Does NIL Effectively Eliminate the 85 Scholarship Cap Rule

[LSU-SIU]

I realize the conglomerate called the NCAA is going to become smaller and conferences or divisions will be setup to determine their own policies, rules and regulations. The change will be smaller memberships. They will still have a constitution to follow.

As far as your last sentence, I believe that is because the NCAA is the schools themselves. The NCAA is not an independent entity that acts without guidance from the schools.

It maybe possible for conferences to just break off which is probably were its going and put in rules, but the problem with that is there be X number conferences... the best players will go to the conferences with less interference and more money. Under the old system there was no competition.

Also, they will have to conform to existing State Laws that are now popping up. So, even though the Supreme Court said that rules could be implement by smaller conferences, in reality... its not possible.

I warned the schools at least 7 years ago that they needed to get ahead of the game, the went full greed.

The NCAA is not an independent entity that acts without guidance from the schools.

True, the schools have been engaging in major criminal activity thru the entity NCAA. They are not innocent, they are scum.... they should have started criminal indictments 5-10 years ago.

 

[LWSVOL]

I'm pretty certain that Brice Young became a millionaire before starting a game for Bama.

Why? Because some guys with money ARE just that crazy... or they have enough that they spend a million like you and I spend $100.

More than likely wouldn't have to be a million btw. A kid making $100K per year could go to college pretty comfortably. Start with that and promise more if they perform. They could even put performance clauses in like coaches have. Lots of people thought NIL was a great idea... it is going to get really, really messy. It could easily ruin the game from a competitive stand point.

GENERAL RULE
Student-athletes may earn compensation for the use of their NIL. Such compensation must be commensurate with the fair market value of the authorized NIL use and may be provided in any form (i.e., cash, check, mobile payment app, product, good, service, etc.). Examples of permissible NIL activities include, but are not limited to student-athlete appearances, autograph signings, camps, clinics, and the promotion/endorsement of products and services. The following is prohibited under the NCAA’s interim policy and may negatively impact a student-athlete’s intercollegiate athletics eligibility: (1) NIL agreement without quid pro quo (e.g., compensation for work not performed); (2) NIL compensation contingent upon enrollment at a particular school; and (3) Compensation for athletic participation or achievement (this may enhance a student-athlete’s NIL value, but may not be the “consideration” for NIL compensation). NIL activities should not conflict with a student-athlete’s academic or team-related obligations.

Check out number 3. no performance clauses allowed in agreements.

 

[LWSVOL]

It maybe possible for conferences to just break off which is probably were its going and put in rules, but the problem with that is there be X number conferences... the best players will go to the conferences with less interference and more money. Under the old system there was no competition.

Also, they will have to conform to existing State Laws that are now popping up. So, even though the Supreme Court said that rules could be implement by smaller conferences, in reality... its not possible.

I warned the schools at least 7 years ago that they needed to get ahead of the game, the went full greed.



True, the schools have been engaging in major criminal activity thru the entity NCAA. They are not innocent, they are scum.... they should have started criminal indictments 5-10 years ago.

I doubt the NCAA, conferences or schools are any more corrupt than the state and federal governments trying to change the way they do business.

You have some great points which I have surmised are more opinions or hypotheticals than practical actions. Maybe I'm wrong on that view but that is what it appears.

The SEC (member schools) are stronger than ever, richer than ever and will continue to grow bigger than ever.

 

[sjt18]

GENERAL RULE
Student-athletes may earn compensation for the use of their NIL. Such compensation must be commensurate with the fair market value of the authorized NIL use and may be provided in any form (i.e., cash, check, mobile payment app, product, good, service, etc.). Examples of permissible NIL activities include, but are not limited to student-athlete appearances, autograph signings, camps, clinics, and the promotion/endorsement of products and services. The following is prohibited under the NCAA’s interim policy and may negatively impact a student-athlete’s intercollegiate athletics eligibility: (1) NIL agreement without quid pro quo (e.g., compensation for work not performed); (2) NIL compensation contingent upon enrollment at a particular school; and (3) Compensation for athletic participation or achievement (this may enhance a student-athlete’s NIL value, but may not be the “consideration” for NIL compensation). NIL activities should not conflict with a student-athlete’s academic or team-related obligations.

Check out number 3. no performance clauses allowed in agreements.

Might have to go year to year then much like scholarship offers.

I want to see them enforce #2 or prove in court what "fair market value" is for NIL. The simple defense to that whether it materializes or not is that "I thought our fans would support our business more if I signed these players".

 

[LSU-SIU]

I doubt the NCAA, conferences or schools are any more corrupt than the state and federal governments trying to change the way they do business.

