President Donald Trump - J.D. Vance Administration

[W.TN.Orange Blood]

 

[McDad]

If you want better health care, get rid of the pretax treatment. Companies would no longer offer it and people would actually know the true cost....

Regardless of the method, approximating the consumer (patient) with the product (insurance and health care) is the best long term solution to drive costs down which makes care more affordable for everyone.

 

[OHvol40]

Regardless of the method, approximating the consumer (patient) with the product (insurance and health care) is the best long term solution to drive costs down which makes care more affordable for everyone.

What about eliminating all the non-clinical infrastructure that supports the business aspect of healthcare?

 

[McDad]

What about eliminating all the non-clinical infrastructure that supports the business aspect of healthcare?

Brother, from your lips (keyboard) to the Good Lord's ears.

The administrative bloat is ridiculous. But let's be honest, some of that bloat is to navigate the medicare and medicaid rules and regs for pt care.

 

[appvol]

I listened to her on the way in from lunch and she simply would not answer any question as to the bag of $50,000 Homan got from undercover FBI agents. And she would not answer a single question about why the investigation was dropped.

Pretty awful look for the administration and the DOJ overall, and especially because she would not answer any questions.

To be honest with you I hate it when both parties have these hearings. They are a waste of time and energy. I wish Washington actually took the time to vote on every dollar that comes out of Washington separately. Shouldn’t be spending in one big bill with 1000 pages with a lot crap in it.

 

[luthervol]

much more than healthcare goes into life expectancy

lol...
Absolutely 100% true.
To the same degree as much more than "school" goes into how students become educated.
Yet..................

 

[C-south]

lol...
Absolutely 100% true.
To the same degree as much more than "school" goes into how students become educated.
Yet..................

Yet that’s what looney leftists constantly promote while they wallow in hundreds of thousands in debt with a “degree” in folk dance or non binary gender basket weaving.

 

[EasternVol]

No country provides healthcare to its citizens. This conversation is doomed until you realize that. And then once you realize it, it's still doomed.

It's a matter of semantics. If a government builds, maintains, and operates highways, bridges, schools and libraries we say they provide those things even though they're taxpayer funded.

 

[hog88]

If you want better health care, get rid of the pretax treatment. Companies would no longer offer it and people would actually know the true cost....

I’ve said for a long time. Employer provided health insurance should be banned. Everyone buys their policies on the open market and premiums 100% deductible.

 

[luthervol]

the democrat party hasn't been the same without andy Griffith

and Barney.

 

[hog88]

What about eliminating all the non-clinical infrastructure that supports the business aspect of healthcare?

How do we start that process?

 

[EasternVol]

At the scale as would be required here?

More urban countries would have a cost advantage for not having to maintain a lot of facilities in the middle of nowhere but otherwise the scale should be proportional to population.

 

[luthervol]

I’ve said for a long time. Employer provided health insurance should be banned. Everyone buys their policies on the open market and premiums 100% deductible.

Employers should be denied the freedom to choose if it is something they wish to offer?
Doesn't sound like your normal take.

 

[EasternVol]

One huge negative is that the state cannot provide healthcare to citizens.

They produce neither healthcare, nor the money to pay for healthcare. So, what you are doing is arguing for the state to take the wealth that some people worked for, and give it to those who have not worked for it.

So this is not a discussion about the state "providing" anything for anyone. It's not even a discussion about what they may or may not do well. It's a moral discussion that consists also of what "right" people have to the benefits.

It's nice to see you couching your responses in "opinion" and "I think" vocabulary since some of the more recent hard discussions you've been a part of. But since this is a moral conversation about taking from those who worked for their wealth to give to those who didn't, I'm not sure you can have the discussion at the "opinion" level. Those who worked for their wealth can rightly say, "I don't really care what you think about my wealth or what should be done with it."

Do you think poor people should be able to use roads, public schools, airports, etc.?

 

[hog88]

Employers should be denied the freedom to choose if it is something they wish to offer?
Doesn't sound like your normal take.

An easy compromise is to eliminate the tax deduction for employers and pass it to the individual. Choice remains.

 

[EasternVol]

We do have the best healthcare in the world if you look at actual outcomes that matter.

If the outcomes that matter relate to profit and income in the medical field. Otherwise it's not so great. Our Infant mortality and other marks are pretty bad.

 

[luthervol]

And if you adjust for things like car crashes and overdoses we are first.

Do Americans die of car crashes more than the Japanese due to poor healthcare?

I wonder if there are things beyond the control of public education that lead to so many being unwilling or unable to take prober advantage of the offerings?

And yet those things are never mentioned by those who bash education.

 

[BigOrangeMojo]

I’ve said for a long time. Employer provided health insurance should be banned. Everyone buys their policies on the open market and premiums 100% deductible.

Why should individual health insurance be deductible? What about auto? Heck, that's mandated. Or homeowners? Or life?

If you are going to mandate coverage, then sure. But heck, auto is mandated

 

[Orange_Crush]

It's a matter of semantics. If a government builds, maintains, and operates highways, bridges, schools and libraries we say they provide those things even though they're taxpayer funded.

Those semantics are important. For the record, the government "provides" none of those either, no matter the language used to describe it.

The term government "provided" healthcare has been thrown around here pretty liberally (pun intended). As with most cases that progressives are arguing "Let's let the government provide this for everyone" it's important to remind everyone that the government doesn't provide anything. They take from some to give to others.

 

[hog88]

Why should individual health insurance be deductible? What about auto? Heck, that's mandated. Or homeowners? Or life?

It shouldn’t but that would be the only hope in getting HI out of the employer.

 

[EasternVol]

That isn't healthcare. That's pop tarts and polar pops. Good ole' personal responsibility.

Healthcare has a whole lot to do with it. Think of how many people would die young without access to good preventative and remedial healthcare.

 

[Vol8188]

I wonder if there are things beyond the control of public education that lead to so many being unwilling or unable to take prober advantage of the offerings?

And yet those things are never mentioned by those who bash education.

You just deflected onto some nonsense tangent. Let’s try again.

You attempted to proclaim our low life expectancy was a result of healthcare. I informed you that if you removed issues such as car crashes, we have the highest life expectancy.

Do you now think we have the best healthcare? Or do you think your own chosen standard is irrelevant?

 

[Orange_Crush]

Do you think poor people should be able to use roads, public schools, airports, etc.?

I don't think the government should be the primary "provider" for most of those for the most part, as the government basically just adds overhead and inefficiencies. But roads are largely funded by usage taxes. I don't like the Federal gov't being in education at all. I believe education should be defined and funded at as local a level as possible. Airports should be able to fund themselves.

Get decisions and funding down to as local a level as possible, and you allow the people more decisions about what happens with their money, their property, their kids, etc...

But at the end of the day, let's look at your examples. Look at the state of our roads/infrastructure. Let's look at the state of education. Let's let the government prove their efficacy to manage those things before giving them more money and control to manage healthcare too?

 

[EasternVol]

And if you adjust for things like car crashes and overdoses we are first.

Do Americans die of car crashes more than the Japanese due to poor healthcare?

Maybe. It's plausible that Japan may have fewer critical care deserts than the US. It's certain that more Indonesians e.g. die of car crashes than Americans because of poor healthcare.

 

[Orangeslice13]

Here's AI's view................first sentence.

The U.S. ranks around the 50th globally for life expectancy and significantly lower than other wealthy nations, with projections suggesting a further decline.

That’s not a health care system problem.
That’s a fat bastard problem