War in Ukraine

[LouderVol]

I don't see what difference it makes if we hand them over for free or if they pay for them.

We are still a party in the war. That is what should be most concerning.

We are already IN IT...

so do you consider Iran, North Korea, and China at war as well? you always blow smoke saying the entire west can't take on Russia, but ignore that all of the almighty east can't take on little ole Ukraine.

and how do you not see the difference? One is capitalism, the other just good ole government grifting. This is just yet another case of blowing bs out of both sides of your mouth. You go on and on about how we should focus on trade with everyone, but when we could trade with someone you don't agree with, its suddenly a bad thing.

 

[LouderVol]

The West initiated and wanted this war. Over the last 10 years, Russia has made multiple attempts to keep this from where we are today.

which is why Ukraine was able to launch a massive invasion into Russia and get within 50km of Moscow......oh wait, that's backwards. Russia is the one who actually built up for years, and used their territorial gains to create advanced positions within Ukrainian territory.

 

[LouderVol]

Those are western trained troops using western weapons in Ukraine and they are taking HUGE losses. Your confident stupidity is amusing.

yall have claimed all/most of the western trained troops were already dead, and thats why Ukraine was having to go the cannon fodder route rounding up people on the streets.

I love when you guys can't keep your bs straight. makes it really easy to see how wrong you are.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Those western death cults with evil gay nazis that run western gay nazi bio labs.... It's all their fault for crying out loud. Russia is the real victim here. Waaahhhhhhhhhhhh

How would the United States respond if the Russians or Chinese would have overthrown the Mexican govt and installed a leadership that was not only hostile to the US, but they also armed and trained them?

You know the answer...

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

They do not compare to the German war machine of the 30s/40s. Europe can handle Russia on their own if need be.

You mean the German army that had 80% of its casualties on the Eastern Front?

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Another laughable post. The Russian military is a paper tiger for obvious reasons, including the fact they have struggled over the past 2 years to gain ground against a much inferior military on paper. They're gaining ground now because of attrition of Ukrainian forces due to Russia's massive amounts of men they've thrown to the front lines to be used as cannon fodder. They do not compare to the German war machine of the 30s/40s. Europe can handle Russia on their own if need be.

Just stop. The Russians are not going in with a "Shock and Awe" or Dresden/Gaza strategy. You just had dignitaries and EU bureaucrats running around Kyiv this past weekend to commemorate the 2nd anniversary of the conflict. Had Russia gone in like the US or Israel, Kyiv and Lviv would have been rubble within the first month.

Unlike the US and Israel, the Russians are actually trying to minimize civilian casualties because the areas they are fighting in are fellow Slavs that overwhelmingly identify as Russian.

If you think that the Russians are going to follow this same strategy if the Poles or NATO jump in, then you are mistaken. That is when the gloves will come off.

 

[LouderVol]

How would the United States respond if the Russians or Chinese would have overthrown the Mexican govt and installed a leadership that was not only hostile to the US, but they also armed and trained them?

You know the answer...

except none of that is what happened.

you also left out that in this scenario the Americans sent Delta in to rescue to the Mexican president before he had been officially removed from power via the Mexican Constitution. while at the same time using other SOF to occupy Baja kicking out and killing the local government; and then flooding Sonora with Black Rock troops and active duty soldiers and equipment. That was all preplanned and set up ready to go before any of your alleged triggering events.

 

[BeardedVol]

How would the United States respond if the Russians or Chinese would have overthrown the Mexican govt and installed a leadership that was not only hostile to the US, but they also armed and trained them?

You know the answer...

Since no one, not the US, not the EU, not NATO, overthrew the Ukrainian government, it's a moot point.

No one forced Yanukovych to order his Berkut to fire on protesters.

No one forced Yanukovych to abscond to Russia to avoid responsibility for murdering those protesters.

No one forced the Rada to vote Yanukovych out of office (a vote that included members of his own party).

Not to mention, that by Russia's own admission, the invasion of Crimea began before Yanukovych had even fled, and in fact coincided with him ordering the shooting of protesters.

 

[LouderVol]

Just stop. The Russians are not going in with a "Shock and Awe" or Dresden/Gaza strategy. You just had dignitaries and EU bureaucrats running around Kyiv this past weekend to commemorate the 2nd anniversary of the conflict. Had Russia gone in like the US or Israel, Kyiv and Lviv would have been rubble within the first month.

Unlike the US and Israel, the Russians are actually trying to minimize civilian casualties because the areas they are fighting in are fellow Slavs that overwhelmingly identify as Russian.

If you think that the Russians are going to follow this same strategy if the Poles or NATO jump in, then you are mistaken. That is when the gloves will come off.

blatantly false. Crimea was the only part that had more Russians than Ukrainians, and it still wasn't more than 50%.

 

[evillawyer]

 

[volgr]

"Unprovoked"

 

[volgr]

Still see you talking to yourself Larry. The second most powerful army in the world and the most powerful army in Europe has had its navy decimated by a country with no navy

Completely false. Early in the war, when Ukraine still had it's best western trained forces, they lost Mauripol even with a huge numbers advantage. An embarrassing loss for the West.

This is all one needs to know/study to see how the EU would fare vs Russia.

This was an early indicator as well of how the war would go for Ukraine going forward. It only got worse from there as western trained troops were being replaced with more and more untrained troops. Which we then get to the utter embarrassment that was the Ukrainian "offensive" last summer/fall that resulted in a grotesque amount of casualties for Ukraine.

Anyone wanting war with Russia should have their head examined.

 

[LouderVol]

"Unprovoked"

why would it matter? We already have "CIA bases" on the Russian border. you guys have never explained why none of these things matter until its Ukraine.

