That's racist!

[ETV]

When I point out shameful stuff from American history, nobody tells me I'm being racist against my own people. They tell me I have white guilt, which is pretty similar to the concept of self hatred.

Question. Why would you feel guilty over a part of history that you had zero control over and the only connection is the color of your skin?

 

[volfanhill]

Question. Why would you feel guilty over a part of history that you had zero control over and the only connection is the color of your skin?

I don't think he said he felt guilty

 

[ETV]

I don't think he said he felt guilty

I understand that.

Pointing out "shameful" periods of American history and having someone tell you that it's white guilt, is there actual guilt felt? The question still stands.

 

[Jxn Vol]

I’m not prejudice, I hate everybody

 

[NashVol11]

Anything as in related to the bad behavior and antics on display at certain times.

It's also a double standard.

So again, why isn't it bad behavior fatigue? Antics fatigue? It's explicitly stereotyping a race of people, pretty incredible mental gymnastics to act like that's not racist

 

[82_VOL_83]

It wouldn't be nearly as much of a story if there weren't thousands of people donating hundreds of thousands (maybe millions by now) in her defense with a bunch of "1488" and "No n****r Nation" comments

So the slur isn't a problem it's the fact that the Go Fund Me exists. Typical.

 

[82_VOL_83]

Two wrongs don't make a right.

3 lefts do.

 

[ETV]

So again, why isn't it bad behavior fatigue? Antics fatigue? It's explicitly stereotyping a race of people, pretty incredible mental gymnastics to act like that's not racist

Wasn't the definition initially listed as-

"Black Fatigue" refers to the emotional, mental, and physical exhaustion experienced by Black individuals as a result of the constant stress and strain of living in a racially unjust society, including small acts of aggression, the need to constantly prove one's worth, and ongoing exposure to news about injustice and violence. This term, coined by Mary-Frances Winters, highlights the pervasive impact of systemic racism on Black people's well-being, impacting both their health and daily lives".

Based upon that definition, why wasn't it named some kind of victim fatigue?

 

[NashVol11]

Wasn't the definition initially listed as-

"Black Fatigue" refers to the emotional, mental, and physical exhaustion experienced by Black individuals as a result of the constant stress and strain of living in a racially unjust society, including small acts of aggression, the need to constantly prove one's worth, and ongoing exposure to news about injustice and violence. This term, coined by Mary-Frances Winters, highlights the pervasive impact of systemic racism on Black people's well-being, impacting both their health and daily lives".

Based upon that definition, why wasn't it named some kind of victim fatigue?

Because Black people have been singled out by others and treated differently throughout this nation's history, so it is intentionally specific to them. This weird rebrand was just a white lady being racist on TikTok and it's embarrassing that you're on here arguing for it

 

[NashVol11]

So the slur isn't a problem it's the fact that the Go Fund Me exists. Typical.

Congrats on your first day of school

 

[LouderVol]

So your criticism to the well understood biblical story on how the different nations on earth at the time came to be is to parse it literally? Let me guess next you're gonna question how Noah and his 3 sons could repopulate a world with no women outside of their family?

It's an allegory genius. It's not meant to be literal. It's a story meant to explain how things came to be. In particular how the different nations at that time related to one another. The biblical authors grouped the nations based on how closely they were related based on the perceptions at the time. That's why this is relevant. Not because I'm actually trying to argue that 3 brothers with no women left on earth other than their sisters and mother somehow repopulated the world through incest. But rather it's to show that despite our modern perceptions during biblical times the Ancient Egyptians were seen as being related more closest to the Nubians than any other group.

What that should tell any reasonable mind is both groups must have looked similar if they were considered to be more closely related than either was to non-African groups. This obvious allegorical biblical tale was taken by later peoples to advance their racist agendas. But just because they used the story to advance racism doesn't mean the logic of the story in how different nations were related is somehow false.

the bolded is pure supposition on your part. I find it EXTREMELY unlikely the reason those verses, or whatever the torah calls them, were written to the egyptians being black. a religious text would not care about defining people outside that religion. it just doesn't make any sense, and is irrelevant to the entire rest of the bible.

the issue with it being an allegory is that there are any number of interpretations that could be made. just because you have 1 interpretation doesn't mean its correct. especially when the best argument you have for your interpretation is that the racists believed it too.

you are also missing on the fact that a various points there were military empires built by conquest that ruled those lands. so no there doesn't have to be a racial/blood tie. it could simply be saying these people conquered/controlled these lands. that never requires there to be some blood tie. as I have said before I think some of the ancient egyptians were black, you are just presenting the worst possible argument for it.

you would be better off dropping the slave owner argument, and just going back to the DNA.

 

[LouderVol]

I do know quite a few North Africans, mainly from work. The Berbers (Barbary) are fairly pale and the Arabs are a little darker. The US Census Bureau says they're white. I'd go along with that. They're more white than black.

the way our census bureau defines race may be the worst contrived methodology ever. do you fit into one of these poorly defined boxes perfectly? yes? great. if not, is some part of you able to check the "white" box? If yes, great, you are white. if not repeat the process for the next race. there is a reason pretty much no where else in the world defines people the way our Census does.

berbers are more of linguistic/cultural group rather than a racial "family". there are black berbers, and its very likely the farther back you go the "blacker" they would have been. I say likely because it was still a linguistic/cultural grouping before the Carthaginians showed up. They were pretty heavily "arabanized" as Islam spread thru the region which changed a lot for them. including their genetics.

 

[LouderVol]

When I point out shameful stuff from American history, nobody tells me I'm being racist against my own people. They tell me I have white guilt, which is pretty similar to the concept of self hatred.

pointing out our past issues is one thing. holding the modern population responsible or liable for those issues in the past is completely another.