You are a confused individual. The way this is setup was criminal in nature, see the Sherman Act, and probably anti-trust laws in the 50 States. They are lucky the crime gig went on this long, and no indictments yet.

You have some great points which I have surmised are more opinions or hypotheticals than practical actions. Maybe I'm wrong on that view but that is what it appears.

The SEC (member schools) are stronger than ever, richer than ever and will continue to grow bigger than ever.

No, your assumptions are that... assumptions i.e. players can't receive compensation without getting in trouble with the NCAA. If a player is penalized for receiving compensation, they should first contact an attorney as they have civil remedies under the Sherman Act, let alone State law. Furthermore, they should probably consider filing criminal complaints with their State AG and the FBI.

The SEC (member schools) are stronger than ever, richer than ever and will continue to grow bigger than ever.

I have no idea how all this plays out, logic would be they don't think its all that great... or they wouldn't have been fighting it for decades. But either way, its not the players problem what the conference make or don't make.

 

[sjt18]

Why would they agree to that? They will still get scholarship money as well as million dollar NIL deals.

For the same reason Jordan was willing to take less money than he could have negotiated so that the Bulls could afford the players around him that won championships. It wasn't any kind of noble gesture. He knew the commercial value of winning and being called the GOAT. Having great players around him increased his odds of making MORE money outside of his salary.

The smart, or well advised, player will recognize that giving that scholarship back to the program when he doesn't need it ultimately gives him a better supporting cast. That means his draft status goes up AND he has a greater NIL opportunity.

You could say that the scholarship is an insurance policy in case they don't play well and lose their NIL... but the portal turns that upside down. Teams are going to start turning out scholarship players who don't perform. They're not going to have a choice in that if they want to compete.

 

[sjt18]

I doubt the NCAA, conferences or schools are any more corrupt than the state and federal governments trying to change the way they do business.

.

Not even ball park close.

 

[sjt18]

You are a confused individual. The way this is setup was criminal in nature, see the Sherman Act, and probably anti-trust laws in the 50 States. They are lucky the crime gig went on this long, and no indictments yet.

BS. Pure unadulterated.

No, your assumptions are that... assumptions i.e. players can't receive compensation without getting in trouble with the NCAA. If a player is penalized for receiving compensation, they should first contact an attorney as they have civil remedies under the Sherman Act, let alone State law. Furthermore, they should probably consider filing criminal complaints with their State AG and the FBI.

So if someone is caught embezzling because they "feel" they are undercompensated... they're protected by the Sherman Act?

I have no idea how all this plays out, logic would be they don't think its all that great... or they wouldn't have been fighting it for decades. But either way, its not the players problem what the conference make or don't make.

You assign malicious intent to people over decades that you do not know... and then convict them of a crime. The intent was for college athletics to be AMATEUR and specifically NOT professional.

 

[LSU-SIU]

BS. Pure unadulterated.

So if someone is caught embezzling because they "feel" they are undercompensated... they're protected by the Sherman Act?

WTF is that even mean? LOL How did we get into embezzling?

You assign malicious intent to people over decades that you do not know... and then convict them of a crime. The intent was for college athletics to be AMATEUR and specifically NOT professional.

There is no such thing as "amateur", see the Supreme Court decision. They lay it out to even a layman can understand it. They're not innocent, they are fully aware of what they have been doing.... they just don't think anyone will prosecute.

The gig is up, its actually been up for years.... its full on desperation now. Which is why they keep crying to Congress.

 

[LWSVOL]

Might have to go year to year then much like scholarship offers.

I want to see them enforce #2 or prove in court what "fair market value" is for NIL. The simple defense to that whether it materializes or not is that "I thought our fans would support our business more if I signed these players".

Will a kid potentially give up his college eligibilty to fight it in court?

 

[LWSVOL]

You are a confused individual. The way this is setup was criminal in nature, see the Sherman Act, and probably anti-trust laws in the 50 States. They are lucky the crime gig went on this long, and no indictments yet.



No, your assumptions are that... assumptions i.e. players can't receive compensation without getting in trouble with the NCAA. If a player is penalized for receiving compensation, they should first contact an attorney as they have civil remedies under the Sherman Act, let alone State law. Furthermore, they should probably consider filing criminal complaints with their State AG and the FBI.



I have no idea how all this plays out, logic would be they don't think its all that great... or they wouldn't have been fighting it for decades. But either way, its not the players problem what the conference make or don't make.

I will take your statements at face value.

What is your take on why none of this has been challenged in court in the past hundred years. Or ever how long.

And why will someone challenge in the future?

