Gun control debate (merged)

#12,551
#12,551
hog88 said:
My guess is that just one of those widgets you make cost more than his or most everybody on this board yearly income.
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I always get a chuckle at people defaulting to the “I’m worth more or have than you “ d!ck measuring contest on an anonymous forum . People never stop to think past the post or profile pic. I’ve seen many people over the years , get there mouths closed ( or there jaws fall open ) playing that game . Lol
 
#12,552
#12,552
hndog609 said:
This is the kind of observation that is most bewildering to anyone with an actual (not faux/feelz driven) sense of rationality. Rifles in general, including any variations of the so called "assault" variety, account for a very small percentage of homicides. So small in fact that more people are killed with no weapon of any kind than by all rifle types combined. Add to this that the AR platform in particular has become the later 20th/current 21st century equivalent of the lever rifle in the 19th. Literally becoming the most popular rifle platform in the country and suited for everything from .22RF to dangerous game hunting calibers. It is unambiguously nothing more than a "modern" rifle design. (and by saying even that I'm talking over well over 50 years old)

There is literally no "rational or reasonable" argument for outlawing an entire class of firearms based on the above. (And in fact the SCOTUS Heller decision uses exactly such terms as "class of weapons" and "common use for lawful purpose". We would seem to be pre-Heller in another SCOTUS 2A showdown involving such firearms)
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It goes back to my stance that luther is not the least bit consistent in his arguments, which circles back to him not being rational or reasonable.

That he targets something so far down the list means he is reaching just to make a point with no rationale behind it.

It's too much to expect him to under stand how pretty much any modern gun works and how they are vastly similar in function to again make his stance unreasonable and irrational.

His arguments boil down to nothing more than fear. Of an inanimate object. Which is not reasonable or rational.
 
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#12,553
#12,553
luthervol said:
Well it sounds like you only need one kind. Why would you care if they are all the same?
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They are all one kind. You just lack sosphicated knowledge of the subject matter to understand the distinctions we make.

And need has nothing to do with it, or any of our rights. None of our rights are based in needs, that kinda flies counter to the very idea of a right.
 
#12,554
#12,554
bnhunt said:
I care about ALL constitutional rights including the right to free assembly, freedom of worship, and freedom of speech among others. It seems to me that most of you only care about your "right" to unfettered firearms.
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SIAp. But as others have posted this is the 2a thread, so its bound to be the center of attention here. If you cant understand why, that's on you.

We have also used the 4th and the 9th to support our 2nd. But you probably ignore that because it makes you uncomfortable.

And if you cant see how all the rights are tied together that's an issue.

And it's even more of an issue that you dont care about your rights and will freely give them up. Makes it hard to have a real conversation if one side doesnt fully understand the value of what they have.
 
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#12,555
#12,555
OrangeBlood4life said:
Argument on on 2nd amendment meaning muskets:
All armys only had muskets, and if you think FF didt think there would be advancements you are delusional. Shall not be infringed

Argument that u cant fight govt with AR's amyway.

We have been fighting terrorist since 2002 in flip flops and ak47s. You cant just bomb a city, so armed citizens can stand up to a gov't.

Argument you dont need an Ar or morethan 10 round magazine..
I personally knew a farmer that a few feral hogs charge him and his youngest son, let's just say you only had 10 shots with a pistol.... are you or your young son alive, or gored and injured for life?

Anyone that's ever shot a gun, knows 10 shots isn't enough. The unlikely event where there are more than 1 or 2 attackers is slim, but if it saves just one life right???
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The FF knew of several multi shot weapons of the time. The Puckle Gun had been around for more than 50 years by the time of the revolution. And seeing as how GW had served with the british and the brits had them I would say he would be informed. And he wouldnt be the only one.

Then you take into account the use of any scatter gun, "shot" or other one shot multiple potential casualties I would again say the FFs knew about the potential devastation of a single weapon.

And considering these were literally some of the smartest guys in the nation who were going thru the horrors of war first hand I would say they are well aware of the potential. And still decided the 2a belonged.
 
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#12,556
#12,556
luthervol said:
I actually think the answer to the question leads to realities many try to discount or ignore.
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I am pretty sure every amendment (or at least a vast majority) and clause has been ruled upon by the SC at some point. Not sure your potential realities is a game you want to play here.
 
#12,557
#12,557
LouderVol said:
I am pretty sure every amendment (or at least a vast majority) and clause has been ruled upon by the SC at some point. Not sure your potential realities is a game you want to play here.
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Luther doesn’t care about the details of rulings or the actual language . His agenda is basic and simple . Less guns made , bought , and sold are better . He’s a one bite at a time guy , one law, one restriction , one sanction one infringement. More is better but he will always settle for one more than he had .
 
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#12,558
#12,558
bnhunt said:
When you see someone from the middle east you automatically think terrorist or if you see a Hispanic person you think rapist or murderer, so you are automatically perceiving a threat or "wolf" and are more than likely to be ready to use your gun where I perceive no threat and don't want someone like you "protecting" me and putting my family at risk merely because your perceive some type of threat.
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Has there been a rash of middle eastern people or latino people getting shot that I missed? I guess I also missed the cases of armed civilians shooting up crowds in "self defense".

Sounds like more paranoia.

Here is a link with links to real cases of cops shooting civilians. Granted a good number of legit. But more than 1 were definitely innocent of any crime or circumstance worthy of being shot. https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2019/national/police-shootings-2019/
 
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#12,559
#12,559
hog88 said:
My guess is that just one of those widgets you make cost more than his or most everybody on this board yearly income.
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0nelilreb said:
I always get a chuckle at people defaulting to the “I’m worth more or have than you “ d!ck measuring contest on an anonymous forum . People never stop to think past the post or profile pic. I’ve seen many people over the years , get there mouths closed ( or there jaws fall open ) playing that game . Lol
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You just never know to whom you may be conversing with on a message board.
 
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#12,560
#12,560
InVOLuntary said:
You just never know to whom you may be conversing with on a message board.
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I’ve met a lot of different people . From straight cash on hand guys to “ big daddy “ deciding he wants to ship the new sail boat he just bought for his wife’s birthday across the country from Wilmington NC, to Seattle . You just never know until the pen hits the paper and bank says it’s all good .
 
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#12,565
#12,565
DEFENDTHISHOUSE said:
Good to hear but they’ll be back.

“Senators voted to shelve the bill for the year and ask the state crime commission to study the issue, an outcome that drew cheers from a committee room packed with gun advocates.”
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They shelved it to get past this falls election. If the Dems hold majority it will be back in January.
 
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#12,566
#12,566
While hardly limited to the subject of this thread I'd like to make a quick comment regarding those that come in and drop ideas/beliefs under the umbrella of "honest opinion". The idea seems to be that (and we're assuming it's even true in the first place, which is often very dubious) honesty somehow, in and of itself, imbues the opinion with merit. Absent actual supportive argument this is not the case. There are people out there that "honestly" believe the earth is flat.

Some come on here and (often based on the "feelz") will make assertions that basically come off as 2+2=5 and then, when confronted with things like actual examples, historical precedent, whatever vettable counterargument will make the observation of "all you guys can do is keep regurgitating 2+2=4". Well...yeah.
 
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#12,569
#12,569
DEFENDTHISHOUSE said:
Good to hear but they’ll be back.

“Senators voted to shelve the bill for the year and ask the state crime commission to study the issue, an outcome that drew cheers from a committee room packed with gun advocates.”
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I’d be interested to see the result of that study. We need this law because over the last 10 years nearly 0.5% of murder victims have been killed with assault rifles. It’s time to stop the bloodbath.
 
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