War in Ukraine

[landscapingvol]

They need to start building up Heart of Iron 4 style. In the late 1930s, UK and France started to finally rearm after Germany had been doing it since 1933 but it was a little too late.

France didn’t rearm, they built static fortifications expecting another slow moving conventional war much like WW1. They learned absolutely nothing from the end of WW1 which is why they collapsed in 6 weeks. The British were the only ones who adapted to modern warfare along with the US

 

[VolStrom]

I agree with this but I also think if this becomes bigger than just piece of Ukraine our European "friends" need to carry the vast majority of the load.

They need to carry the majority of the load. We don't have a dog in this fight and if that damn ****** retard that was installed into the presidency has his way, we'll be at war soon.

 

[landscapingvol]

NATO is a military alliance. Countries that aren't part of the alliance shouldn't expect NATO to defend them with military support. The examples you are discussing are all countries that are not part of said alliance.

I trust you can understand the difference Ukraine and NATO members.

On second thought, maybe you can't.

You are like discussing any topic with a half eaten sandwich. I will ask you again what NATO has done or is doing to prevent Russian aggression? Remind me again how Ukraine isn’t in NATO as if that is any kind of a defense, at no point have even remotely implied they were but Russia is threatening Eastern Europe. I look forward to Secretary General of NATO’s tough worded speech

 

[davethevol]

I think we will roll over and let Russia have Ukraine but it won't stop there. Russia will be back at it in 3-5 years and this time it will be the Baltics or Poland which will lead us into World War 3. This gives me Germany/Czechoslovakia 1938-type vibes.

I don’t think it’s 3 to 5 years on anything. I think they start moving quickly on any other desired territories. Putin has been planning on this moment for a long time, and he knows how weak we are right now. If China takes Taiwan soon, my fear is that these escalate quickly from regional fights to something worldwide.

 

[happy-go_vol]

if you are not backing the President and Vice President Harris and the US military at a time of need, when a madman with an arsenal is attacking us and our allies, I would say there is a reason for that. Anyone of sound mind left needs to get off social. There is a real world out there to take care of at home. putin maybe a crazy old man, but russia has been a leader at cyber attacks, brain washing, and creating conflict since the late 90's. Being on social media is not a job. It's an opportunity for exploitation. If you don't have the history or knowledge of which you speak stop amplifying the problem. I have full faith in the United States and her allies, and if we don't end this, the people of Russia might. They have already tried several times. Now is their chance. He cannot fight two fronts.

Comedy. You didn't do in blue font. You that Harris is on America's side? Bless your heart

 

[landscapingvol]

They need to carry the majority of the load. We don't have a dog in this fight and if that damn ****** retard that was installed into the presidency has his way, we'll be at war soon.

Don’t worry they will supply as many berets and NATO patches any US soldier could ever want or need

 

[happy-go_vol]

I don’t think it’s 3 to 5 years on anything. I think they start moving quickly on any other desired territories. Putin has been planning on this moment for a long time, and he knows how weak we are right now. If China takes Taiwan soon, my fear is that these escalate quickly from regional fights to something worldwide.

Yeah, but we have elite trannies in our military so there's that

 

[volbound1700]

France didn’t rearm, they built static fortifications expecting another slow moving conventional war much like WW1. They learned absolutely nothing from the end of WW1 which is why they collapsed in 6 weeks. The British were the only ones who adapted to modern warfare along with the US

They were rearming, just not well. France bought tons of weapons from USA (our army was **** then as well and would have been pummeled by the Germans similar to France had we shared a border and been in the war).

France didn't have the military industry that Germany had built up in 1933. Similarly, UK took time to rearm as well. Most of their modern military that you referenced didn't come around until 1941-1942 so it took them 2 years of warfare and 4-5 years of build-up prior to get to that state.

 

[Hunerwadel]

I agree with this but I also think if this becomes bigger than just piece of Ukraine our European "friends" need to carry the vast majority of the load.

I won't argue with that at all. I also would hope they've figured out beforehand what each country's role is in different scenarios. I always assumed that's the reason allied nations have military exercises.

 

[volbound1700]

I don’t think it’s 3 to 5 years on anything. I think they start moving quickly on any other desired territories. Putin has been planning on this moment for a long time, and he knows how weak we are right now. If China takes Taiwan soon, my fear is that these escalate quickly from regional fights to something worldwide.

It will take them time to incorporate Ukraine.

I do think this is being driven for one of the main reasons that war became inevitable for Germany and Japan; both China and Russia are facing major economic and social problems and the only solution seems to be war. This is why wars start. Both Germany and Japan in 1939 would have faced bankruptcy and regime collapse if they hadn't gone to war.

