2020 Presidential Race

#28,228
#28,228
Biden and Sanders have nearly 75 years of federal government experience between them. In that time Sanders passed 7 bills, two of them to rename post offices. Biden passed 42, many of them to declare a “day” or “week” of awareness for various causes. But both of them now have a plan to fix our country. Derp.
 
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#28,231
#28,231
MontyPython said:
Be more specific. What's running well OTHER than the economy (ignoring our ballooning budget deficit, of course)?
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More cash in pockets , more jobs to be had , less people depending on the government , less people dying in a war , safer national security , illegal boarder crossings are down . Riots are almost nonexistent, people across the country have a higher standard of living than ever before in our history . Where exactly is this threat to our system ? If this is what happens when Putin installs a puppet , I hope he doesn’t stop installing them .
 
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#28,232
#28,232
0nelilreb said:
Only to those that put him on top of that list . You create your own problems when you do that . You also lower your standards by accepting anyone below him on your list . Once you say he’s the worst , you can be talked into accepting anything . That’s not a logical thought process .
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You create a bigger set of your own problems when you do not acknowledge that he belongs on the top of that list.
Talk about lowering your standards, that's the very definition.
We will just obviously continue to disagree. It will come as no great shock, but I'm not about to change my mind.
 
#28,234
#28,234
luthervol said:
You create a bigger set of your own problems when you do not acknowledge that he belongs on the top of that list.
Talk about lowering your standards, that's the very definition.
We will just obviously continue to disagree. It will come as no great shock, but I'm not about to change my mind.
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Nobody thinks you’ll change your mind , just pointing out how illogical it is to think someone is the most anything .
 
#28,235
#28,235
Sea Ray said:
Fine. What kind of experience would you like to see in a President?

I want to see executive experience. Ideally being a Governor but running businesses are good too. I want to see someone leading people, solving problems and balancing books.
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It's less about experience and more about philosophy and priorities as far as I am concerned.
 
#28,238
#28,238
0nelilreb said:
That’s the main problem with allowing yourself to think someone is the most of anything ... it’s never true . There’s always someone that comes along to prove that wrong .
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Your very statement is proof that you put people on a continuum. I never claimed it is impossible for someone to be worse than Trump; I would guess that around 0.02% of humans are worse.
 
#28,239
#28,239
luthervol said:
It's the very problem of electing someone who is a horrendously despicable human.
It's also why I have repeatedly and consistently said Trump should never be normalized.
Normalizing and accepting the horrendous is actually how we ended up with truly horrible people in positions of power.
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You are normalizing him by making him the standard of what you wont vote for.

Stop reaching for the bottom and instead go for the top. You are digging for the next Trump. You have admitted to just wanting a D next to their name vs any real changes.

Raise your standards.
 
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#28,240
#28,240
luthervol said:
Your very statement is proof that you put people on a continuum. I never claimed it is impossible for someone to be worse than Trump; I would guess that around 0.02% of humans are worse.
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“Most “ despicable and horrendous , the first word you use all the time to describe him defeats your own argument. I don’t use a continuum. If you lie , you are a liar . If you’ve killed , you are a killer , if you are in office , you are a politician .
 
#28,241
#28,241
luthervol said:
No 35-45 year old candidate would ever have more than 20 years work experience. Hell, Jesus and MLK had less than 20 years of actual work experience. James Madison and Alexander Hamilton were both in their 20's when the constitution was written.
I bet more than half the founding fathers had less than 20 years of work experience.
I think you are grossly overvaluing "work" experience.
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Every one of our FFs possessed more raw intelligence, common sense and aptitude than anyone running today or even being considered for a slot on a ticket. So bad comparison on your part.

I wouldn't hire Jesus or MLK to run an organization larger than 20-30 people. And even then it would be doubtful.

I wouldn't vote for a 35-45 year old candidate unless they have held and had proven success in a chief executive position. As I've stated here multiple times, I can't see myself voting for any candidate that doesn't have a successful track record as a chief executive.
 
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#28,242
#28,242
LouderVol said:
You are normalizing him by making him the standard of what you wont vote for.

