GAME THREAD: Tennessee at Mississippi State, Thursday, 6:30 CST, 7:30 EST, SECN+

[RetroVol]

Can we tell from that breakdown what the longest consecutive shift anyone played was?

Here’s each Tennessee player’s single-longest uninterrupted on-court stint vs Mississippi State (measured by game clock, i.e., from when they checked in until they next checked out — including across quarter breaks if they stayed in).

• Janiah Barker: 8:21 — Q4 8:21 → Q4 0:00
• Zee Spearman: 7:42 — Q4 8:51 → Q4 1:09
• Mia Pauldo: 5:24 — Q4 5:24 → Q4 0:00
• Jaida Civil: 4:30 — Q2 1:40 → Q3 7:10
• Alyssa Latham: 3:40 — Q4 6:42 → Q4 3:02
• Talaysia Cooper: 3:19 — Q4 8:51 → Q4 5:32
• Nya Robertson: 3:07 — Q1 7:12 → Q1 4:05
• Deniya Prawl: 2:56 — Q2 4:36 → Q2 1:40
• Mya Pauldo: 2:56 — Q2 4:36 → Q2 1:40
• Lauren Hurst: 1:53 — Q2 10:00 → Q2 8:07

 

[glv98]

Here’s each Tennessee player’s single-longest uninterrupted on-court stint vs Mississippi State (measured by game clock, i.e., from when they checked in until they next checked out — including across quarter breaks if they stayed in).

• Janiah Barker: 8:21 — Q4 8:21 → Q4 0:00
• Zee Spearman: 7:42 — Q4 8:51 → Q4 1:09
• Mia Pauldo: 5:24 — Q4 5:24 → Q4 0:00
• Jaida Civil: 4:30 — Q2 1:40 → Q3 7:10
• Alyssa Latham: 3:40 — Q4 6:42 → Q4 3:02
• Talaysia Cooper: 3:19 — Q4 8:51 → Q4 5:32
• Nya Robertson: 3:07 — Q1 7:12 → Q1 4:05
• Deniya Prawl: 2:56 — Q2 4:36 → Q2 1:40
• Mya Pauldo: 2:56 — Q2 4:36 → Q2 1:40
• Lauren Hurst: 1:53 — Q2 10:00 → Q2 8:07

Great info thanks. Wow 8 mins in a row? Is that an all time Caldwell record?

And we thought the two minute shifts would be the last part of the system to go. Shes turned away much faster than I thought she would.

That said, I expect her to press the bejeez out of Arky early and often bc they’re awful. So she’ll probably go back to 2 min subbing for everyone. Just not in serious games.

 

[RetroVol]

Great info thanks. Wow 8 mins in a row? Is that an all time Caldwell record?

And we thought the two minute shifts would be the last part of the system to go. Shes turned away much faster than I thought she would.

That said, I expect her to press the bejeez out of Arky early and often bc they’re awful. So she’ll probably go back to 2 min subbing for everyone. Just not in serious games.

Yeah, that's interesting. But, that 8:21 stretch for Barker was in the fourth quarter. In fact, here's the minutes for each player who appeared in the 4th quarter (ChatGPT):

Janiah Barker — 9:30
Mia Pauldo — 9:22
Zee Spearman — 7:42
Talaysia Cooper — 6:51
Nya Robertson — 5:57
Alyssa Latham — 5:35
Jaida Civil — 2:46
Lauren Hurst — 1:09
Deniya Prawl — 0:38
Mya Pauldo — 0:30


AND, here's the minute distribution for the game for the players who played over 20 minutes:

Pauldo, Mia -- 27
Barker, Janiah -- 27
Spearman, Zee -- 26
Cooper, Talaysia -- 25

So, 35% of Barker's minutes were in the 4th quarter. And pretty close to the same for MiaP. Zee was right at 30% of her total minutes and a little over 27% for Talaysia.

Or, looked at another way, 45 of the 50 player minutes in the 4th quarter went to Barker, MiaP, Spearman, Cooper, Robertson, and Latham -- easily our top 6 players at this point in the season.

