Israel vs Palestinians II

[McDad]

My post answered the question along with information in the link.
"Israel controls imports, exports, airspace, offshore resources, movement of people, etc."
I'd change the last word to restricting from restricted. Otherwise I guess those points were in the article.

In your opinion, was the takeover by hamas in 2006 after control by the PA in 2005 the fault of Israel?

 

[EasternVol]

I’ll take saving the thousands of Americans and the 10’s of billions maybe even hundreds of billions wasted

How would Afghanistan have looked in 2001 had we not supported the Mujahedeen? From my view, it's hard to say definitely but quite possibly the Russians would have left anyway and it would have ended up with the Taliban in charge.

 

[EasternVol]

And doesn’t really say what he thinks it says

Sure it does.

 

[EasternVol]

Coal miners? Who’s scared of coal miners

I recall you using the term as a slur some time back, like you had a phobia about them.

 

[EasternVol]

In your opinion, was the takeover by hamas in 2006 after control by the PA in 2005 the fault of Israel?

I'd say they were a major contributing factor.

 

[KB5252]

5 Reasons countries are rushing to back the Trump plan.

Listening to this story it's far past time we started taking The Muslim Brotherhood seriously........ When their counterparts in the region want nothing to do with them you have to consider why that might be.

 

[McDad]

I'd say they were a major contributing factor.

In your opinion, is Israel responsible for no elections since hamas took over in 2006?

 

[KB5252]

No, the facts there are confirmed. Israel's blockade, destruction of infrastructure, etc. made real economic development nigh impossible.

To be fair Eastern they showed much more proclivity to produce weapons than goods and even ripped up infrastructure to support their lust of lobbing rockets into Israel. Not defensive arms mind you, but offensive weapons.

 

[Smokey123]

How would Afghanistan have looked in 2001 had we not supported the Mujahedeen? From my view, it's hard to say definitely but quite possibly the Russians would have left anyway and it would have ended up with the Taliban in charge.

We’ll never know for certain, but the Soviet probably had too much internal problems to survive anyways. So yes a civil war probably happens and a group like the taliban takes control. I’d say it looks different without billions in funding, taliban was an indirect result of that

You’d think after decades of failures the US would stay tf outta the Middle East

 

[Orangeslice13]

To be fair Eastern they showed much more proclivity to produce weapons than goods and even ripped up infrastructure to support their lust of lobbing rockets into Israel. Not defensive arms mind you, but offensive weapons.

And maybe, just maybe, if you’re spending energy on building infrastructure instead of Fing it up……and are working on developing your economy instead of building tunnels then there isn’t a need for the blockade.
Just saying

 

[EasternVol]

In your opinion, is Israel responsible for no elections since hamas took over in 2006?

To a certain extent but not primarily.

 

[EasternVol]

To be fair Eastern they showed much more proclivity to produce weapons than goods and even ripped up infrastructure to support their lust of lobbing rockets into Israel. Not defensive arms mind you, but offensive weapons.

I don't know how much that took away from beneficial manufacturing. It seems like it wouldn't have taken much manpower and money to accomplish.
Didn't they get the pipe from abandoned Israeli settlements and powder from Israeli UXO?

 

[KB5252]

I don't know how much that took away from beneficial manufacturing. It seems like it wouldn't have taken much manpower and money to accomplish.
Didn't they get the pipe from abandoned Israeli settlements and powder from Israeli UXO?

But they were an impoverished and destitute people....... Using any of that means to produce offensive weapons that aren't accurate seems a complete waste of resources no?

And the sanctions on Palestinians kind of proved themselves needed didn't they? I mean if they would use so much of what they had to make offensive weapons what would they have done with more? If we're being intellectually honest you and I both know Hamas would have directed the lions share to benefit themselves directly and to aquire and produce any weapons they could......... It is evidenced in that is exactly what they did. Hamas never cared about Palestinians, they existed in their minds solely to hurt Israel.

 

[bamawriter]

But they were an impoverished and destitute people....... Using any of that means to produce offensive weapons that aren't accurate seems a complete waste of resources no?

And the sanctions on Palestinians kind of proved themselves needed didn't they? I mean if they would use so much of what they had to make offensive weapons what would they have done with more? If we're being intellectually honest you and I both know Hamas would have directed the lions share to benefit themselves directly and to aquire and produce any weapons they could......... It is evidenced in that is exactly what they did. Hamas never cared about Palestinians, they existed in their minds solely to hurt Israel.

This.

None of Hamas' senior leadership even live in Gaza. They live like kings in Qatar and Turkey. They care f*** all for the people they're supposed to be governing.

