War in Ukraine

[LSU-SIU]

PBS?

Lacking manpower, Ukraine resorts to harsh means to force draft dodgers into combat

A U.S. official said Ukraine should consider dropping the age of military conscription from 25 to 18. It's a stark acknowledgment that Ukraine doesn't have enough troops to fight the seemingly endless volume of Russian soldiers, especially now that they're being bolstered by North Korean troops...

www.pbs.org

Vance told the stupid coke addict right to his face with reporters standing all around them. Vance made it clear they have gone through all the weapon storage and the meat is on fumes.

 

[KB5252]

Please cite your source that Ukraine doesn't have enough manpower to continue to defend themselves.
View attachment 728881

2025 Ukraine Military Strength

Detailing the current military strength of Ukraine including air force, army, navy, financials and manpower.

www.globalfirepower.com

Are you living under a rock or something? I've seen it discussed on multiple news networks. Seen some trending videos on Facebook of squads patrolling for military aged men for for war.

And best source of all, a family friend and ex special forces operator who left just last week. I trust his assessment more than any source I could possibly cite. Said the issue isn't kit or equipment....... It's manpower and lack/ quality of front line troops.

You can believe what you want, I'll trust him. If there's one thing he knows it's combat....... It's the reason he'll likely never come home for more than a week or two at a time. Because he doesn't feel like he's suited for civilian life any longer.

 

[LouderVol]

Please cite your source that Ukraine doesn't have enough manpower to continue to defend themselves.
View attachment 728881

2025 Ukraine Military Strength

Detailing the current military strength of Ukraine including air force, army, navy, financials and manpower.

www.globalfirepower.com

does Zelensky count? he has consistently requested foreign troops to help with the Russians.

 

[BeardedVol]

does Zelensky count? he has consistently requested foreign troops to help with the Russians.

980k is the largest single army in continental Europe.

Ukraine's military is 980,000 soldiers strong, Zelensky says

"The Ukrainian army is the largest in Europe. The second place after us (France) is four times smaller than us," President Volodymyr Zelensky said.

kyivindependent.com

Meanwhile Russia has been reduced to bringing in North Koreans because they can't take any more workers from their economy as cannon fodder.

 

[LouderVol]

980k is the largest single army in continental Europe.

Ukraine's military is 980,000 soldiers strong, Zelensky says

"The Ukrainian army is the largest in Europe. The second place after us (France) is four times smaller than us," President Volodymyr Zelensky said.

kyivindependent.com

Meanwhile Russia has been reduced to bringing in North Koreans because they can't take any more workers from their economy as cannon fodder.

having the largest army doesn't mean its enough.

and Russia being able to mobilize foreign troops just multiplies the problem facing Ukraine, instead of taking away from it.

 

[KB5252]

980k is the largest single army in continental Europe.

Ukraine's military is 980,000 soldiers strong, Zelensky says

"The Ukrainian army is the largest in Europe. The second place after us (France) is four times smaller than us," President Volodymyr Zelensky said.

kyivindependent.com

Meanwhile Russia has been reduced to bringing in North Koreans because they can't take any more workers from their economy as cannon fodder.

I'm not sure I believe that number, I think that may be the number the mobilized in total, but they do not have that fighting force currently...... Even if I were to believe that number......... Why then would Ukraine not be running this war and steadily losing ground?

 

[Rocky_Top_Vol13]

 

[LSU-SIU]

I'm not sure I believe that number, I think that may be the number the mobilized in total, but they do not have that fighting force currently...... Even if I were to believe that number......... Why then would Ukraine not be running this war and steadily losing ground?

Instead of just giving the plan its always back to the vicious cycle of nonsense. There is no plan, the Russians will always be able to put more troops in there if required. The only real way would be all of Europe and the U.S. going in there in mass which would most likely lead to WW3.

The number of troops the Ukrainians can throw into vans is not really material even at this stage, the other side can always go +1.

 

[volbound1700]

Instead of just giving the plan its always back to the vicious cycle of nonsense. There is no plan, the Russians will always be able to put more troops in there if required. The only real way would be all of Europe and the U.S. going in there in mass which would most likely lead to WW3.

The number of troops the Ukrainians can throw into vans is not really material even at this stage, the other side can always go +1.

I think it is a negotiating tool to use against Putin (whether built on merit or not).