COMPARE TO THE NC STATE GAME:

Q4 minutes played (Tennessee)​

(Computed from the substitution timestamps in the play-by-play; totals check to 50:00 player-minutes.)

1. Spearman — 8:32
2. Cooper — 7:56
3. Barker — 7:42
4. Mia Pauldo — 6:42
5. Prawl — 6:01
6. Latham — 3:24
7. Robertson — 3:20
8. Civil — 3:03
9. Boyd — 2:19
10. Wolfenbarger — 1:01 (includes a tiny 0:02 end-of-game stint; also had a “sub-in then sub-out” at 9:08 that effectively adds ~0 seconds)

Top 6 concentration​

Top 6 (Spearman, Cooper, Barker, Pauldo, Prawl, Latham) played 40:17 of the 50:00 available player-minutes in Q4, which is 80.6% of all Tennessee minutes in the quarter.

My observations: 1. Kim saved her best players for the 4th quarter in Miss St way more than against NC State. 2. She knows who her best are now more than then (understandable). 3. She gave a LOT of minutes to untested freshmen who didn't look very sure of themselves in the NC State game. Even MiaP wasn't the player then that she is now. I think NC State is a game Kim would coach differently and likely win in the future.

 

[Higbee]

Did Barker, Cooper, and Spearman sing the anthem on court after this game and is it to be seen anywhere,?

 

[lvocd]

That said, I expect her to press the bejeez out of Arky early and often bc they’re awful. So she’ll probably go back to 2 min subbing for everyone. Just not in serious games.

I suppose it will be good for the players to continue practicing/playing the press against the less challenging opponents just so if once we DO start facing Top 10s they’ll be up to the task if Kim were to need to have that in her toolkit in certain situations. I always think the press works best if it is sprung on an opponent who may have been lulled into thinking they don’t need to be in a big hurry getting the ball across. Not having the element of surprise takes away one of the advantages of a hardcore press. Just gotta spring it now and then, not use it continuously, against better competition.

 

[LV renaissance]

Yeah, that's interesting. But, that 8:21 stretch for Barker was in the fourth quarter. In fact, here's the minutes for each player who appeared in the 4th quarter (ChatGPT):

Janiah Barker — 9:30
Mia Pauldo — 9:22
Zee Spearman — 7:42
Talaysia Cooper — 6:51
Nya Robertson — 5:57
Alyssa Latham — 5:35
Jaida Civil — 2:46
Lauren Hurst — 1:09
Deniya Prawl — 0:38
Mya Pauldo — 0:30


AND, here's the minute distribution for the game for the players who played over 20 minutes:

Pauldo, Mia -- 27
Barker, Janiah -- 27
Spearman, Zee -- 26
Cooper, Talaysia -- 25

So, 35% of Barker's minutes were in the 4th quarter. And pretty close to the same for MiaP. Zee was right at 30% of her total minutes and a little over 27% for Talaysia.

Or, looked at another way, 45 of the 50 player minutes in the 4th quarter went to Barker, MiaP, Spearman, Cooper, Robertson, and Latham -- easily our top 6 players at this point in the season.

COMPARE TO THE NC STATE GAME:

Q4 minutes played (Tennessee)​

(Computed from the substitution timestamps in the play-by-play; totals check to 50:00 player-minutes.)

1. Spearman — 8:32
2. Cooper — 7:56
3. Barker — 7:42
4. Mia Pauldo — 6:42
5. Prawl — 6:01
6. Latham — 3:24
7. Robertson — 3:20
8. Civil — 3:03
9. Boyd — 2:19
10. Wolfenbarger — 1:01 (includes a tiny 0:02 end-of-game stint; also had a “sub-in then sub-out” at 9:08 that effectively adds ~0 seconds)

Top 6 concentration​

Top 6 (Spearman, Cooper, Barker, Pauldo, Prawl, Latham) played 40:17 of the 50:00 available player-minutes in Q4, which is 80.6% of all Tennessee minutes in the quarter.

My observations: 1. Kim saved her best players for the 4th quarter in Miss St way more than against NC State. 2. She knows who her best are now more than then (understandable). 3. She gave a LOT of minutes to untested freshmen who didn't look very sure of themselves in the NC State game. Even MiaP wasn't the player then that she is now. I think NC State is a game Kim would coach differently and likely win in the future.