 

[tvolsfan]

You are like discussing any topic with a half eaten sandwich. I will ask you again what NATO has done or is doing to prevent Russian aggression? Remind me again how Ukraine isn’t in NATO as if that is any kind of a defense, at no point have even remotely implied they were but Russia is threatening Eastern Europe. I look forward to Secretary General of NATO’s tough worded speech

You haven’t implied they are in NATO, but you seem confused about why NATO won’t protect them as if they were in NATO. That’s on you.

NATO members will likely hit Russia with sanctions, supply Ukraine (and it’s coming insurgency) with weapons, then fortify its own boarders.

 

[davethevol]

It will take them time to incorporate Ukraine.

I do think this is being driven for one of the main reasons that war became inevitable for Germany and Japan; both China and Russia are facing major economic and social problems and the only solution seems to be war. This is why wars start. Both Germany and Japan in 1939 would have faced bankruptcy and regime collapse if they hadn't gone to war.

We are facing major economic economic and social problems too. That’s what has me worried. If gas hits $7 a gallon here as a national average, only the elite will be able to sustain their way of living. It will be catastrophic for America. We will have no choice but to get involved at that point since our leaders refuse to make us energy independent.

 

[landscapingvol]

They were rearming, just not well. France bought tons of weapons from USA (our army was **** then as well and would have been pummeled by the Germans similar to France had we shared a border and been in the war).

France didn't have the military industry that Germany had built up in 1933. Similarly, UK took time to rearm as well. Most of their modern military that you referenced didn't come around until 1941-1942 so it took them 2 years of warfare and 4-5 years of build-up prior to get to that state.

They were ill prepared and caught flat footed just like they are today if war were to break out. They are useless as an ally. The Spitfire was introduced in 1938, impeccable timing wouldn’t you say? Along with radar, it won the war for the British.

 

[landscapingvol]

You haven’t implied they are in NATO, but you seem confused about why NATO won’t protect them as if they were in NATO. That’s on you.

NATO members will likely hit Russia with sanctions, supply Ukraine (and it’s coming insurgency) with weapons, then fortify its own boarders.

You are about as dense as they come lol. This very moment is NATO’s entire existence and they are feckless. The US will provide Ukraine with weapons as they already have; Germany has already declined to do so. I will ask you for the fourth time what has NATO done or is doing to stop further aggression besides rely on the US? An alliance implies a partnership, surely you can understand that basic premise

 

[tvolsfan]

You are about as dense as they come lol. This very moment is NATO’s entire existence and they are feckless. The US will provide Ukraine with weapons as they already have; Germany has already declined to do so. I will ask you for the fourth time what has NATO done or is doing to stop further aggression besides rely on the US? An alliance implies a partnership, surely you can understand that basic premise

Literally the only way to stop Russia from invading Ukraine is World War III. They are going to do it no matter what. I genuinely think you may be the only one who still doesn't get that.

If we were discussing Poland, you would have a point. But we aren't, and you don't.

 

[volbound1700]

We are facing major economic economic and social problems too. That’s what has me worried. If gas hits $7 a gallon here as a national average, only the elite will be able to sustain their way of living. It will be catastrophic for America. We will have no choice but to get involved at that point since our leaders refuse to make us energy independent.

We are still far more stable then China or Russia or even the USA in the 1930s.

 

[volbound1700]

They were ill prepared and caught flat footed just like they are today if war were to break out. They are useless as an ally. The Spitfire was introduced in 1938, impeccable timing wouldn’t you say? Along with radar, it won the war for the British.

Britain only survived because it was an island and it had the largest navy in the world at the start of the war (USA surpassed them by 1941).

Britain did not have a solid army to fight Germany nor great land technology (i.e. tank, mechanized vehicles, artillery, etc.) until the mid-1940s. They also received a lot of equipment from the United States.

In truth, no one globally but Germany and Japan were truly ready for war in 1939. USA and USSR just had the advantage of two more years and in the case of the USA, two oceans, to allow them to build up and prepare.

 

[Grand Vol]

Why couldn't that mother ****er wait until 2024 when my inactive reserve commitment was up?

 

[NorthDallas40]

Why couldn't that mother ****er wait until 2024 when my inactive reserve commitment was up?

Grab your bugout bag

 

[Burhead]

 

[Grand Vol]

Here's the thing... NATO nor us is going to do anything more than lodge formal complaints if the Russians really are occupying the "rebel" areas of Ukraine. Why?

A. Putin knows we have a full potato as President and won't do anything other than complain (he knew this from 2009-2017 as well)

B. Putin knows good and well West Europe depends on the gas flow to survive the winter and our chief full potato's environmental stance won't allow additional drilling or exploitation of the resources we could have to help with that.

C. NATO is in no position to actually project force in Ukraine since our full potato in chief has our military in a scramble over being diversified and is rooting out "possible domestic terrorists."