 

[BeardedVol]

I'm not sure I believe that number, I think that may be the number the mobilized in total, but they do not have that fighting force currently...... Even if I were to believe that number......... Why then would Ukraine not be running this war and steadily losing ground?

Feel free to provide your own sourced numbers if you choose to believe that Zelensky is lying.

You can't field a combat battalion, of any type, if you can't arm it. We slowed hardware deliveries at the end of 2024, and all but stopped them in 2025. Ukraine has lowered their conscription age cap from 27 to 25, and I would wager they go lower, but it's a moot point if they can't arm them though.

We never did actually provide military support in the quantity that we'd promised, at any point the last three years, and then people sit around and say things like "why isn't Ukraine winning? We gave them BILLIONS OF DOLLARSSS!!!1111!!" when reality tells a different story.

 

[KB5252]

Feel free to provide your own sourced numbers if you choose to believe that Zelensky is lying.

You can't field a combat battalion, of any type, if you can't arm it. We slowed hardware deliveries at the end of 2024, and all but stopped them in 2025. Ukraine has lowered their conscription age cap from 27 to 25, and I would wager they go lower, but it's a moot point if they can't arm them though.

We never did actually provide military support in the quantity that we'd promised, at any point the last three years, and then people sit around and say things like "why isn't Ukraine winning? We gave them BILLIONS OF DOLLARSSS!!!1111!!" when reality tells a different story.

I do not believe Zelenski's numbers.

They have plenty of small arms. Anti tank systems etc are abundant. The armored vehicles are a dinosaur, drone tech was a game changer. Artillery and missile systems, defensive and offensive are still important.

Russian battle tactics are to focus volume on selected targets to overwhelm them. They have modified this somewhat for the Ukraine offensive though. If Ukraine's numbers were as stated they would have roughly the same fighting force available to then as Russia does. With plenty of small arms and ammunition they should be holding their own.

The US has supplied money and military assets from armories on the European theater. Those large sums of money and his we've given were either greatly overstated (meaning we were lied to), or much of it was appropriated and or stolen/laundered (this is very possible as they are very similar to Russia in that respect),

The issue I have at this point, as a long time supporter of Ukraine, is that it isn't sustainable, we can't keep supporting this, Europe certainly can't. And we can't continue down this path, it ends with us caught up in war.

 

[BeardedVol]

I do not believe Zelenski's numbers.

They have plenty of small arms. Anti tank systems etc are abundant. The armored vehicles are a dinosaur, drone tech was a game changer. Artillery and missile systems, defensive and offensive are still important.

Russian battle tactics are to focus volume on selected targets to overwhelm them. They have modified this somewhat for the Ukraine offensive though. If Ukraine's numbers were as stated they would have roughly the same fighting force available to then as Russia does. With plenty of small arms and ammunition they should be holding their own.

The US has supplied money and military assets from armories on the European theater. Those large sums of money and his we've given were either greatly overstated (meaning we were lied to), or much of it was appropriated and or stolen/laundered (this is very possible as they are very similar to Russia in that respect),

The issue I have at this point, as a long time supporter of Ukraine, is that it isn't sustainable, we can't keep supporting this, Europe certainly can't. And we can't continue down this path, it ends with us caught up in war.

We've barely given anything in terms of what we have sitting in storage what will be aged out and replaced rather than be used. We could have given them more, and not compromised our own battle readiness. The vast majority of any actual funding that was appropriated for Ukraine, was used to purchase replacements for equipment that we did actually send (whether we needed to replace it or not), and doesn't even reflect that actual value of the equipment sent to them.

New analysis from Economists for Ukraine: The cost of US aid to Ukraine is less than half the official figures

The US has been the largest country-to-country contributor of aid to Ukraine since the start of Russia’s full-scale invasion in 2022. However, the exact amount of aid provided has become the subject of debate, as generally available data tend to bundle together grants, loans, equipment...

cepr.org

 

[KB5252]

We've barely given anything in terms of what we have sitting in storage what will be aged out and replaced rather than be used. We could have given them more, and not compromised our own battle readiness. The vast majority of any actual funding that was appropriated for Ukraine, was used to purchase replacements for equipment that we did actually send (whether we needed to replace it or not), and doesn't even reflect that actual value of the equipment sent to them.

