Recruiting Forum Off Topic Thread III

[avolation]

But the closest of kin can remove medical support for a brain dead person and it not be murder. We allow them to make that decision. If another person does it it's murder because they don't have the right to make that decision.

I would say a fetus and someone brain-dead are comparable in that sense. Someone else can't make that decision, but they aren't fully persons

The only way you can make that comparison is if the fetus is also brain dead. This is where the argument of viability enters the room. If you take a person off of life support they will die. If the mother continues to eat, sleep, and breath, then the baby will continue to develop in the womb.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

True but a brain dead person has no chance of living a normal life. The unborn child does. Until the person that should be protecting it decides to kill it. It is the ultimate betrayal.

It is pure murder.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

Wrong there bud. One day you will. I believe that.

You are right..thanks to the amazing grace of God I surely will...thanks for this.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

The only way you can make that comparison is if the fetus is also brain dead. This is where the argument of viability enters the room. If you take a person off of life support they will die. If the mother continues to eat, sleep, and breath, then the baby will continue to develop in the womb.

Exactly..

 

[BJHSVol]

The only way you can make that comparison is if the fetus is also brain dead. This is where the argument of viability enters the room. If you take a person off of life support they will die. If the mother continues to eat, sleep, and breath, then the baby will continue to develop in the womb.

But can you not say that the mother is comparable to life-support? If you take the baby out of the womb they will not continue to grow no matter what medical intervention is given. If the baby is far enough along it has a chance to survive outside the womb, then abortion should not be allowed.

A quick google showed that the earliest surviving premature baby was 21 weeks, so I would be completely with making it illegal past 20 weeks. But before that I believe it is a personal choice

 

[JacketVol]

Update:

If y'all don't think the University of Tennessee is trying to socially manipulate your children, you need to think again. If we had time, we'd choose a different University. If I'd have known what was going to happen, I'd have sent an extra battery for my son and told him to put his ear buds in and watch YouTube videos. You shouldn't be forced to watch the crap they were presenting.

And, he was told if he left he would be charged another$200 and be forced to go through orientation again.

Do we need to stop supporting football? I didn't send my daughter there even though they wanted her badly in their music program/ classical pianist. I have just heard to much crap and just not sure about my dollars going toward this junk if you are seeing it first hand. What were they doing?

 

[InVOLuntary]

Do we need to stop supporting football? I didn't send my daughter there even though they wanted her badly in their music program/ classical pianist. I have just heard to much crap and just not sure about my dollars going toward this junk if you are seeing it first hand. What were they doing?

They are making them watch these stupid skits that they have these fat girls come out and simulate them being ridiculed. The fat girls were actually crying. Made my son very uncomfortable. It was stuff like that all night. They were doing stuff that should be the parents responsibility. My son bleeds orange but he told me tonight he's wondering if he made the right decision. I just wish they would concentrate on educating the kids instead of trying to force a social agenda and political correctness. I'm friends with my state representative. I'm calling him tomorrow. They're out of control over there.

 

[avolation]

But can you not say that the mother is comparable to life-support? If you take the baby out of the womb they will not continue to grow no matter what medical intervention is given. If the baby is far enough along it has a chance to survive outside the womb, then abortion should not be allowed.

A quick google showed that the earliest surviving premature baby was 21 weeks, so I would be completely with making it illegal past 20 weeks. But before that I believe it is a personal choice

Sure you can say the mother is comparable to life support, because her body is literallly supporting the development of the child. And you are right that a child born before 20 weeks will not survive. However, looking back to your example, notice how and when the interventions are given. Medical intervention is necessary to keep a brain dead person alive. On the other hand, medical intervention is needed to terminate the fetus. One is keeping a person alive, the other is killing a fetus. Totally different.

Oh and why draw the line at 21 weeks and 0 days? What’s the difference between that and 20 weeks and 6 days?

 

[Rishvol]

They are making them watch these stupid skits that they have these fat girls come out and simulate them being ridiculed. The fat girls were actually crying. Made my son very uncomfortable. It was stuff like that all night. They were doing stuff that should be the parents responsibility. My son bleeds orange but he told me tonight he's wondering if he made the right decision. I just wish they would concentrate on educating the kids instead of trying to force a social agenda and political correctness. I'm friends with my state representative. I'm calling him tomorrow. They're out of control over there.