D. Putin knows sanctions won't do a damn bit of good against Russia since they've already been under sanctions before and many, if not most other nations could care less about the Donbass or any other area of Ukraine. (see Iran)

E. China is remaining neutral at best and, at worst, tacitly supporting it which gives the UN Security Council zero legs

F. Putin is probably one of the craftiest world politicians and master geopolitical chess player (whether you like him or not, one can admit that) and he will not do something without knowing what he's getting into. Hence, if he thinks he can invade Ukraine... or occupy certain areas and get away with it, he will. That die was cast a long time ago.

G. The majority of our own country could give a hootie damn about Ukraine (no offense to any Ukrainians reading this) because they have lost faith in our military and the political powers that be to actually fight and win in a conflict. (see Afghanistan)

H. Putin knows our own political landscape is so fractured we couldn't agree on a response to the threat, hence, he had free reign to do what he wants.

And there you have it.

 

[GroverCleveland]

I believe at the time Germany re-militarized the Rhineland, France had roughly 90 divisions, although most of those were made up of reservists. The German high command was terrified the French would respond, backed by Great Britain, and it's possible, if not likely, the Nazi government would have collapsed as the German population would still have the deprivations of WW1 fresh on their minds and want to avoid it if at all possible. But the Allies stood around with their thumbs stuck up their rear-ends and did nothing for three more years.

This is a European problem, not an American one. I believe Germany, as the leader, is asking for trouble by not leading the other countries to stand up. We will all rue these days and wring our hands with cries of "if only ..., if only ..." if Putin is allowed to get away with this. Remember, he has already taken Crimea at little to no cost.

 

[hog88]

Literally the only way to stop Russia from invading Ukraine is World War III. They are going to do it no matter what. I genuinely think you may be the only one who still doesn't get that.

If we were discussing Poland, you would have a point. But we aren't, and you don't.

Then we need to let them have Ukraine, it's not worth WWIII.

 

[volbound1700]

I believe at the time Germany re-militarized the Rhineland, France had roughly 90 divisions, although most of those were made up of reservists. The German high command was terrified the French would respond, backed by Great Britain, and it's possible, if not likely, the Nazi government would have collapsed as the German population would still have the deprivations of WW1 fresh on their minds and want to avoid it if at all possible. But the Allies stood around with their thumbs stuck up their rear-ends and did nothing for three more years.

This is a European problem, not an American one. I believe Germany, as the leader, is asking for trouble by not leading the other countries to stand up. We will all rue these days and wring our hands with cries of "if only ..., if only ..." if Putin is allowed to get away with this. Remember, he has already taken Crimea at little to no cost.

We are interconnected to Europe unfortunately and European problems tend to eventually become United States problems whether we try to stay out of them or not.

I have a friend with National Security Clearance that made a great point about NATO, most of those countries are obligated, by treaty, on what they can build military. He pointed out that Germany is not even allowed to have an air force and the USA stands as their air force.

We are the world power and defender of these nations (whether we like it or not) and we have to defend them for now. If we get out of those treaties and push them to build their own military (like TRUMP wanted), we would solve some of these issues. However, it takes years to build up a solid military.

We may sacrifice Ukraine to gain time to build up our own militaries (both Europe and USA).

 

[landscapingvol]

Here's the thing... NATO nor us is going to do anything more than lodge formal complaints if the Russians really are occupying the "rebel" areas of Ukraine. Why?

A. Putin knows we have a full potato as President and won't do anything other than complain (he knew this from 2009-2017 as well)

B. Putin knows good and well West Europe depends on the gas flow to survive the winter and our chief full potato's environmental stance won't allow additional drilling or exploitation of the resources we could have to help with that.

C. NATO is in no position to actually project force in Ukraine since our full potato in chief has our military in a scramble over being diversified and is rooting out "possible domestic terrorists."

D. Putin knows sanctions won't do a damn bit of good against Russia since they've already been under sanctions before and many, if not most other nations could care less about the Donbass or any other area of Ukraine. (see Iran)

E. China is remaining neutral at best and, at worst, tacitly supporting it which gives the UN Security Council zero legs

F. Putin is probably one of the craftiest world politicians and master geopolitical chess player (whether you like him or not, one can admit that) and he will not do something without knowing what he's getting into. Hence, if he thinks he can invade Ukraine... or occupy certain areas and get away with it, he will. That die was cast a long time ago.

G. The majority of our own country could give a hootie damn about Ukraine (no offense to any Ukrainians reading this) because they have lost faith in our military and the political powers that be to actually fight and win in a conflict. (see Afghanistan)

H. Putin knows our own political landscape is so fractured we couldn't agree on a response to the threat, hence, he had free reign to do what he wants.

And there you have it.

Correct, we aren’t going to do anything and shouldn’t therefore NATO isn’t going to do anything because it is nothing more than the US and Great Britain.