Stop reaching for the bottom and instead go for the top. You are digging for the next Trump. You have admitted to just wanting a D next to their name vs any real changes.

Raise your standards.
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Raise my standards?
He has always been well below the standard of what I would vote for.
He has lowered the bar of acceptability for many.
Reaching for the bottom? I'm trying to get us off of the bottom.
Getting Trump out of office is the essential key first step to any appropriate change
 
#28,243
#28,243
0nelilreb said:
“Most “ despicable and horrendous , the first word you use all the time to describe him defeats your own argument. I don’t use a continuum. If you lie , you are a liar . If you’ve killed , you are a killer , if you are in office , you are a politician .
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He is the most despicable and horrendous human to ever be elected president.
That in no way says that there are not more horrendously despicable humans.
 
#28,244
#28,244
MontyPython said:
Be more specific. What's running well OTHER than the economy (ignoring our ballooning budget deficit, of course)?
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Carbon emissions are down, despite assurances Trump would have us back at 1950s levels.

No new wars, trump was going to nuke and declare war on anyone who he didnt like. Hasnt happened. Doesnt look hopeful but peace talks in Syria and Afghanistan have happened which are steps in the right direction.

Rape stastics are weird but Trump is no worse than the past. Over the past 20 years there have been 500% spikes and similar drops. Trump's spikes are "just" 100%, but we proceeded by a big drop. 2019 stats arent final but also seem to be down. This was another big fear from the Dems.

Trade deals are happening. They arent the best or the worst that either side promised.

Russia hasnt "annexed" any new territories under Trumps watch.

North Korea was Trumps Cuba. Even if nothing comes from the talks it's a step forward.

I dont like him as a person or a president. But to assume he is any different than a predecessor seems short sighted. Most problems are superficial AF. He tweets too much and runs his mouth. Bad, but if that's as bad as Trumo gets I will dance.
 
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#28,245
#28,245
I'm reading these posts. I can't wrap my head around the idea that surrounding yourself with good intelligent advisers who know the job is now a bad thing.
 
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#28,246
#28,246
JCP201 said:
I'm reading these posts. I can't wrap my head around the idea that surrounding yourself with good intelligent advisers who know the job is now a bad thing.
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Her husband didn't so what makes you sure Michele will?
 
#28,247
#28,247
hog88 said:
Every one of our FFs possessed more raw intelligence, common sense and aptitude than anyone running today or even being considered for a slot on a ticket. So bad comparison on your part.

I wouldn't hire Jesus or MLK to run an organization larger than 20-30 people. And even then it would be doubtful.

I wouldn't vote for a 35-45 year old candidate unless they have held and had proven success in a chief executive position. As I've stated here multiple times, I can't see myself voting for any candidate that doesn't have a successful track record as a chief executive.
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Raw intelligence, common sense, and aptitude are 3 qualities pretty important for a president. Qualities that far surpass experience. Throw in appropriate philosophies and priorities (which are intertwined with the other 3), and you have the qualities needed in a president.
 
#28,248
#28,248
luthervol said:
Raw intelligence, common sense, and aptitude are 3 qualities pretty important for a president. Qualities that far surpass experience. Throw in appropriate philosophies and priorities (which are intertwined with the other 3), and you have the qualities needed in a president.
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Even by your standards none running today or being considered for a spot on a ticket is the ideal for person for President. Not even close.
 
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#28,250
#28,250
luthervol said:
Raise my standards?
He has always been well below the standard of what I would vote for.
He has lowered the bar of acceptability for many.
Reaching for the bottom? I'm trying to get us off of the bottom.
Getting Trump out of office is the essential key first step to any appropriate change
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Trump is your standard. You want "not Trump". Your entire admited political existence right now circles around "not Trump" to the point that getting you not to talk about Trump is a near impossibility.

Instead you could be aiming for the next Carter, Obama, Clinton, or whoever. But you arent. You have repeated ad nauseam you will be voting for whoever is not Trump, not who is the most closely aligned with your stances. By stepping away from any stance you might hold into "not Trump" territory you have abandoned your previously held standards, again lowering to them to Trump.

You need to consider it one big primary, which candidate do you actually want.
 
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