 

[EasternVol]

But they were an impoverished and destitute people....... Using any of that means to produce offensive weapons that aren't accurate seems a complete waste of resources no?

It does seem a waste to me. Maybe they were thinking of deterrence like our ICBM's, but something that inaccurate is not much of a deterrence.

And the sanctions on Palestinians kind of proved themselves needed didn't they? I mean if they would use so much of what they had to make offensive weapons what would they have done with more?

I don't see that many of the sanctions were needed. Why destroy the airport or deny them access to the sea to fish? I understand the Palestinians arming themselves. Given their neighbor's past behavior it would be very odd for them to go unarmed. Again I don't think building the missiles took enough resources to really lower their quality of life. What else were they going to do with surplus pipe and UXO?

If we're being intellectually honest you and I both know Hamas would have directed the lions share to benefit themselves directly and to aquire and produce any weapons they could......... It is evidenced in that is exactly what they did. Hamas never cared about Palestinians, they existed in their minds solely to hurt Israel.

There's truth to that but I'd say some share thought they were working for their people. What do you think their motivation for wanting to hurt Israel was and is?

 

[NashVol11]

Every time Israel posts something, you can bet they'll be caught in a lie

 

[KB5252]

It does seem a waste to me. Maybe they were thinking of deterrence like our ICBM's, but something that inaccurate is not much of a deterrence.

I don't see that many of the sanctions were needed. Why destroy the airport or deny them access to the sea to fish? I understand the Palestinians to arm themselves. Given their neighbor's past behavior it would be very odd for them to go unarmed. Again I don't think building the missiles took enough resources to really lower their quality of life. What else were they going to do with surplus pipe and UXO?

There's truth to that but I'd say some share thought they were working for their people. What do you think their motivation for wanting to hurt Israel was and is?

To your last sentence the answer is simple:

From the river to the sea Palestine will be Arab.

Just follow the chants

 

[n_huffhines]

Every time Israel posts something, you can bet they'll be caught in a lie

This is why it will be hard to trust a peace deal.

 

[McDad]

I understand the Palestinians to arm themselves. Given their neighbor's past behavior it would be very odd for them to go unarmed.

In the article I've been referencing, the one where you agreed i gave an accurate summary, it stated Iran is supplying weapons.

You're approaching a precarious place for your thoughts. Palestinians need to arm themselves, they're building inaccurate rockets (for defense), and you're not sure how much in resources that took away from infrastructure. All the while, Iran is helping them "defend" themselves.

You may want to explore those things. Could be an important development in how you form opinions about Hamas.

 

[Vol8188]

This is why it will be hard to trust a peace deal.

Imagine having such a lack of self awareness.

 

[MAD]

 

[Orangeslice13]

Every time Israel posts something, you can bet they'll be caught in a lie

You misspelled Huff

 

[MAD]

Palestinian terrorists are stockpiling rockets just minutes from Jerusalem.
The threat is growing. The world cannot look away.

 

[MAD]

Doctor Terror: Media Relies on Gaza “Hospital Spokesman” Who Prayed to “Defeat the Jews” on Oct. 7 to Supply Casualty Figures​

Doctor Terror: Media Relies on Gaza “Hospital Spokesman” Who Prayed to “Defeat the Jews” on Oct. 7 to Supply Casualty Figures | HonestReporting

Dr. Khalil al-Daqran is presented as a trusted source in Gaza. But the white coat conceals something very different.

honestreporting.com

Key Takeaways:

• Major outlets like The New York Times and Reuters have leaned on Dr. Khalil al-Daqran — a Hamas propagandist who prayed to “defeat the Jews” on October 7 — as a trusted hospital source, providing casualty figures.
• His social media glorifies Hamas leaders, “martyrs,” and calls for Gazans to embrace death — yet his words are reported as fact.
• Don’t let the media launder Hamas propaganda through a lab coat. When you see al-Daqran or others like him quoted, call it out and share this article.

 

[OrangeTsar]

Can’t be short sighted when you’re the leader of a country

It is not being “short-sided”; it is about making decisions based upon current conditions. Until a time machine is invented that lets us see what our allies of today might turn into tomorrow; this sort of thing is unavoidable.
Were the U.S. and Britain wrong to ally themselves with Stalin during WWII? We knew that the Soviet Union had the potential to become our greatest foe in The future; but we had to make common cause with them to defeat the immediate threat.
International relations very rarely offer you a choice between a good outcome and a bad outcome. You usually end up having decide which of two bad alternatives is the lesser of two bad things.