If you're going to complain about UT complain about the whole state funded University system. It's not just UT that does this.

 

[VolsDoc81TX]

Too much fru fru.

As a good father, you casually wander off, “get lost” and then sneak into the football workout gym and get insider status...that’s how It’s supposed to be done.

Edit: posted this before you explained.

 

[chavisut]

.

 

[Glitch]

Update:

If y'all don't think the University of Tennessee is trying to socially manipulate your children, you need to think again. If we had time, we'd choose a different University. If I'd have known what was going to happen, I'd have sent an extra battery for my son and told him to put his ear buds in and watch YouTube videos. You shouldn't be forced to watch the crap they were presenting.

And, he was told if he left he would be charged another$200 and be forced to go through indoctrination again.

Fify

 

[Glitch]

But can you not say that the mother is comparable to life-support? If you take the baby out of the womb they will not continue to grow no matter what medical intervention is given. If the baby is far enough along it has a chance to survive outside the womb, then abortion should not be allowed.

A quick google showed that the earliest surviving premature baby was 21 weeks, so I would be completely with making it illegal past 20 weeks. But before that I believe it is a personal choice

The life support machine cannot choose to terminate the person attached to it. A one celled organism is considered alive. Yet people will argue that a child is not alive until it can survive on its own outside the womb. Then we build machines to help babies born prematurely outside the womb survive. Why? If they aren't meant to survive then why build machines to assist them in defying their fate? I have three kids. The oldest is 13. None of them would survive without the intervention of their mother and I. They wouldn't be able to feed or house themselves. They would eventually die without our assistance. Are they less alive because they are dependent on their parents to survive?

 

[VolsDoc81TX]

Corporal punishments has pretty much been proven to cause more harm than good

Physical punishment of children: lessons from 20 years of research

If you just whoop the disrespectful ones, it’s acceptable and would serve as a significant deterrent.

No one was disrespectful to teachers in the schools that I attended. If you were, you got paddled or permanently kicked out of the school. Quickly, we learned the right way. The assistant principals all looked like bouncers. They were the enforcers...even the thugs were respectful.

Now there is no consequence to being disrespectful. In school suspension is BS.

 

[VolsDoc81TX]

I personally don't spank my kids. However, if I ever hear about them being rude to an adult or back talking a teacher..... Well it won't happen because my kids are taught that they will respect adults, period. The schools are simply not allowed to discipline any more, at all. The kids run the show and do what they want. Parents don't care. If you don't want to allow spanking in school then I'm fine with that. However, schools should have some recourse. If your kid misbehaves repeatedly and you don't fix the problem at home then you should have to make other arrangements for your child. They still have to go to school, but they are no longer welcome in the public school due to behavioral issues. The parents should have to figure it out, the teachers shouldn't have to deal with bratty little twerps while they are trying to teach.

Preach brother preach!

 

[VolsDoc81TX]

Excellent points. I hate abortion but there are consequences. We as a society need to figure out how to deal with those consequences.

I have 2 children through adoption. I am thankful every day that the birth Mothers both chose to give birth and then give up parental rights.

I Thank the Lord every single day for their courage and their decisions.

:hi:

 

[BJHSVol]

The life support machine cannot choose to terminate the person attached to it. A one celled organism is considered alive. Yet people will argue that a child is not alive until it can survive on its own outside the womb. Then we build machines to help babies born prematurely outside the womb survive. Why? If they aren't meant to survive then why build machines to assist them in defying their fate? I have three kids. The oldest is 13. None of them would survive without the intervention of their mother and I. They wouldn't be able to feed or house themselves. They would eventually die without our assistance. Are they less alive because they are dependent on their parents to survive?

No, but someone makes the decision to terminate the person for the life support machine. They have the potential to become a person and if people and medicine should help them reach that potential if that’s what the parents want. But that is the parents choice until they become a person.

I would choose not to have an abortion because I would want to see that life come to fruition, but that is my choice.