Poland, Lithuania, Estonia, Latvia, Finland, and maybe finally Sweden join NATO creating thousands of miles of borders with Russia, and not a single peep from Putin.

Putin makes up something about Ukraine joining NATO, and suddenly its an existential problem, but only in that extremely isolated instance.

 

[LouderVol]

Those are western trained troops using western weapons in Ukraine and they are taking HUGE losses. Your confident stupidity is amusing.

yall have claimed all/most of the western trained troops were already dead, and thats why Ukraine was having to go the cannon fodder route rounding up people on the streets.

I love when you guys can't keep your bs straight. makes it really easy to see how wrong you are.

Completely false. Early in the war, when Ukraine still had it's best western trained forces, they lost Mauripol even with a huge numbers advantage. An embarrassing loss for the West.

This is all one needs to know/study to see how the EU would fare vs Russia.

This was an early indicator as well of how the war would go for Ukraine going forward. It only got worse from there as western trained troops were being replaced with more and more untrained troops. Which we then get to the utter embarrassment that was the Ukrainian "offensive" last summer/fall that resulted in a grotesque amount of casualties for Ukraine.

Anyone wanting war with Russia should have their head examined.

there we go, in the space of 12 hrs he is contradicting himself.

 

[hog88]

You mean the German army that had 80% of its casualties on the Eastern Front?

It would be a completely different war. The Germans just like Napolean's army lost more men to the elements, starvation and suicide than the Russians killed within Russia. Yes, the Russians slaughtered a lot of Germans once they crossed into Poland/Germany but by that point the Germans were fighting a losing war on 2 fronts and their industrial base had been mostly smashed.

 

[volgr]

why would it matter? We already have "CIA bases" on the Russian border. you guys have never explained why none of these things matter until its Ukraine.

Poland, Lithuania, Estonia, Latvia, Finland, and maybe finally Sweden join NATO creating thousands of miles of borders with Russia, and not a single peep from Putin.

Putin makes up something about Ukraine joining NATO, and suddenly its an existential problem, but only in that extremely isolated instance.

Putin has been worried about the western creep of NATO for over a couple of decades. He has been worried about the West using Ukraine as a staging point for influence operations inside of Russia. This is one of a long list of western provocations, yet western propaganda screams UNPROVOKED!!

 

[volgr]

there we go, in the space of 12 hrs he is contradicting himself.

There is no contradiction, unless you are trying to create one.

 

[hog88]

Putin has been worried about the western creep of NATO for over a couple of decades. He has been worried about the West using Ukraine as a staging point for influence operations inside of Russia. This is one of a long list of western provocations, yet western propaganda screams UNPROVOKED!!

Yeah, with the internet, satellite TV and radio one has to be next door to stage an influence operation.

 

[volgr]

Anyone wanting war with Russia should have their head examined.

Also, anyone wanting this war to continue in Ukraine, should also have their head examined. Ukrainians are being absolutely slaughtered on the battlefield, contrary to the western propaganda useful idiots like Evil, Monty, Bearded and Dallas constantly propagate in this thread.

As I have said many times, I don't hate or even dislike Ukraine. A few of their politicians were bought off by the western death cult and now their people are suffering tremendously because of it. It is beyond evil and it lays directly at the feet of the western death cult. These are vile, despicable, satanic people. Anyone supporting the continuation of this war is supporting that.

 

[volgr]

Yeah, with the internet, satellite TV and radio one has to be next door to stage an influence operation.

All of those communications are easily trackable and traceable. Try again.

 

[hog88]

All of those communications are easily trackable and traceable. Try again.

So? And if they are so easy to track and trace why are so few scammers and hackers actually caught?

 

[volgr]

So? And if they are so easy to track and trace why are so few scammers and hackers actually caught?

Because there isn't a lot of effort put into catching them. You don't think our gov't or Russia's gov't collects and monitors all digital communication? Come on.

 

[hog88]

Because there isn't a lot of effort put into catching them. You don't think our gov't or Russia's gov't collects and monitors all digital communication? Come on.

Absolutely they do but how does this reinforce your point?

Influence operations can be launched from almost anywhere on the globe.

 

[BeardedVol]

Putin has been worried about the western creep of NATO for over a couple of decades. He has been worried about the West using Ukraine as a staging point for influence operations inside of Russia. This is one of a long list of western provocations, yet western propaganda screams UNPROVOKED!!

So worried that he's emptied Russian bases near Finland and Norway.

https://www.ft.com/content/f7587dc3-3518-4084-b68a-1dd00ab83e2e

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/russian-forces-near-norway-are-20-fewer-than-before-ukraine-war-norways-armed-2023-09-16/

Putin debunks his own propaganda by disarming Russia’s NATO borders

Putin publicly blames NATO for provoking the invasion of Ukraine, but Russia's recent demilitarization of the country's borders with neighboring NATO members makes a mockery of such claims, writes Peter Dickinson.

www.atlanticcouncil.org

 

[LouderVol]

Just stop. The Russians are not going in with a "Shock and Awe" or Dresden/Gaza strategy. You just had dignitaries and EU bureaucrats running around Kyiv this past weekend to commemorate the 2nd anniversary of the conflict. Had Russia gone in like the US or Israel, Kyiv and Lviv would have been rubble within the first month.

Unlike the US and Israel, the Russians are actually trying to minimize civilian casualties because the areas they are fighting in are fellow Slavs that overwhelmingly identify as Russian.

If you think that the Russians are going to follow this same strategy if the Poles or NATO jump in, then you are mistaken. That is when the gloves will come off.

have you not seen the pictures of the fighting that is going on? Its at least to a WW2 level. entire cities leveled. Russia has gone after Kyiv and Lviv, and targeted power grids far from the front lines.

the reason you didn't see that from the start is because the Russian command miscalculated. not that the Russians are somehow better/different.