TrumpPutingate III: the beginning of the end

#11,227
#11,227
tumscalcium said:
Aaaaaaand deflection. I like how you claim someone is dodging then immediately deflect.

Too easy.
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Oh, given your stated ability yesterday, I assumed you'd be able to extrapolate my agreement.

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#11,229
#11,229
lawgator1 said:
We need to define our terms.

"Rigged," to me anyway, means changed actual vote tallies. I read that some of the tampering by Russians suggests they WOULD, if they COULD, change the numbers. But that they have not managed to get that far, yet.

"Meddled," to me, means they engaged in deceptive practices designed to influence voters to get a desired result.

The overwhelming consensus of opinion is that they meddled, but did not rig, the 2016 election. Trump has lied repeatedly about having any connection to it. And now it seems like the plan is to anticipate that Mueller report will say that there was some collusion. And so Trump and his supporters are now retreating a bit and saying its not a crime to collude to meddle, as long as they did not rig.

What people need to remember in that event is motive. WHY would the Russians want Trump to win that badly? Just dislike of Hillary? Possible, I suppose, but what about all these pro-Russia decisions by Trump. Heard on the radio just yesterday that there is talk of removing some more of the sanctions. And now there are reports of a meeting BEFORE the meeting with the Russian to strategize the big meeting. There is no way Trump did not know of that. His team is softening things up because they know its coming.

I hope that Mueller's report doesn't just tell us what we all already know -- there was collusion. I think we need to know WHY the Russians wanted him to win. That will tell the tale of how this ends.
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About time you asked the right question.

Now, answer your question. Why wouldn't they want Hillary to win? Because if memory serves, didn't they also push for Bernie?

The other question you have to ask is whether or not they would have pushed for another GOP candidate like they did Trump.
 
#11,231
#11,231
Grand Vol said:
About time you asked the right question.

Now, answer your question. Why wouldn't they want Hillary to win? Because if memory serves, didn't they also push for Bernie?

The other question you have to ask is whether or not they would have pushed for another GOP candidate like they did Trump.
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Oh, don't misunderstand. I see no reason to think it is a GOP thing. The meddling was specific to Trump, not the GOP generally.
 
#11,232
#11,232
lawgator1 said:
Oh, don't misunderstand. I see no reason to think it is a GOP thing. The meddling was specific to Trump, not the GOP generally.
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Did you miss his entire point, or just ignore it? He's inferring it was more an anti-Hillary thing than a pro-Trump thing. maybe they knew something about Hillary that you're afraid to admit to yourself.
 
#11,233
#11,233
https://www.nybooks.com/daily/2018/07/31/what-trump-knew-and-when-he-knew-it/

Previously undisclosed evidence in the possession of Special Counsel Robert Mueller—including highly confidential White House records and testimony by some of President Trump’s own top aides—provides some of the strongest evidence to date implicating the president of the United States in an obstruction of justice. Several people who have reviewed a portion of this evidence say that, based on what they know, they believe it is now all but inevitable that the special counsel will complete a confidential report presenting evidence that President Trump violated the law. Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein, who oversees the special counsel’s work, would then decide on turning over that report to Congress for the House of Representatives to consider whether to instigate impeachment proceedings.
 
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#11,235
#11,235
It's not easy to reply to you at the moment, LG. This is my current location, so please no foolishness for a bit.

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#11,236
#11,236
evillawyer said:
https://www.nybooks.com/daily/2018/07/31/what-trump-knew-and-when-he-knew-it/

Previously undisclosed evidence in the possession of Special Counsel Robert Mueller—including highly confidential White House records and testimony by some of President Trump’s own top aides—provides some of the strongest evidence to date implicating the president of the United States in an obstruction of justice. Several people who have reviewed a portion of this evidence say that, based on what they know, they believe it is now all but inevitable that the special counsel will complete a confidential report presenting evidence that President Trump violated the law. Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein, who oversees the special counsel’s work, would then decide on turning over that report to Congress for the House of Representatives to consider whether to instigate impeachment proceedings.
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So is this actually violating the law, or is this "Comey saying Hillary Clinton violated the law but since it's Hillary nothing will happen" violating the law?
 
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#11,238
#11,238
evillawyer said:
https://www.nybooks.com/daily/2018/07/31/what-trump-knew-and-when-he-knew-it/

Previously undisclosed evidence in the possession of Special Counsel Robert Mueller—including highly confidential White House records and testimony by some of President Trump’s own top aides—provides some of the strongest evidence to date implicating the president of the United States in an obstruction of justice. Several people who have reviewed a portion of this evidence say that, based on what they know, they believe it is now all but inevitable that the special counsel will complete a confidential report presenting evidence that President Trump violated the law. Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein, who oversees the special counsel’s work, would then decide on turning over that report to Congress for the House of Representatives to consider whether to instigate impeachment proceedings.
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I wonder if Mueller will actually name sources in his confidential report?
 
#11,239
#11,239
(CNN)The biggest misconception surrounding the special counsel probe into Russian interference in the 2016 election is that it will likely end in some sort of legal proceeding involving President Donald Trump. It won't -- for a bunch of reasons, the most important of which is that Robert Mueller, who is running the investigation, doesn't seem to believe a sitting President can be indicted.

The much more likely outcome is that Mueller releases the findings from his investigation sometime this fall — and lets the chips, as they relate to Trump, fall where they may. Which means — and this is what Trump and his personal lawyer Rudy Giuliani have understood for months — that, ultimately, this isn't a legal fight, it's a public relations one.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/31/politics/donald-trump-rudy-giuliani/index.html
 
#11,240
#11,240
Septic said:
If you understand the definition of tampering, you'd be a fool to believe that. Also, where did you hear that?
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#11,242
#11,242
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#11,243
#11,243
McDad said:
Maybe now that we're all upset about another power messing with our elections we can stop messing with the elections of other countries.
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BOOM!!! “ We can’t have our cake and eat it too “ I’d especially like if we would stop interfering in our closest allies elections ( Israel ) maybe while we are at it stop tapping our other allies personal cell phones ( Germany ) I can’t remember what administration did that , maybe the liberals on her can help me with that one . This fake outcry with Russia after playing touchy feely with them the last 8 years is just ridiculous . Let’s all say it together ..HYPOCRISY is bad , mmkay
 
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