Kaniya. We starting to see less thinking and more playing free by the freshmen and the whole team. I loved the aggressive play of Pauldo, Prawl, and Civil. Look forward to seeing how they continue to grow as the season progresses.
Click to expand...
Starting the conference schedule with 2 road is a challenge. Fortunately, these games were not against powerhouses. I am pleasantly surprised the LVs have shot the ball pretty well in these road games. We can get into all kinds of nuanced detail about where the team needs to improve but making shots erases a lot of problems.
 
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#417
#417
Even though we have played only bottom half teams it’s still nice to see us in the top 4 of the league at the moment. This is a very tough conference and higher ranked teams have lost to worse opponents already.

In the SEC you HAVE to win the games you HAVE to win or you’re cooked. Particularly important to win at home but even better when you can steal games on the road.
 
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#418
#418
Thoughts after seeing the game:
(1) Before the next game with Miss St, I'd encourage CKC to speak to each ref, pre-game, about watching for illegal screens [click image to enlarge].

(2) Before the next game with anybody, I'd encourage CKC to ask each ref, pre-game, "Do the Pauldos have the same right to their defensive space as every other player?"

The question needs to be framed that way because if the calls are based on "amount of contact," then physics rules and lightweight bodies will be legal to launch.
-------------------
1768000306897.png
 
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#419
#419
@BruisedOrange -- really interesting. I don't know the rules well enough to be sure, but swinging that hip out looks wrong. Super work on the images!

As for defensive space, maybe someone could explain to me how the rules allow offensive players to "back down" a player under the goal?
 
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#420
#420
Can we tell from that breakdown what the longest consecutive shift anyone played was?
 
#421
#421
BruisedOrange said:
Thoughts after seeing the game:
(1) Before the next game with Miss St, I'd encourage CKC to speak to each ref, pre-game, about watching for illegal screens [click image to enlarge].

(2) Before the next game with anybody, I'd encourage CKC to ask each ref, pre-game, "Do the Pauldos have the same right to their defensive space as every other player?"

The question needs to be framed that way because if the calls are based on "amount of contact," then physics rules and lightweight bodies will be legal to launch.
-------------------
View attachment 805262
Click to expand...

Yeah in general they have been a lot more lax on illegal screen calls this season. She definitely needs to be staying on the officials about it.

Especially when we play Kentucky. They do it a lot.

I will say, I do LOVE that they went away from the “one touch” rule. It’s nice to see the women playing actual basketball again and having some contact on the perimeter allowed. It plays to our favor a great deal as well. Texas also.

Geno is gonna hate it. He’s the one who really pushed for the “freedom of movement” rules. He knows they play in a non-physical, weak conference and was always worried about getting beat up in the ncaa tournament.
 
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#422
#422
RetroVol said:
@BruisedOrange -- really interesting. I don't know the rules well enough to be sure, but swinging that hip out looks wrong. Super work on the images!

As for defensive space, maybe someone could explain to me how the rules allow offensive players to "back down" a player under the goal?
Click to expand...

Generally I believe your feet are supposed to be under your shoulders for it to be a legal screen. You cannot spread your lower body out like that and then hip check the defender. Richardson did that a ton last night.
 
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#424
#424
RespectAPA said:
I don't fully understand offensive rating and defensive rating, but Robertson is at the bottom of both metrics in SEC play so far among the qualified 10. She was the only girl in the negatives in plusminus tonight. (Her plusminus was fine in the other two games, but I guess because of who she was on the court with, not because of any actual production)
Click to expand...
Her plus/minus tonight probably looks worse because she wasn’t playing with Mia
 
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#425
#425
Got a chance to sit down and watch this game fully uninterrupted and talk about the difference a week makes. The pace was finally starting to look like it should, especially on the offensive side of things, and the overthinking every shot was a lot less noticeable. The defense and rebounding still look to be a work in progress, but it was better. Hopefully, the kind of lapse they had between the 3rd and 4th quarter, where they were up 18 points and blew that lead, starts to become less frequent, but this team looks to have improved 100% in the last 7 days. P.S. That starting lineup was 🔥
 
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