 

[BenGrimm]

Not to be argumentative, but I believe that the NIL(salary) will be determined by the number of stars behind the name.

Maybe for the occasional 5* QB but I also think it would kinda depend on the school they sign with too. A combined high profile of a kid and school/program would be more valuable to a company’s marketing goals. This is as much a business decisions as it is just rich boosters wanting their favorite team to win.

The average joe does not follow recruiting. Outside of some legacy kid like Arch Manning who gets talked about during broadcasts, they probably couldn’t name one high rated recruit any given year. But they do know Alabama/Clemson/UGA/tOSU and a few others are perennial playoff contenders. Those teams will be on during prime time and be talked about constantly throughout the season. So a kid’s potential for exposure, and thus the NIL Sponsor, are much higher.

There will be exceptions where some high school kid gets a ridiculous NIL regardless of what school they sign with. I just don’t see it becoming a thing where teams are loading rosters with walk-ons paying their own way with NIL deals.

That’s not even getting into the recruiting restrictions regarding walk-ons.

 

[sjt18]

Will a kid potentially give up his college eligibilty to fight it in court?

It would have to be established illegal. If the NCAA cannot deny someone who signed a legal document saying they would play in exchange for educational benefits from NIL... what leverage would they have over someone who did NOT sign such a document?

 

[LWSVOL]

It would have to be established illegal. If the NCAA cannot deny someone who signed a legal document saying they would play in exchange for educational benefits from NIL... what leverage would they have over someone who did NOT sign such a document?

are you familiar with the state law that Lee signed? The NCAA defers to the laws of each state regarding NIL.

this link has a nice overview of the law signed by Lee.

Payment for Student-Athletes’ NIL Rights Comes to Tennessee | JD Supra

Laws can be challenged in court and I realize that. How many years do you think it takes for someone to challenge these new laws?

 

[sjt18]

WTF is that even mean? LOL How did we get into embezzling?

Kids signed an agreement stating that they would participate in AMATEUR athletics in exchange for educational benefits. They freely entered into a contract with binding terms... then have now overturned those terms with NIL which makes them professionals.

There is no such thing as "amateur", see the Supreme Court decision. They lay it out to even a layman can understand it. They're not innocent, they are fully aware of what they have been doing.... they just don't think anyone will prosecute.

So the Supreme Court deleted a term and definition from the dictionary... or even Black's Law Dictionary? Since I have long seen your extreme bias on this issue... I'd like to see actual proof.

The gig is up, its actually been up for years.... its full on desperation now. Which is why they keep crying to Congress.

There's no "gig". You again assign malicious intent to people you don't know and never knew. You are following the ridiculous woke narrative that these kids are somehow being cheated or tricked into some form of "slavery". Not a SINGLE ONE had to sign an letter of intent. Not one. They didn't have to accept the terms. They could have found their path in life outside of this GAME like everyone else does.

 

[Ratvol]

in the pre-Madonna days, all pocket presents were considered french benefits. If you had a posable thumb, you could cut off your nose despite your face. In lame man's terms, it's a doggy-dog world.

For all intensive purposes, anyway.

So did Madonna suck and swallow? Asking for a friend.

Go VOLS

 

[sjt18]

are you familiar with the state law that Lee signed? The NCAA defers to the laws of each state regarding NIL.

this link has a nice overview of the law signed by Lee.

Payment for Student-Athletes’ NIL Rights Comes to Tennessee | JD Supra

Laws can be challenged in court and I realize that. How many years do you think it takes for someone to challenge these new laws?

Depends on whether the party that expects to lose has a lot of money or not.

I don't say anything there that says a 5* QB cannot commit to a school as a PWO then "wait to see" who offers him NIL money. If the money doesn't come then the kid withdraws his commitment. That may "appear" shady... but would be near impossible to prove illegal even under the text of that law.

 

[LSU-SIU]

I will take your statements at face value.

What is your take on why none of this has been challenged in court in the past hundred years. Or ever how long.

And why will someone challenge in the future?

I'm not sure what you mean by this, there all kinds of lawsuits in the pipeline. The Supreme Courts decided against the NCAA is just one. Although the question wasn't on compensation per se, it was on the schools giving players enhanced educational benefits. The attorney in that case, said he was going to amend (or file new suit to add the who enchilada).

https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/20pdf/20-512_gfbh.pdf

This is why the NCAA folded like a $2 crack whore during the summer, its over.

 

[LSU-SIU]

Depends on whether the party that expects to lose has a lot of money or not.

I don't say anything there that says a 5* QB cannot commit to a school as a PWO then "wait to see" who offers him NIL money. If the money doesn't come then the kid withdraws his commitment. That may "appear" shady... but would be near impossible to prove illegal even under the text of that law.

