Virginia, MLK day, Accelerationists, Trump, GOP

#453
#453
hog88 said:
When your opposition does not have a valid argument how can you grasp it?

This isn't hard and I can understand why some want to limit/restrict or even ban private ownership of firearms but they are going about it the wrong way. If they want to be listened to and negotiated with then go through the process to amend the constitution. Until they are ready to do that all of their attempts to strip 2A rights do not deserve to be considered or even listened to. Would you listen to and negotiate with a toddler that you told can only have desert after finishing their dinner?
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Let's start here, then. What is the primary reason why a majority of Virginians voted for their representatives to address gun proliferation? Safety. They were using the ballot to say that they were increasingly feeling unsafe around individuals and groups that increasingly use weaponry as the primary motivator to solve problems or establish dominance.
 
#454
#454
AshG said:
I have yet to hear anyone here of the Pro-2A hardline be able to properly articulate the stance under which the de-escalationists are operating. In order to fully understand one's position, one must also grasp and respect the arguments of other side.

The contempt for "other" is a weakness, not a strength,
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To be fair , the pro 2a already has the rights . The anti- gun left wants to limit or diminish those rights . Have you ever tried going to a car dealership to buy a car with this same concept ? This is what it sounds like to my ears when Luther for example starts talking about reasonable and rational ... Hey car guy , I don’t have any money , I have nothing to trade , I can’t /won’t give you anything or bring anything to the table here , but I see you have that shiny powerful car there and I want it . No I get it , you don’t want to give it to me but if we are being rational and reasonable here , I deserve this car by virtue of just being your fellow countryman .
 
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#455
#455
AshG said:
Let's start here, then. What is the primary reason why a majority of Virginians voted for their representatives to address gun proliferation? Safety. They were using the ballot to say that they were increasingly feeling unsafe around individuals and groups that increasingly use weaponry as the primary motivator to solve problems or establish dominance.
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Sounds dumb. The people they were afraid of were breaking no laws and thus no needless legislation should be levied against them.
 
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#456
#456
NorthDallas40 said:
No you’re just not listening. The pro 2A aren’t interested in “negotiating” any more rights away. The only thing I’m interested in is repealing most legislation already in place.
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I never said anything about negotiating. You're operating from a position of assumption and reaction.
 
#458
#458
AshG said:
I never said anything about negotiating. You're operating from a position of assumption and reaction.
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Oh you you’re dictating your desired outcome then? Pro gun advocates aren’t interested in giving up more rights. Many like myself believe most legislation already in place should be repealed. I in fact listed the two biggest ones I believe that should be repealed.
 
#459
#459
vols40 said:
Randy Weaver says hello. And that fed agent got what he deserved shooting a child. It's none of your f...ing business how many guns I own. When will you idiots realize that people who are law abiding citizens just want to be left alone. And these pansies who pull the wool over sheep like you don't care about gun violence they seek absolute power and the 2nd amendment is just in their way. Why do these cowards stand behind armed guards if "guns are bad"
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“Law biding citizens”
Three Alleged Members of the Violent Extremist Group “The Base” Facing Federal Firearms and Alien-Related Charges
1579555213086.jpeg
 
#460
#460
carlos86 said:
You mean because head neck al-Qaeda got caught by the FBI planning to launch an attack on the capital during the rally??? “DEAR GOD I CAN ONLY BUY ONE GUN A MONTH!!!! THE HUMANITY!!!” If you are bulking buying ammo and guns you need to be paid a visit by the FBI‘s JTF and ATF.
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LOL you really believe that which is what is sad
 
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#461
#461
NorthDallas40 said:
Oh you you’re dictating your desired outcome then? Pro gun advocates aren’t interested in giving up more rights. Many like myself believe most legislation already in place should be repealed. I in fact listed the two biggest ones I believe that should be repealed.
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You want me to speak straight to what my issue is? Sure.

This isn't the gun culture I was raised around. I never saw my family treat guns as some kind of shibboleth; it was something you kept so that you could eat or protect. There wasn't much to-do when these issues came up, just a shrug and going on. My generation was educated to respect them and treat them as tools of the mountain life trade.

Now, I'm finding myself increasingly surrounded by bloviates who treat those without gun experience or education as some type of failed life form to be mocked and ridiculed instead of informed. I see the best, broadest national advocacy program as one of the biggest bullies in the room that doesn't really give a **** what's going on the world and steps up attacks on those with real concerns. And then there's the labelmakers and smallminders who come across as "Herr derr, you disagree with this one issue you must have small peen! Must be a stoopid Dim! Go away! Derr!" instead of actually showing some humanity and trying to bring them into the fold of understanding and respect.

I keep forgetting that this isn't a place for substantive conversation towards amicable ends. That's 100% on me.
 
#462
#462
AshG said:
Let's start here, then. What is the primary reason why a majority of Virginians voted for their representatives to address gun proliferation? Safety. They were using the ballot to say that they were increasingly feeling unsafe around individuals and groups that increasingly use weaponry as the primary motivator to solve problems or establish dominance.
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The Virginia example is a perfect example of the absolute need for our constitution. It is an example of a majority wanting to infringe on the rights of the minority. So it is a good place to start. Great civics lesson for the younger generation.