View attachment 729040
View attachment 729042

New analysis from Economists for Ukraine: The cost of US aid to Ukraine is less than half the official figures

The US has been the largest country-to-country contributor of aid to Ukraine since the start of Russia’s full-scale invasion in 2022. However, the exact amount of aid provided has become the subject of debate, as generally available data tend to bundle together grants, loans, equipment...

cepr.org

We don't need that equipment, but the rest of Europe absolutely does. Since WWII they have manufactured next to zero on the way of military armament.. Save some tanks and aircraft. But nothing approaching what would be needed to defend themselves. It would take them years to develop/manufacturer the arms needed to replace those.

What we did it didn't do up to this point is water under the bridge. Coulda, shoulda, woulda. Where we're at today is all that really matters.

 

[jmacvols1]

 

[Orange_Crush]

Pics or it doesn't happen... lol

 

[jmacvols1]

Pics or it doesn't happen... lol

may sign a bigger deal with Congo

 

[jmacvols1]

Pics or it doesn't happen... lol

 

[Carl Pickens]

Nate has been to Ukraine, and seen first hand what the Russians have done there. JD has watched Fox News while copulating with couches instead.

Which one's opinion on the subject should have more weight?

I thought no one could ever rival Luther’s fellation of all things liberal. I was wrong

 

[BeardedVol]

We don't need that equipment, but the rest of Europe absolutely does. Since WWII they have manufactured next to zero on the way of military armament.. Save some tanks and aircraft. But nothing approaching what would be needed to defend themselves. It would take them years to develop/manufacturer the arms needed to replace those.

What we did it didn't do up to this point is water under the bridge. Coulda, shoulda, woulda. Where we're at today is all that really matters.

Stopping Russia in Ukraine lessens the need for that equipment in Europe.

Besides if you are worried that Russia is going to escalate the war in the rest of Europe then it's a pretty dumb decision to allow Ukraine to fall.

 

[Orange_Crush]

Stopping Russia in Ukraine lessens the need for that equipment in Europe.

Besides if you are worried that Russia is going to escalate the war in the rest of Europe then it's a pretty dumb decision to allow Ukraine to fall.

What if we're not worried that Russia is going to escalate to the rest of Europe?

 

[LSU-SIU]

What if we're not worried that Russia is going to escalate to the rest of Europe?

There is no plan and if Europe is next...

(for the record, I think Europe is next... but they will be at war with themselves not Russia)

Btw, how in the hell will the Russian do this with shovels and washing machines?

 

[C-south]

There is no plan and if Europe is next...

(for the record, I think Europe is next... but they will be at war with themselves not Russia)

Btw, how in the hell will the Russian do this with shovels and washing machines?

We saved them from speaking German. They can save their own ass from speaking Russian.

 

[LSU-SIU]

We saved them from speaking German. They can save their own ass from speaking Russian.

They got themselves into that mess...it's up to them to get themselves out.

 

[KB5252]

Stopping Russia in Ukraine lessens the need for that equipment in Europe.

Besides if you are worried that Russia is going to escalate the war in the rest of Europe then it's a pretty dumb decision to allow Ukraine to fall.

I don't believe for a minute Russia can/wants to move beyond Ukraine. They've spent their best fighting units, depleted their reserves etc. just as Ukraine has.

Europe are the ones that believe he is, that doesn't make much sense to me. The reasons for Russia making the moves they have have been discussed here already. It was now or never. But they've been very careful and deliberate. Any foray further into Europe would illicit a response they are ill equiped for, they know this. Fighting a European and American proxy has been more than they bargained for.

Having that arsenal in reserve helps to insure they make no further moves. Committing it just makes it more likely we enter an all or nothing scenario that cascades out of control IMO.

I believe committing to war with Russia is a mistake....... And continuing down this path is where that leads us.

 

[MontyPython]

The question isn't if we can save Ukraine. The question is how far are we willing to go to save what we can of Ukraine. There is no leverage to negotiate with, Zelenski and Ukraine have lost the war. The only way they can continue the fight past a few more months is large influx of soldiers, Russia knows this, we know this, all of Europe knows this........ You know this.

Would you risk American soldiers by the 10's of thousands for this conflict? That's what it would take. I would not send my daughter's generation to fight this war, much less risk a wider conflict possibly including nuclear weapons.

We find ourselves in an impossible situation. I didn't think Trump is the best person to navigate this but that is beside the point. I don't think he is wrong in seeking to avoid broader conflict however.

I'm curious to know what you would like to see happen here? What would you do if you were in power right now?

Link.