And I thought I loved statistics! I bow in deference to you, Retro. Not only did coach choose to have the best players have the most minutes in the fourth quarter, but she also gave the top two most minutes to the players who clearly were at the peak of their powers in that particular game - Mia and Barker. I know people are coming around that perhaps this season won't be the washout that some feared with our slow start, but perhaps more importantly that our coach is showing way more flexibility in her overall approach and her in game strategy than how some were perceiving her to be. This coupled with the improvement of the Freshman suddenly makes the future look brighter for this year but especially beyond this year.

 

[volsagain]

And I thought I loved statistics! I bow in deference to you, Retro. Not only did coach choose to have the best players have the most minutes in the fourth quarter, but she also gave the top two most minutes to the players who clearly were at the peak of their powers in that particular game - Mia and Barker. I know people are coming around that perhaps this season won't be the washout that some feared with our slow start, but perhaps more importantly that our coach is showing way more flexibility in her overall approach and her in game strategy than how some were perceiving her to be. This coupled with the improvement of the Freshman suddenly makes the future look brighter for this year but especially beyond this year.

One thing for certain teams that have a higher turnover rate for players returning players. It takes a lot longer to gel as a TEAM of you bring in 6-8 players than returning 6-8 players. Now if we retain all the players eligible for 27 we should have better team chemistry out of the gate . There's a good reason to schedule lesser talented teams earlier in the season it allows time to get comfortable with your teammates. Even next year should be a better start one big reason we know who the number #1 point guard is established.

 

[RetroVol]

And I thought I loved statistics! I bow in deference to you, Retro.

New tools create new possibilities. Part of the reason I like playing with them is that it expands the range of what I think of as possible for me.

 

[glv98]

our coach is showing way more flexibility in her overall approach and her in game strategy than how some were perceiving her to be.

To be fair, our coach is showing way more flexibility than she herself said she would. Just a couple of weeks ago she firmly shut down a question asking if she'd tweak the system for SEC play. Replied emphatically there would be no changes bc "that's our game, that's how we play".

Three games into SEC play, the system is not only tweaked, it's practically tweaked to death. The offensive part of the system didn't even make it into the preseason, was abandoned long ago. Both the heavy trapping and the auto subbing are on the decline. The best players are playing more minutes in longer stretches especially late in games Defensive pressure is being used situationally. The will to win definitely took down the system quickly,thank goodness.

Fast pace and and situational heavy defensive pressure will always be part of CKC's mix, and that's a good thing. Also with" the system" being so much a part of her coachng identity, I'm sure she'll hang on to at least the illusion of it for a while. No doubt the announcers will continue to wax poetic over this" innovative" brilliant sysrem every game. Take a drink every time it's brought up. But the truth is, this appears to be a coach and a team that have quickly shifted to a more conventional style of play.

 

[LV renaissance]

To be fair, our coach is showing way more flexibility than she herself said she would. Just a couple of weeks ago she firmly shut down a question asking if she'd tweak the system for SEC play. Replied emphatically there would be no changes bc "that's our game, that's how we play".

Three games into SEC play, the system is not only tweaked, it's practically tweaked to death. The offensive part of the system didn't even make it into the preseason, was abandoned long ago. Both the heavy trapping and the auto subbing are on the decline. The best players are playing more minutes in longer stretches especially late in games Defensive pressure is being used situationally. The will to win definitely took down the "system quickly", thank goodness.

Fast pace and and situational heavy defensive pressure will always be part of CKC's mix, and that's a good thing. Also with" the system" being so much a part of her coachng identity, I'm sure she'll hang on to at least the illusion of it for a while. No doubt the announcers will continue to wax poetic over this" innovative" brilliant "system" every game. Take a drink every time it's brought up. But the truth is, this appears to be a coach and a team that have quickly shifted to a more conventional style of play.