 

[Glitch]

No, but someone makes the decision to terminate the person for the life support machine. They have the potential to become a person and if people and medicine should help them reach that potential if that’s what the parents want. But that is the parents choice until they become a person.

I would choose not to have an abortion because I would want to see that life come to fruition, but that is my choice.

What have we lost due to abortion? Cures to diseases? Symphonies? Mathematical equations? Beautiful art? Abortion robs the world of all that those children could have been and done. No excuse for it. I don't expect to convince you otherwise because you have obviously chosen your position. I just cannot see the benefit of terminating something so precious as a baby.

 

[BJHSVol]

If you just whoop the disrespectful ones, it’s acceptable and would serve as a significant deterrent.

No one was disrespectful to teachers in the schools that I attended. If you were, you got paddled or permanently kicked out of the school. Quickly, we learned the right way. The assistant principals all looked like bouncers. They were the enforcers...even the thigs were respectful.

Now there is no consequence to being disrespectful. In school suspension is BS.

No one was disrespectful to teachers in the schools I attended either, and there was no paddling. If you have to result to violence to get respect you’re not doing something right

 

[VolsDoc81TX]

"Living" by that scientific sense includes bacteria, cattle, etc. If that definition is all that's needed to be meet then killing any of those things should be illegal.

There's a difference between those things and a human being though. And I don't think a fetus makes that transition until the third trimester at the earliest.

Personally, I hold the potential to reach "personhood" as enough to not want abortion in my own life. But I don't think at the point of most abortions the fetus has reached "personhood" so the government should not make abortion illegal.

Just curious, you think abortion should be legal?
But getting a spanking in school should be illegal?

That’s your stance?

Not really judging, just extremely curious at this point...

 

[jjay2518]

No one was disrespectful to teachers in the schools I attended either, and there was no paddling. If you have to result to violence to get respect you’re not doing something right

This. No one in my school raised a finger towards the kids, and everybody was very well behaved. My dad maybe spanked me twice my entire childhood, and in my mind those were the easy punishments. I respected the hell out of him, and no spanking hurt worse than him looking me in the eye and saying he was disappointed in me when I did something stupid.

 

[VolsDoc81TX]

I agree with you on less government. Someone has to protect those that cannot protect or speak for themselves though.

That’s why we have superheroes!
Wait, are those just movies? I thought that they wee documentaries...

 

[BJHSVol]

What have we lost due to abortion? Cures to diseases? Symphonies? Mathematical equations? Beautiful art? Abortion robs the world of all that those children could have been and done. No excuse for it. I don't expect to convince you otherwise because you have obviously chosen your position. I just cannot see the benefit of terminating something so precious as a baby.

Or murderers, theives, sentenced children to lives of abuse/neglect if they were born? It could go both ways. I respect your position, and like I said it’s what I would follow in my own life. But I haven’t been able to reach the conclusion that it’s based on anything but my own personal feelings, and not something that should be enforced onto the entire population.

 

[avolation]

No, but someone makes the decision to terminate the person for the life support machine. They have the potential to become a person and if people and medicine should help them reach that potential if that’s what the parents want. But that is the parents choice until they become a person.

I would choose not to have an abortion because I would want to see that life come to fruition, but that is my choice.

You can’t terminate (bring to an end) a person being kept alive with life support. If you withdraw support, the person will die naturally.

A parent doesn’t necessarily have to want a fetus to develop in order for the fetus to grow, develop, and be born. Get this, a woman who is unconscious and in a coma, can STILL give birth.

 

[VolsDoc81TX]

But can you not say that the mother is comparable to life-support? If you take the baby out of the womb they will not continue to grow no matter what medical intervention is given. If the baby is far enough along it has a chance to survive outside the womb, then abortion should not be allowed.

A quick google showed that the earliest surviving premature baby was 21 weeks, so I would be completely with making it illegal past 20 weeks. But before that I believe it is a personal choice

You get to choose your actions. You don’t get to choose your consequences.

You are advocating for no consequences.

Extremist response: you can abort, but then both birth parents are sterilized... significant consequence for a significant action. Very extreme, yes, yes it is.