Most likely unconstitutional, but moot. If one wants a 5* to come you just setup a contract to sign, why would you want to pay for NIL. LOL

What's to stop a school from just paying them as employees?

Once the Supreme Court ruling came down in June, it made all of this very trivial... the ability of the NCAA to regulate or restrict compensation/trade is basically over.

People are putting to much into the stupid NIL, its the ability of the player to receive compensation from any source now.

 

[sjt18]

Most likely unconstitutional, but moot. If one wants a 5* to come you just setup a contract to sign, why would you want to pay for NIL. LOL

Because the court has not ruled that schools may make direct payments outside of NCAA guidelines.

What's to stop a school from just paying them as employees?

See above.

Once the Supreme Court ruling came down in June, it made all of this very trivial... the ability of the NCAA to regulate or restrict compensation/trade is basically over.

No. It isn't. The ruling says that schools cannot prevent athletes from selling their name, image, or likeness. It did NOT say the NCAA does not have the power to regulate what member institutions do... including direct payment of players.

You are just determined to turn college football into a professional league... aren't you?

 

[LWSVOL]

Most likely unconstitutional, but moot. If one wants a 5* to come you just setup a contract to sign, why would you want to pay for NIL. LOL

What's to stop a school from just paying them as employees?

Once the Supreme Court ruling came down in June, it made all of this very trivial... the ability of the NCAA to regulate or restrict compensation/trade is basically over.

People are putting to much into the stupid NIL, its the ability of the player to receive compensation from any source now.

I agree with this statement. I linked the overview by a law firm of the Tennessee law signed by the governor. They also covered the NCAA's position on NIL and deferred to the laws implemented by each state regarding oversite. So whatever approach a person or entity takes on NIL is either in accordance with state law or is trying to circumvent it.

With that, I'm in Siesta Key and time to enjoy.

 

[LSU-SIU]

Because the court has not ruled that schools may make direct payments outside of NCAA guidelines.

See above.

That's immaterial. The court hasn't ruled that my significant other can vote as a woman, but she can vote. You're rights are not limited to waiting for a court to a make a pre-determination. LOL Where do you guys come from?

No. It isn't. The ruling says that schools cannot prevent athletes from selling their name, image, or likeness. It did NOT say the NCAA does not have the power to regulate what member institutions do... including direct payment of players.

The ruling has to do with enhanced educational benefits that the NCAA was stopping, the court on its own... they went much further and said what the NCAA has setup runs contrary to law.

You are just determined to turn college football into a professional league... aren't you?

There is no such thing as "amateur", that is the made up term the Supreme Court was even talking about. There is nothing in the Sherman Act as to an "amateur" exception. LOL

Turning to that task, the court observed that the NCAA’s conception of amateurism has changed steadily over the years. See id., at 1063–1064, 1072–1073; see also supra, at 3–7. The court noted that the NCAA “nowhere define the nature of the amateurism they claim consumers insist upon.” D. Ct. Op., at 1070. And, given all this, the court struggled to ascertain for itself “any coherent definition” of the term, id., at 1074, noting the testimony of a former SEC commissioner that he’s “ ‘never been clear on . . . what is really meant by amateurism.’ ” Id., at 1070–1071.

Amateur is just a made up term they came up with to keep the gig going.

The gig is up, you can get mad, you can get upset... you can point fingers but its over.

 

[LSU-SIU]

So whatever approach a person or entity takes on NIL is either in accordance with state law or is trying to circumvent it.

With that, I'm in Siesta Key and time to enjoy.

Or you just sign normal contracts for service and than there is no restriction to the school or players. The players have no real worth as NIL anyway, not most of them.

Or just stick a check or cash in a McDonald's bag. <----- That's fine too.

 

[LWSVOL]

Or you just sign normal contracts for service and than there is no restriction to the school or players. The players have no real worth as NIL anyway, not most of them.

Or just stick a check or cash in a McDonald's bag. <----- That's fine too.

So circumvent the law
Ok

 

[Voltopia]

Not a SINGLE ONE had to sign an letter of intent. Not one. They didn't have to accept the terms. They could have found their path in life outside of this GAME like everyone else does.

This gets conveniently ignored every time the talking heads in the media or elsewhere attack the sport or the schools. Nothing is compelled, no one has to agree to anything. The colleges say "here's how we engage in athletic competition, and within that framework, here's what we offer" and anyone is free to say yes or no, and that is the truth. But the reality is that the argument against college athletics is as much an emotional and moral appeal as it is anything else.