Yes, I remember that answer. It was certainly a defensive one that I believed was asked right after a disappointing performance. More consistently, she has said all along that she does modify the system based on how it is succeeding, including the 13 pages of tweaks she made over the Summer.
I agree with you about how we are becoming more conventional. I do think we still take more 3s than most teams and she still put a premium on relative number of chances on offense. The latter issue hasn't been that successful yet due to this particular team being inconsistent when it comes to offensive rebounds and not winning the turnover margin against the better teams. The team is creating a fair number of turnovers but is committing so many that it ends up being a wash. I look for this to improve with the improving teamwork and passing that we are starting to see. They have made turnovers a real focus in practice per coach. I do think that consistently using a full court press and the rigid use of platoons has dramatically decreased, for which I would say touché!

 

[RetroVol]

But the truth is, this appears to be a coach and a team that have quickly shifted to a more conventional style of play.

You've got a strong argument, but I think more may yet be revealed, though it may possibly wait until next year. Kim hasn't had to coach her system much under this year's circumstances -- 8 new players that she had to count on. Last year, and Marshall, I think, were both exceptions. Players buying in with a new coach. And both those years had their hiccups, though Marshall's was at the beginning and ours at a more critical later stretch that hurt us more.

She still seems to want to keep lots of players involved and is still subbing 5-5 and 4-4 frequently. They're still shooting threes, and players still seem to feel free to take them -- some just seem to be making better choices about the best rate and times for them. We'll see how that adapts this year against stronger components. And next year, and the next year, as she gets teams where most of the players have been recruited to Kim's approach and learned to play in it, maximizing its strengths and minimizing its weaknesses.

She's also indicated her approach has always had more flexibility than we may have thought, though I totally agree that, if asked, she might admit that this year in particular, and maybe D1 in general, is pushing her in new ways. And I suspect she kind of likes that -- I still think she is uber-competitive.

Maybe when the 28-29 season starts we'll all be saying how the LVs don't look different from any other top team <knock on wood>, but I kind of suspect CKC's approach will still be seen as distinctly different, and maybe even as a trend setter!

Time will tell!

 

[glv98]

. I do think we still take more 3s than most teams and she still put a premium on relative number of chances on offense.

And she’s begged them not to take all those 3s. But they keep firing, even players who should never attempt a 3. It’s been so weird, like she changed that offense, but didn’t tell the players. She’s griped long and hard that she wants a more patient,inside out offense.

Im sure communication on all these issues has been tough bc it’s such a change from the philosophy they started out with. But live and learn, and the fast retreat from something that wasnt going to work, even against SEC bottom feeders, is a blessing.

 

[glv98]

You've got a strong argument, but I think more may yet be revealed, though it may possibly wait until next year. Kim hasn't had to coach her system much under this year's circumstances -- 8 new players that she had to count on. Last year, and Marshall, I think, were both exceptions. Players buying in with a new coach. And both those years had their hiccups, though Marshall's was at the beginning and ours at a more critical later stretch that hurt us more.

She still seems to want to keep lots of players involved and is still subbing 5-5 and 4-4 frequently. They're still shooting threes, and players still seem to feel free to take them -- some just seem to be making better choices about the best rate and times for them. We'll see how that adapts this year against stronger components. And next year, and the next year, as she gets teams where most of the players have been recruited to Kim's approach and learned to play in it, maximizing its strengths and minimizing its weaknesses.

She's also indicated her approach has always had more flexibility than we may have thought, though I totally agree that, if asked, she might admit that this year in particular, and maybe D1 in general, is pushing her in new ways. And I suspect she kind of likes that -- I still think she is uber-competitive.

Maybe when the 28-29 season starts we'll all be saying how the LVs don't look different from any other top team <knock on wood>, but I kind of suspect CKC's approach will still be seen as distinctly different, and maybe even as a trend setter!

Time will tell!

I continue to maintain that her ability to use the system has far more to do with the players she’s playing against than the players she has on her team. Top SEC players are simply too good, and that isn’t going to change.

As far as subbing, it’s great to get everyone involved and give everyone rest. But as your graph shows, she’s no longer doing this when the game is on the line. That says it all.
‘

 

[1reVOLver]

our coach is showing way more flexibility in her overall approach and her in game strategy

I am happy to confess that I was dead wrong when I lamented her lack of flexibility last week.