Now again, until anti-2A people are prepared to go through the proper procedures to get what they want they should not listened to, bargained with or acknowledged. There is a well defined path towards altering the 2A yet they are too childish to go down it. So again I ask, do you negotiate with toddlers?
 
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#463
#463
ClearwaterVol said:
I only worry about SCOTUS when talking about these issues. Hence most. Keep dazzling us with that intellect.

Also, I freely said I disagreed with the restrictions of freedom in the name of safety. That was the subject of the original post. If you are going to butt in... try to stay on topic and not completely derail an otherwise healthy debate.
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"WhY CaN't wez haVe the NuCLeaR bOmBs As pER the CONSTITUTIONAL PaPeR WORK SMaRtEE?" = "otherwise healthy debate"

Come back when SCOTUS, the courts, and the majority of law enforcement and military agree to your archaic emotional beliefs on guns, other Don keep tilting those AR-15 windmills
 
#464
#464
AshG said:
A computer could have scripted the bulk of this thread.

The two most populated sides need to step away from their fears and biases if we are to move forward. Find a place of stability between the two. Work from there.
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Thank God you weren't around during the 1770s
 
#465
#465
AshG said:
You want me to speak straight to what my issue is? Sure.

This isn't the gun culture I was raised around. I never saw my family treat guns as some kind of shibboleth; it was something you kept so that you could eat or protect. There wasn't much to-do when these issues came up, just a shrug and going on. My generation was educated to respect them and treat them as tools of the mountain life trade.

Now, I'm finding myself increasingly surrounded by bloviates who treat those without gun experience or education as some type of failed life form to be mocked and ridiculed instead of informed. I see the best, broadest national advocacy program as one of the biggest bullies in the room that doesn't really give a **** what's going on the world and steps up attacks on those with real concerns. And then there's the labelmakers and smallminders who come across as "Herr derr, you disagree with this one issue you must have small peen! Must be a stoopid Dim! Go away! Derr!" instead of actually showing some humanity and trying to bring them into the fold of understanding and respect.

I keep forgetting that this isn't a place for substantive conversation towards amicable ends. That's 100% on me.
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There are too many examples of government overreach AFTER guns are taken away. Venezuela being the most recent. Once you give up a right, you dont get it back without force.
 
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#466
#466
AshG said:
You want me to speak straight to what my issue is? Sure.

This isn't the gun culture I was raised around. I never saw my family treat guns as some kind of shibboleth; it was something you kept so that you could eat or protect. There wasn't much to-do when these issues came up, just a shrug and going on. My generation was educated to respect them and treat them as tools of the mountain life trade.

Now, I'm finding myself increasingly surrounded by bloviates who treat those without gun experience or education as some type of failed life form to be mocked and ridiculed instead of informed. I see the best, broadest national advocacy program as one of the biggest bullies in the room that doesn't really give a **** what's going on the world and steps up attacks on those with real concerns. And then there's the labelmakers and smallminders who come across as "Herr derr, you disagree with this one issue you must have small peen! Must be a stoopid Dim! Go away! Derr!" instead of actually showing some humanity and trying to bring them into the fold of understanding and respect.

I keep forgetting that this isn't a place for substantive conversation towards amicable ends. That's 100% on me.
Click to expand...

You want amicable ends? Go through the proper procedures to get them, quit trying to end-run the constitution if you want to be taken seriously.
 
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#468
#468
Rickyvol77 said:
Thank God you weren't around during the 1770s
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When the Continental Congress did just that, overcoming multiple cavernous divides to draft one of the most well-written and enduring governing documents of the modern era?
 
#470
#470
AshG said:
When the Continental Congress did just that, overcoming multiple cavernous divides to draft one of the most well-written and enduring governing documents of the modern era?
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Then use it to get what you want, stop trying to bastardize it.
 
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#471
#471
hog88 said:
You want amicable ends? Go through the proper procedures to get them, quit trying to end-run the constitution if you want to be taken seriously.
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I increasingly feel like the sober guy at the bar pointing out that some of the more popular ideas from the three-drinks-in group might not be the best ideas. So be it. It's why God put me on this earth.
 
#474
#474
AshG said:
I have yet to hear anyone here of the Pro-2A hardline be able to properly articulate the stance under which the de-escalationists are operating. In order to fully understand one's position, one must also grasp and respect the arguments of other side.

The contempt for "other" is a weakness, not a strength,
Click to expand...

"I feelz gunz are Dangerous!" is not a side. The Constitution is clear, the Founding Fathers were clear in their writings, and the type of archaic "common sense" gun control that leftists are trying is impractical and has no real effect on the criminal aspect of it. It would be akin to attempting to ban the number of gang colored clothing in order to bring down the total number of gang members. All it does is keep normal law abiding people from buying clothes of any kind, while the gang members aren't affected
 
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#475
#475
AshG said:
I increasingly feel like the sober guy at the bar pointing out that some of the more popular ideas from the three-drinks-in group might not be the best ideas. So be it. It's why God put me on this earth.
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You're the only one that doesnt see the true consequences. I'd say you're the friend trying to convince people you are ok to drive while being 10 beers in.
 
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