The (many) indictments of Donald Trump

#5,526
#5,526
RockyTop85 said:
I mean I think those are the lawful votes and the only ones that should be counted, but what stops the losers from submitting fake votes? What stops the various next steps that those votes were intended to allow?

It should be common decency and respect for voters, the constitution, and electoral process but in the event that all of that fails to be sufficient I’m fine with criminal prosecution as a backstop.
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I thought we actually vote for electors who supposedly represent a candidate, and those electors once chosen are the ones who submit the actual votes for the person to be president. So in theory the individual states should have a list of electors who "won" the right to cast the actual votes for the president. It seems like the issue would be far less about fake votes if the process is followed than about faithless electors, although party allegiance should generally cover that issue. With today's technology, the whole process of electing electors seems like an obsolete concept.
 
#5,527
#5,527
whodeycin85 said:
Stupid yes.... legality is the question.... Are electors selected before the election??
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The Davidson Co ballot listed things this way - clearly shows "electors for". Other state ballots don't necessarily follow that format. I believe in past years the individual electors were listed on the ballot which would mean they were selected before the election, but it's entirely possible that I don't remember that correctly.

Electors for

 Donald J. Trump

for President and

Michael R. Pence

for Vice President Republican Party Nominee

Electors for

 Joseph R. Biden

for President and

Kamala D. Harris

for Vice President Democratic Party Nominee

Electors for

 Don Blankenship

for President and

William Mohr

for Vice President Independent Candidate
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#5,528
#5,528
RockyTop85 said:
I don’t want NARA deciding which votes get counted. It should be congress and courts should make sure they follow state law.

The problems, IMO, are that the law that governs what congress does isn’t very clear and leaves open the possibility that this could work. Courts would probably undo it but there was some expectation that that was in the bag, too. The other problem, to me, is that prosecuting people under broad statutes may be too much of a deterrent. There needs to be a law (or law + constitutional amendment) that explicitly lays out the procedure and articulates how congress will decide the authentic votes in the event of a legitimate dispute and that criminalizes fraudulently submitted votes but excludes alternate slates that are submitted in good faith from prosecution.*

*- E.g. the false electors in PA and NM wrote on the document that their votes were submitted only in case Trump prevailed in his legal challenges in their state. I don’t think that’s criminal.
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Definitely. It doesn't even make sense that NARA is involved in the process until preserving the records after the event.
 
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#5,529
#5,529
Fulton County judges recused from Trump's attempt to quash 2020 election probe grand jury (fox5atlanta.com)

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#5,530
#5,530
Donald Trump prosecutor Jack Smith has racked up nearly $2million in security costs to protect him and his family from threats as Taxpayers shell out nearly $10 Million to investigate former president

The special counsel investigating Donald Trump for mishandling classified documents and alleged attempts to overturn the 2020 election has cost U.S. taxpayers over $10 Million so far - including $2 Million in security.

Jack Smith was appointed on November 18, and now has a team of 40 to 60 prosecutors, paralegals and support staff working to investigate the former president.

Smith, his family and other prosecutors are now being protected by U.S. Marshalls - at a cost so far of $2 Million.

Smith's wife, documentary filmmaker Katy Chevigny, has also come under attack from Trump after he learned she produced a documentary about Michelle Obama, Becoming, and had donated to Joe Biden's campaign.

73537263-12330033-Taxpayers_have_spent_nearly_2_million_on_U_S_Marshalls_protectin-a-16_1690167598117.jpg

Taxpayers have spent nearly $2 million on U.S. Marshalls protecting Smith and his wife Katy Chevigny (above), plus other prosecutors and staff. Trump has attacked them all online

Donald Trump prosecutor Jack Smith has racked up nearly $2million in security costs to protect him and his family from threats as taxpayers shell out nearly $10million to investigate former president | Daily Mail Online
 
#5,536
#5,536
Franklin Pierce said:
Donald Trump prosecutor Jack Smith has racked up nearly $2million in security costs to protect him and his family from threats as Taxpayers shell out nearly $10 Million to investigate former president

The special counsel investigating Donald Trump for mishandling classified documents and alleged attempts to overturn the 2020 election has cost U.S. taxpayers over $10 Million so far - including $2 Million in security.

Jack Smith was appointed on November 18, and now has a team of 40 to 60 prosecutors, paralegals and support staff working to investigate the former president.

Smith, his family and other prosecutors are now being protected by U.S. Marshalls - at a cost so far of $2 Million.

Smith's wife, documentary filmmaker Katy Chevigny, has also come under attack from Trump after he learned she produced a documentary about Michelle Obama, Becoming, and had donated to Joe Biden's campaign.

73537263-12330033-Taxpayers_have_spent_nearly_2_million_on_U_S_Marshalls_protectin-a-16_1690167598117.jpg

Taxpayers have spent nearly $2 million on U.S. Marshalls protecting Smith and his wife Katy Chevigny (above), plus other prosecutors and staff. Trump has attacked them all online

Donald Trump prosecutor Jack Smith has racked up nearly $2million in security costs to protect him and his family from threats as taxpayers shell out nearly $10million to investigate former president | Daily Mail Online
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I thought his purchase of a Subway sandwich was a secret message to all Trump supporters to stand down...

Better consult the panel at CNN
 
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#5,541
#5,541
Caculator said:
political posturing
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Trump claiming his lawyers had good meeting with prosecutors is exactly that, so that when he gets indicted the MAGA resentment class can collectively whine that there was going to be no indictment but Garland and Biden leaned on officials to do it.
 
#5,542
#5,542
Superseding indictment in the documents case. Trump is alleged to have told one of the workers there to delete video from the security system.

If that is true and he is convicted, he'll go to prison. And rightfully so.
 
#5,545
#5,545
lawgator1 said:
Weight has to be given to his having been POTUS, yes. But if he's conspiring to destroy evidence, and it's concerning classified documents, I don't think it can be minimized. Way too significant an offense.
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Yes, his actions would have him locked up in a Federal Prison until he passes were he a regular citizen. His presidency gives him some leniency as to sentence.
 
#5,546
#5,546
BernardKingGOAT said:
Yes, his actions would have him locked up in a Federal Prison until he passes were he a regular citizen. His presidency gives him some leniency as to sentence.
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Him running for POTUS again is proof he thinks executive privileges will fix this for him. The dumbest SOBs in this country will follow this con man and grifter to the grave
 
#5,549
#5,549
"The documents were planted."
"They were declassified by thought."
Even if they weren't declassified, I had a right to keep them."

These are all, on the record, documented statements from Trump. On the record too, are requests for donations.
 
#5,550
#5,550
lawgator1 said:
Weight has to be given to his having been POTUS, yes. But if he's conspiring to destroy evidence, and it's concerning classified documents, I don't think it can be minimized. Way too significant an offense.
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Are there minimum and maximum sentences in Federal Court for the crimes he is charged with?
 
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