 

[37620VOL]

And she’s begged them not to take all those 3s. But they keep firing, even players who should never attempt a 3. It’s been so weird, like she changed that offense, but didn’t tell the players. She’s griped long and hard that she wants a more patient,inside out offense.

Im sure communication on all these issues has been tough bc it’s such a change from the philosophy they started out with. But live and learn, and the fast retreat from something that wasnt going to work, even against SEC bottom feeders, is a blessing.

I haven't heard her indicate all these changes that you are talking about. The most aggressive communication I've heard her talk about was having all of the players self-evaluate the shots that they took for each game and whether it was a good shot or a bad shot. But I don't think that is a change in the coach's philosophy at all; it's more of a change in getting the players to understand her philosophy better.

FWIW I think this is a good and novel way to communicate what you are teaching as far as good shots and bad shots. A major mistake that both of our previous coaching failures made was being too critical of our players shooting threes. If you discourage the three-pointer, it damages the player's shooting confidence, it congests the paint, and leads to a ton of turnovers. I think the "keep shooting but shoot better shots" message is landing.

 

[glv98]

I am happy to confess that I was dead wrong when I lamented her lack of flexibility last week.

Don’t beat yourself up and certainly don’t confess to being some kind of neg a vol. Kim herself, as I said above, was emphatically stating she would not change just a few weeks ago. I expect out of muscle memory and loyalty to her past,she and her biggest fans will continue to maintain she’s not changing even while she obviously is.

Bottom line thank God she is flexible,whether she admits it or not.

 

[glv98]

I haven't heard her indicate all these changes that you are talking about. The most aggressive communication I've heard her talk about was having all of the players self-evaluate the shots that they took for each game and whether it was a good shot or a bad shot. But I don't think that is a change in the coach's philosophy at all; it's more of a change in getting the players to understand her philosophy better.

FWIW I think this is a good and novel way to communicate what you are teaching as far as good shots and bad shots. A major mistake that both of our previous coaching failures made was being too critical of our players shooting threes. If you discourage the three-pointer, it damages the player's shooting confidence, it congests the paint, and leads to a ton of turnovers. I think the "keep shooting but shoot better shots" message is landing.

I I heard her say many times in the preseason that she wants them to stop settling for threes and that she wants more patient offense focusing on inside out. That is a huge change.

The changes in subbing and pressing are easy to see.

 

[Volfan2012]

I haven't heard her indicate all these changes that you are talking about. The most aggressive communication I've heard her talk about was having all of the players self-evaluate the shots that they took for each game and whether it was a good shot or a bad shot. But I don't think that is a change in the coach's philosophy at all; it's more of a change in getting the players to understand her philosophy better.

FWIW I think this is a good and novel way to communicate what you are teaching as far as good shots and bad shots. A major mistake that both of our previous coaching failures made was being too critical of our players shooting threes. If you discourage the three-pointer, it damages the player's shooting confidence, it congests the paint, and leads to a ton of turnovers. I think the "keep shooting but shoot better shots" message is landing.

What I have seen in SEC play is more driving the ball and three point shots coming from those drives that get cut off. I don't see any discouraging of three point shots just way better three point shot opportunities. We've been to the free throw line in the last three games more than we were getting there in non conference. In fact were winning the line and were losing it in non conference play.

 

[glv98]

What I have seen in SEC play is more driving the ball and three point shots coming from those drives that get cut off. I don't see any discouraging of three point shots just way better three point shot opportunities. We've been to the free throw line in the last three games more than we were getting there in non conference. In fact were winning the line and were losing it in non conference play.

Right. Threes from playing inside out, not auto gunning. Best shot available,not first shot available. Thats the change. Also very conventional, since that’s how 95% of teams play.

 

[Volfan2012]

Don’t beat yourself up and certainly don’t confess to being some kind of neck of all Kim herself as I said above was emphatically stating she would not change just a few weeks ago. I expect out of muscle memory and loyalty to her past,she’ll continue to maintain she’s not changing even while she obviously is.

Bottom line thank God she is flexible,whether she admits it or not.