 

[LouderVol]

Black people with black fatigue? Black people who are going up to white folks to complain about how they're tired of black people? Aside from being about the most direct line to self-hatred possible, I'm sure they are conservatives' absolute favorite people just like Sheriff David Clarke and whoever else

I wouldn't jump to self hate as far as the "hate" portion goes. a lot of it is more a psychological response similar to a poverty or scarcity mindset. just where people get trapped in a mindset, the inverse is the "afluenza" mindset. both are self harming, which can result in hatred of oneself, but its more a mindset rather than due to a true "hatred" generated from actual differences. breaking out of the mindset can be traumatic/difficult to deal with, especially when given larger societal trends.

When taken on a societal level it is not uncommon for those who try to break out of a poverty/scarcity mindset to be attacked by their peers because of the perceived thinking that those trying to break out think they are better than their peers. when really its more of a reflection of an individual desire, which has no reflection on their peers. Those attacks can lend itself to "hating" your peers more than you otherwise would have, just because they ostracized you rather than recognizing the individual as an individual.

and its not a racial thing. it applies to all races, and across many different circumstances.

 

[n_huffhines]

pointing out our past issues is one thing. holding the modern population responsible or liable for those issues in the past is completely another.

OK. Has nothing to do with the point

 

[Majors]

Calling people n***ers is not a culture anyone created except the racists doing it

Does the * give you permission to freely to type it out?

 

[n_huffhines]

Question. Why would you feel guilty over a part of history that you had zero control over and the only connection is the color of your skin?

I don't.

I feel shame, but not personally and definitely not personal guilt. Others are the ones labeling it guilt.

I take pride in American accomplishments and feel shame about our bad behavior. People think the shame part is weird but are fine feeling the pride part, lol. They are the weird ones. It's the same thing to feel pride or shame for the past. You didn't do it but you care about it.

If you don't feel the shame, then do you even care?

 

[LouderVol]

OK. Has nothing to do with the point

sure it does. that is why people say you have white guilt. because you, allegedly, assign guilt. as an example:

White people owning black slaves is reprehensible and a stain on our country.
vs
White people owning black slaves is reprehensible and a stain on our country and we need to make modern corrections to balance X.

stating a fact alone, isn't going to get labeled as much of anything. holding modern people accountable for actions their past ancestors had nothing to do with is illogical and is going to earn an negative association. in this case that association is white guilt/self hate considering you are white.

 

[n_huffhines]

sure it does. that is why people say you have white guilt. because you, allegedly, assign guilt. as an example:

White people owning black slaves is reprehensible and a stain on our country.
vs
White people owning black slaves is reprehensible and a stain on our country and we need to make modern corrections to balance X.

stating a fact alone, isn't going to get labeled as much of anything. holding modern people accountable for actions their past ancestors had nothing to do with is illogical and is going to earn an negative association. in this case that association is white guilt/self hate considering you are white.

What are you talking about?

 

[Dobbs 4 Heisman]

I do know quite a few North Africans, mainly from work. The Berbers (Barbary) are fairly pale and the Arabs are a little darker. The US Census Bureau says they're white. I'd go along with that. They're more white than black.

The US Census Bureau also said this guy was white:



Egyptian Immigrant Wants to be Reclassified as Black | TIME.com


So you can't really take the US Census Bureau racial classification as gospel. It's political. People in North Africa are categorized as white for political reasons. Not because it's actually a region filled with white people or was historically white. It's a region filled with mixed people of black and white ancestry that historically was far blacker than it is today.

 

[82_VOL_83]

Congrats on your first day of school

View attachment 743564

Except that is your complaint in nearly every post.

 

[joevol24]

I have to say, this thread was much more fun to read when it was about ancient Egypt. This black fatigue thing is tiring

 

[LouderVol]

What are you talking about?

its not an accusation. I used the qualifier because you were defending yourself from the white guilt label. I don't know the particulars of what you said, or who said you suffered from white guilt which is why I threw in a qualifier, "allegedly".

I don't know, or particularly care if you did make such an argument. I try not to use/assign any such labels like "white guilt". I am just showing how there is a difference between stating facts, and stating the same fact with a political motive. not that you in particular are guilty of doing such.

 

[Dobbs 4 Heisman]

the bolded is pure supposition on your part. I find it EXTREMELY unlikely the reason those verses, or whatever the torah calls them, were written to the egyptians being black. a religious text would not care about defining people outside that religion. it just doesn't make any sense, and is irrelevant to the entire rest of the bible.

It may be a supposition but wouldn't you say it's a logical supposition? I mean why else would the Bible link Egypt with Nubia? Why not link the Egyptians and the Jews? Or how about the Greeks or Persians? Why link them with the most obviously black group mentioned in the Bible? What reason other than phenotypic affinity would be logical for grouping the Ancient Egyptians with the Nubians in terms of genetic lineage?

 

[n_huffhines]

its not an accusation. I used the qualifier because you were defending yourself from the white guilt label. I don't know the particulars of what you said, or who said you suffered from white guilt which is why I threw in a qualifier, "allegedly".

I don't know, or particularly care if you did make such an argument. I try not to use/assign any such labels like "white guilt". I am just showing how there is a difference between stating facts, and stating the same fact with a political motive. not that you in particular are guilty of doing such.

I didn't say I suffer from white guilt. I said others put that label on me. They're applying the label, which is a misnomer, to others because mocking the shame that they should be feeling (if they are the type who takes pride in the past) is easier than confronting it.