Recruiting Forum Football Talk III

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#3,055
#3,055
SpringBokVol said:
Let me clarify, Phil will publicly back and commit to Pruitt after the UF game.
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Nah, if there's any kind of vote of confidence, it would come at the end of the year.

He ain't gonna do anything like that while a possible loss to Vandy still lingers in the air.
 
#3,056
#3,056
05_never_again said:
Kind of related to the direction we're going...curious to get other's thoughts on this.

IMO, there are 4 pre-eminent programs in the country right now. I think they are Alabama, Clemson, Ohio St, and Oklahoma. They have been the most consistent programs for the longest period of time in the recent past.

There are different approaches that you can take to running a program. You can be corporate, buttoned-up, and formal, like Alabama/Saban. You can be a more informal "family environment" like Clemson/Dabo. I don't know enough about Ohio St/Day and Oklahoma/Riley to describe their programs, although the impression that I get is that they are probably closer to Clemson/Dabo than Alabama/Saban.

The question is...what is Tennessee trying to be? Like Alabama/Saban? If so, that environment seems very difficult to replicate if you don't have some previous success to point to. Are 17-18 year old kids naturally drawn to a corporate, formal environment? Well, I suppose so if that program has won 5 national titles since 2009. But what if you haven't? What if you're trying to build a reputation/culture from scratch? Isn't a different approach needed?
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To answer this question, I think we have to decide in what mold were we under Fulmer. Because that's what he's trying to replicate again.

Fulmer was a great recruiter at the head coaching position - one of the best this conference has ever seen. Because of that, it allowed Cutcliffe and Chavis to focus on the X's and O's, and the combination was outstanding for us.

I'm not sure this model works so much anymore. Everyone has to recruit and everyone has to be able to coach.

No one can run their program like Saban but Saban. It's because he's a great football coach and has some sort of an ability to get the best out of everyone who works or plays for him. They changed like 8 assistant coaches this offseason and are still the best team in the country. That's incredible.

I think you have to build like Dabo has built - get total buy-in from your community, stock your staff with good football coaches who desperately want the program to succeed, and get a pipeline of high quality high school quarterbacks coming through each year. You cannot have variance at that position. All of the programs you mentioned have figured that out.
 
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#3,059
#3,059
Kingston Vol said:
No doubt it hurt badly, but I just can't get behind COVID as an excuse because every team had to face it.

Good coaches and well-run programs find a way to compete. We haven't done that.
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no disagreement. i'm not putting it all there either.

but you can't discount the affect...and i've said it several times already, i think it mattered a lot to this particular team simply because of where the core talent is on this team presently....that being the fr/so class. the so class missed what most will consider the most importan year of development..year 1 to year 2...and the freshment got nothing....even the EE's...zilch.

that's a big deal.

does it excuse everything away? no. there have been decisions made during the season that can be looked at critically.

but i'm not gonna lie, had we had a normal off season and been able to play our original 2020 schedule, i think this year would have been totally different.....

this was a tough thing to deal with for a first time HC and AD, and it's fairly clear they haven't navigated these waters as well as some other staffs did....

that's a big deal too.

put those two things together, and i give you 2020 TN football.
 
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#3,060
#3,060
Kingston Vol said:
Nah, if there's any kind of vote of confidence, it would come at the end of the year.

He ain't gonna do anything like that while a possible loss to Vandy still lingers in the air.
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I didn't specify how long after the UF game - it just won't be before it.
 
#3,064
#3,064
Kingston Vol said:
To answer this question, I think we have to decide in what mold were we under Fulmer. Because that's what he's trying to replicate again.

Fulmer was a great recruiter at the head coaching position - one of the best this conference has ever seen. Because of that, it allowed Cutcliffe and Chavis to focus on the X's and O's, and the combination was outstanding for us.

I'm not sure this model works so much anymore. Everyone has to recruit and everyone has to be able to coach.

No one can run their program like Saban but Saban. It's because he's a great football coach and has some sort of an ability to get the best out of everyone who works or plays for him. They changed like 8 assistant coaches this offseason and are still the best team in the country. That's incredible.