Definitely changed from the first shot up is a three. That is obvious were looking to score more in the paint and creating the three from that offensive action. I think it has always been the way she wanted to play the offense. She doesn't want to give up the three offensively and even though we are shooting a lower total about 25 a game versus 34 in non conference the quality of the shots is like night and day.

 

[37620VOL]

I I heard her say many times in the preseason in post game that she wants them to stop settling for threes and that she wants more patience offense focusing on inside out. That is a huge change.

But she has been saying that from day one. She doesn't say "layups", I forget the terminology. But it's basically a layups and threes system. I will say that this year I think she's been more intentional about encouraging the layups half of the system.

 

[glv98]

Definitely changed from the first shot up is a three. That is obvious were looking to score more in the paint and creating the three from that offensive action. I think it has always been the way she wanted to play the offense. She doesn't want to give up the three offensively and even though we are shooting a lower total about 25 a game versus 34 in non conference the quality of the shots is like night and day.

But she has been saying that from day one. She doesn't say "layups", I forget the terminology. But it's basically a layups and threes system. I will say that this year I think she's been more intentional about encouraging the layups half of the system.

We’ll have to agree to disagree. I don’t think she (or her system) favored quality over quantity of shots, esp 3s, until the recent rollback of the system.

I thought having the greatest number of shots, good or bad, was a tentpole of the system.

Whenever she backed off hardcore system, Im delighted shes willing to change from what painfully and obviously wasn’t working.

 

[KTrain]

You've got a strong argument, but I think more may yet be revealed, though it may possibly wait until next year. Kim hasn't had to coach her system much under this year's circumstances -- 8 new players that she had to count on. Last year, and Marshall, I think, were both exceptions. Players buying in with a new coach. And both those years had their hiccups, though Marshall's was at the beginning and ours at a more critical later stretch that hurt us more.

She still seems to want to keep lots of players involved and is still subbing 5-5 and 4-4 frequently. They're still shooting threes, and players still seem to feel free to take them -- some just seem to be making better choices about the best rate and times for them. We'll see how that adapts this year against stronger components. And next year, and the next year, as she gets teams where most of the players have been recruited to Kim's approach and learned to play in it, maximizing its strengths and minimizing its weaknesses.

She's also indicated her approach has always had more flexibility than we may have thought, though I totally agree that, if asked, she might admit that this year in particular, and maybe D1 in general, is pushing her in new ways. And I suspect she kind of likes that -- I still think she is uber-competitive.

Maybe when the 28-29 season starts we'll all be saying how the LVs don't look different from any other top team <knock on wood>, but I kind of suspect CKC's approach will still be seen as distinctly different, and maybe even as a trend setter!

Time will tell!

I agree with all of that and D1 in high profile TV games, there will be longer play reviews, longer TV timeouts etc.. This IMO, although I have not watched any Of the Glenville State games but I would assume at that level no TV timeouts and probably very few reviews. Maybe I'm wrong but money wise I would think these lower divisions do not have the technology available for different angle reviews especially in regular season. So all these time lags in D1 hurt the premise of her systems end game some IMO.

 

[madtownvol]

To be fair, our coach is showing way more flexibility than she herself said she would. Just a couple of weeks ago she firmly shut down a question asking if she'd tweak the system for SEC play. Replied emphatically there would be no changes bc "that's our game, that's how we play".

Three games into SEC play, the system is not only tweaked, it's practically tweaked to death. The offensive part of the system didn't even make it into the preseason, was abandoned long ago. Both the heavy trapping and the auto subbing are on the decline. The best players are playing more minutes in longer stretches especially late in games Defensive pressure is being used situationally. The will to win definitely took down the system quickly,thank goodness.

Fast pace and and situational heavy defensive pressure will always be part of CKC's mix, and that's a good thing. Also with" the system" being so much a part of her coachng identity, I'm sure she'll hang on to at least the illusion of it for a while. No doubt the announcers will continue to wax poetic over this" innovative" brilliant sysrem every game. Take a drink every time it's brought up. But the truth is, this appears to be a coach and a team that have quickly shifted to a more conventional style of play.

Super happy to see this evolution in CKC!

 

[glv98]

Super happy to see this evolution in CKC!

Me too. I guess getting your ass handed to you several times on national tv will do that.