Gun control debate (merged)

[hog88]

You're a simpleton.

Maybe so but even a simpleton is a mental giant compared to you.

 

[VolStrom]

It's the only correct answer. No tap dancing involved.
You guys are the consistent black or white thinkers.
I am the consistent continuum thinker.

So you think I'm a black or white thinker? I feel insulted by that.

 

[luthervol]

Maybe so but even a simpleton is a mental giant compared to you.

You certainly got me on that one.

 

[Vol8188]

The law went into effect in 2002. The buyback portion was in 2003.

So we agree that’s not why homicides dropped in 2002.

It seems you’re failing all around. You can’t tell me why white homicide rates are on par with countries that have far less guns. You can’t tell me why New Hampshire has more guns, poverty, looser laws, and essentially the same homicides as Canada.

You’ve yet to show anything that points to the issue actually being the guns.

 

[luthervol]

So you think I'm a black or white thinker? I feel insulted by that.

It was Hog and McDad in this instance.

 

[luthervol]

So we agree that’s not why homicides dropped in 2002.

It seems you’re failing all around. You can’t tell me why white homicide rates are on par with countries that have far less guns. You can’t tell me why New Hampshire has more guns, poverty, looser laws, and essentially the same homicides as Canada.

You’ve yet to show anything that points to the issue actually being the guns.

No we agreed that it was precisely why they dropped.

 

[Vol8188]

No we agreed that it was precisely why they dropped.

Homicides in 2002 dropped because of gun confiscations in 2003? Please explain.

 

[luthervol]

Homicides in 2002 dropped because of gun confiscations in 2003? Please explain.

No silly, the buy back was only a small portion of the law.

 

[Vol8188]

No silly, the buy back was only a small portion of the law.

So they still had the guns? I thought guns were the problem ?

Can you link the law you’re referencing?

 

[newokie03]

Every time I venture into this thread and see ya'll "debating" with Luther, in my best Cleavon Little voice I say "why you do that to yoself"?

 

[luthervol]

So they still had the guns? I thought guns were the problem ?

Can you link the law you’re referencing?

National Handgun Control Agreement in Australia

 

[Vol8188]

National Handgun Control Agreement in Australia

That’s not a link

 

[Vol8188]

National Handgun Control Agreement in Australia

Is this what you’re talking about? The 2003 act? That lowered homicides in 2002?

National Handgun Buyback Act 2003

 

[LouderVol]

From the linked study..........
In the synthetic control approach that compared the overall homicide trends in Australia pre- and post-NFA with trends from 28 other countries aggregated and weighted to create a counterfactual condition, Bartos et al. (2020) found that the reduction in overall homicide experienced by Australia was about 50 percent larger than would have been expected had Australia not enacted the NFA, although the greatest decline (and deviation in total homicide rates between Australia and the synthetic control) occurred not in 1996 but in 2002, which coincides with the passage of the National Handgun Control Agreement in Australia.

Does anyone know what a "counterfactual condition" means in this context, because the base definition means "not real"?

 

[Vol8188]

Does anyone know what a "counterfactual condition" means in this context, because the base definition means "not real"?

I’d love to know how the authors defend claiming it took 6 years to have an impact. Seems more like it coincided with the world wide reduction in crime that was also seen here and everywhere else

 

[85SugarVol]

So you're saying a simple assault victim is the same as a homicide victim??

Does a homicide victim rank higher on your victim continuum than a rape victim? A rape victim deserves less sympathy than a homicide victim.

 

[McDad]

That's because his question was to vague.
I would favor some limitations and restrictions and oppose others.

It's open ended. You can prescribe whatever restrictions you feel would accomplish the improvement in that demographic of America.

 

[luthervol]

That’s not a link

But it is pretty easy to google

 

[luthervol]

Is this what you’re talking about? The 2003 act? That lowered homicides in 2002?

National Handgun Buyback Act 2003

Nope

 

[luthervol]

It's open ended. You can prescribe whatever restrictions you feel would accomplish the improvement in that demographic of America.

Then my answer stands

 

[McDad]

Then my answer stands

That's because his question was to vague.
I would favor some limitations and restrictions and oppose others.

This one?

 

[Vol8188]

But it is pretty easy to google

Then do it. If it requires so little effort let’s see this bill of yours that went into effect in 2003 but retroactively stopped crime

 

[Vol8188]

Nope

Like every other thread you’re in, you’ve got nothing

 

[DancingOutlaw]

False
Gun Control in Australia, Updated - FactCheck.org
In fact, the most recent government report on crime trends in Australia says, “Homicide in Australia has declined over the last 25 years. The current homicide incidence rate is the lowest on record in the past 25 years.”

Actually, Australian crime statistics show a marked decrease in homicides since the gun law change. According to the Australian Institute of Criminology, a government agency, the number of homicides in Australia did increase slightly in 1997 and peaked in 1999, but has since declined to the lowest number on record in 2007, the most recent year for which official figures are available.”

The homicide rate in the US has also fallen over the last 25 years. Do you think it's due to us banning guns, or maybe something else?

 

[Vol8188]

The homicide rate in the US has also fallen over the last 25 years. Do you think it's due to us banning guns, or maybe something else?

His rate also fell 6 years after the ban, in 2002. Lol but that’s because of the new legislation in 2002 that he refuses to link