Recruiting Football Talk VIII

#153,702
#153,702
Jackcrevol said:
to an extent. huepel needs recruiters, and we have none.
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He needs to drastically upgrade his staff. I think his loyalty to guys in his sphere is admirable, but when they simply can't do the job at a level this league demands, it's the wrong move. We have some coaches on this staff who were bad hires/promotions.

We've got players who are bad evals. Keep going back to the UCF fans on their board who voiced similar complaints. Initially, I considered it sour grape over being jilted by a coach. They also complained about Heupels "system" and the fact that he had won with Frosts recruits but his recruiting results didn't appear to be at nearly the same level.

Can Heupel change? Hope so. I think he's a good man, but I have to wonder if his firing at OU damaged him to the point that he isn't willing to make the tough decisions that all college coaches face? He will get a pass this year due to the Nico teams antics. At some point soon, this will be the team that Heupel will have to own. I'm not sure how that will turn out for him.
 
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#153,704
#153,704
MoCo_Vol said:
The names thrown around and what they did last year.

Luke Altmyer - Illinois
211 of 347 passing for 60.8%, 2717 yards with 22 TDs and 6 INTs added 217 yards rushing with 4 TDs

Avery Johnson - Kansas St
217 of 372 passing for 58.3%, 2712 yards with 25 TDs and 10 INTs added 605 yards rushing with 7 TDs

Sawyer Robinson - Baylor
229 of 368 passing for 62.2%, 3071 yards with 28 TDs and 8 INTs added 230 yards rushing with 4 TDs

Rocco Becht - Iowa St
271 of 456 passing for 59.4%, 3505 yards with 25 TDs and 9 INTs added 318 yards rushing with 8 TDs
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Just to add to this, my talent & strength-adjusted PCAN (Points created above Nico) metric...

Johnson: 4.8 ppg
Robertson: 3.9 ppg
Becht: 2.7 ppg
Altmeyer: 0.7 ppg
 
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#153,712
#153,712
Ulysees E. McGill said:
So much compassion you can't tell the truth and call a spade a spade? A thief is a thief...a liar is a liar...a slime ball is a slimeball.

That's not compassion...that's justifying evil. I don't hate Nico really..I REALLY REALLY REALLY HATE what he just did...it was a horrid betrayal...period.
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Exactly. Goes to the eval process IMO. By all accounts, this relationship with Nico wasn't a short one. We targeted him very early in the process. With all the time and visits, with the money being discussed, with the group flights....all that time, there was never a question/uneasy feeling/concern about team Nico? Did Heupel star gaze or did he really get to know the kid and his family?

I don't know the answers, but the buck stops with Heupel. Kind of a red flag for me.
 
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#153,715
#153,715
CAVPUT said:
He needs to drastically upgrade his staff. I think his loyalty to guys in his sphere is admirable, but when they simply can't do the job at a level this league demands, it's the wrong move. We have some coaches on this staff who were bad hires/promotions.

We've got players who are bad evals. Keep going back to the UCF fans on their board who voiced similar complaints. Initially, I considered it sour grape over being jilted by a coach. They also complained about Heupels "system" and the fact that he had won with Frosts recruits but his recruiting results didn't appear to be at nearly the same level.

Can Heupel change? Hope so. I think he's a good man, but I have to wonder if his firing at OU damaged him to the point that he isn't willing to make the tough decisions that all college coaches face? He will get a pass this year due to the Nico teams antics. At some point soon, this will be the team that Heupel will have to own. I'm not sure how that will turn out for him.
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Its like City of Johnson City. If dont make Citizens happy. Young people leave, no one repopulates. Old people die:

Bad example. But similarly. You miss on a very large prrcentage of blue chippers, who had on campus. time and time again. ones you did land earlyv on, you can't keep because you got out talented in the big games. Sooner or later, the tarnish wears off.

Love this staff. But, it feels like the boat is taking on water. really thought with Nico leaving would be a positive. And still may be. Not getting the warm and fuzzies out of the porthole.

They were at a point with Orange Bowl win they could really stock pile talent. Same for playoff berth. Instead Florid reloaded. bama reloaded. georgia reloaded.

I mean 26 class we really have a grand opportunity to have one of those elite level next level classes. true to form we lost Keys. lost the NC DE, and havent landed anyone with any real difference ability.

Faizon is that guy. We have to surround him with best of the best. and that is simply not happening.
 
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#153,722
#153,722
CAVPUT said:
Yep, but fans won't want to take a critical look at this coach or his history at UCF.
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We've seen what Heupel is capable of when he has the right skill position personnel. Just can't wrap my head around him having his most successful season entirely with Pruitt's guys.

He just hasn't done a great job with his evaluations on the offensive side of the ball for whatever reason, especially at the WR position.
 
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#153,723
#153,723
CAVPUT said:
He needs to drastically upgrade his staff. I think his loyalty to guys in his sphere is admirable, but when they simply can't do the job at a level this league demands, it's the wrong move. We have some coaches on this staff who were bad hires/promotions.

We've got players who are bad evals. Keep going back to the UCF fans on their board who voiced similar complaints. Initially, I considered it sour grape over being jilted by a coach. They also complained about Heupels "system" and the fact that he had won with Frosts recruits but his recruiting results didn't appear to be at nearly the same level.

Can Heupel change? Hope so. I think he's a good man, but I have to wonder if his firing at OU damaged him to the point that he isn't willing to make the tough decisions that all college coaches face? He will get a pass this year due to the Nico teams antics. At some point soon, this will be the team that Heupel will have to own. I'm not sure how that will turn out for him.
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For what it's worth, the one year he didn't win 10 games at UCF was the 6-4 covid year and 2 of the losses were to top 15 teams (Cincinnati who went 9-1 with only a 3 point loss to Georgia in bowl game) and then lost to BYU in bowl game.

That defense was absolute trash though...but Randy Shannon had been there all 3 seasons so I'm sure he didn't expect them to have that sort of step back.

Still though every game was close in regular season. Lost to Tulsa by 8 (gave up 9 in the 4th quarter), lost at Memphis by 1 (gave up 21 in 4th quarter), lost to Cincinnati by 3 (gave up 14 in 4th quarter)
 
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#153,724
#153,724
Checker_the_Shire said:
You say this but I also wonder how much of the WR issues were on them and how much was on Nico. Hindsight being what it is now and now that the Nico blinders are taken off, there is enough evidence out there to show that Nico wasn’t the stud QB he was sold to us as. He had tons of overthrows to WR with at minimum 5 yards separation, he struggled to extend plays at several key moments, and his quickness at moving the offense along, something that’s crucial under Heupel’s schemes, was lackluster.

I’m not saying he was solely to blame, as there are definitely issues with our receivers, but I think it’s unfair to cast all that at the feet of the receiving core and cast them as bottom of the barrel.
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This^

How discouraging is it to WRs in this offense to run all over the field all night and have 0 faith they'll get the ball when they get open bc the QB will not predict the route and throw them open or hit them in stride. Bc the QB consistently holds the ball too long.

Then the WRs inevitably reduce their effort. Then they look bad.
 
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