I think you have to build like Dabo has built - get total buy-in from your community, stock your staff with good football coaches who desperately want the program to succeed, and get a pipeline of high quality high school quarterbacks coming through each year. You cannot have variance at that position. All of the programs you mentioned have figured that out.
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the Dabo model is just a bit tougher sell here becuase of the path to "elite" in each conference. and that means it may take longer...actually, it will take longer. Dabo had FSU to deal with basically. that's it. and over the last 6 years or so, they've not even been a shell of their former selves.

VT, Miami, Pitt, Syracuse....UNC, NCSU...all average at best.

they had no bama, uga, fl, lsu, aub to deal with.....

so while i agree with you, i won't go so far as to say it's a 1 for 1 equation. we're not passing up UGA, Bama, UF....we're just trying to get EVEN with them. so we can just compete at that level. and getting to that level doesn't mean you actually win at that level, ask UGA. or even ask LSU. they're coming off a historic season and should be loaded up on JUICE...but they suuck right now lol. we'll see how FL does when they get their shot in a couple weeks.

anyway. that seemss light years away. i just want to get back to not sucking out loud.
 
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#3,065
#3,065
VolGee4 said:
I think your second paragraph about talent evaluation is most likely the problem. Gilbert was recruited and then transferred under Mack Brown, whose staffs had developed Applewhite, Sims, McCoy, and Vince Young before him. They had a track record. The takes after Gilbert though were mediocre except maybe Connor Wood. Case McCoy and David Ash were not high level. Then, I would agree that Charlie Strong's staff probably didn't develop them. They took Swoopes and Heard as dual threat QB's, and it didn't work.
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Texas should just have a pipeline built to Southlake Carroll and they would be perennial top ten.
 
#3,068
#3,068
jakez4ut said:
the Dabo model is just a bit tougher sell here becuase of the path to "elite" in each conference. and that means it may take longer...actually, it will take longer. Dabo had FSU to deal with basically. that's it. and over the last 6 years or so, they've not even been a shell of their former selves.

VT, Miami, Pitt, Syracuse....UNC, NCSU...all average at best.

they had no bama, uga, fl, lsu, aub to deal with.....

so while i agree with you, i won't go so far as to say it's a 1 for 1 equation. we're not passing up UGA, Bama, UF....we're just trying to get EVEN with them. so we can just compete at that level. and getting to that level doesn't mean you actually win at that level, ask UGA. or even ask LSU. they're coming off a historic season and should be loaded up on JUICE...but they suuck right now lol. we'll see how FL does when they get their shot in a couple weeks.

anyway. that seemss light years away. i just want to get back to not sucking out loud.
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I agree with you, I just wonder if Fulmer would ever admit it.

Maybe he has and we're the ones who are ignorant and have our heads in the clouds.
 
#3,069
#3,069
Kingston Vol said:
I agree with you, I just wonder if Fulmer would ever admit it.

Maybe he has and we're the ones who are ignorant and have our heads in the clouds.
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well, when pruitt is still our coach in 3 years...we'll have our answer................................... :)
 
#3,073
#3,073
I think what makes Saban, Saban is what we see in the media interviews.

Effective leaders are concise and to the point. If you know what you want that's one thing, but if you know what you want and can articulate it simply and clearly to others then everyone knows what you want. With Saban I think he's a master at this, I think Dabo is likely very good at it too.

So regardless of one is on their staff they are very clear with what they expect from them in whatever job they have. It's not micro-managing because you know from day 1 what your job is supposed to be. Ineffective leaders simply don't do this and often find themselves feeling frustrated and overworked from basically micro-managing because they aren't efficient at communicating.
 
#3,074
#3,074
Smyrna ATL Vol said:
I would be shocked if he did this.
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why? if he's already determined pruitt is not going anywhere, no matter what, why not?

fear of alienating the fan base? well, i think we've got that covered already.
fear of recruiting tanking? moving in that directon already, check.
fear of transfers? TBD
fear of staff turmoil? say, any coach not named tee or jay, let me hold a dollar? lol.

there's little to lose if your fulmer, if you truly are keeping him around. if you're in TBD status, you say nothing.
 
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