Want To Talk About Watergate? Talk About Obama, Not Trump.

#51
#51
Any time I want to have a conversation where logic plays no part, I know I can count on this place.
 
#54
#54
volinbham said:
One of the things Comey said on this "me" tour that has stuck with me is that he preferred Hillary because (paraphrasing) she was onboard with how the government does law and order.

Just a speculation thought but perhaps the IC was anti-Trump because they feared he and the outsiders he brought with him might be shocked (and not supportive) of how the IC operates. Hillary was steeped in and bought in. A true outsider might expose some of the depths of what's going on. Snowden gave a glimpse. Clapper lied to Congress about spying on US citizens (under questioning by Wyden). Trump was a threat to the IC status quo while Hillary was a product of it.

Just throwing it out there.
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This has always been an insider/outsider thing. The DC establishment will not tolerate an outsider it their midst. Party may be an annoyance, but an outsider is downright scary to them.
 
#55
#55
BowlBrother85 said:
An investigation of Lois Lerner by the U.S. Department of Justice and FBI, completed in 2015, found "substantial evidence of mismanagement, poor judgment and institutional inertia" but "found no evidence that any IRS official acted based on political, corrupt, or other inappropriate motives that would support a criminal prosecution."

I don't expect that to satisfy you but that was the conclusion reached by investigators.
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One non-competing DC agency investigating another - how do you really expect it to come out? But being a lib, you have a love affair with a big federal government, so they can do no wrong.
 
#56
#56
BowlBrother85 said:
An investigation of Lois Lerner by the U.S. Department of Justice and FBI, completed in 2015, found "substantial evidence of mismanagement, poor judgment and institutional inertia" but "found no evidence that any IRS official acted based on political, corrupt, or other inappropriate motives that would support a criminal prosecution."

I don't expect that to satisfy you but that was the conclusion reached by investigators.
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It didn’t satisfy a federal judge either....

A federal judge Wednesday gave preliminary approval to a $3.5 million settlement of a lawsuit against the IRS over alleged targeting of tea party groups and other conservative organizations.

U.S. District Judge Michael Barrett set a July 10 hearing in Cincinnati on making the settlement final, and scheduled deadlines for claims and objections.

The Justice Department had announced last year that the case had been settled, pending approval of terms.

The lead plaintiff was the California-based Norcal Tea Party Patriots. The case swelled into a class-action suit by hundreds of groups. The court will decide how much each gets after legal costs.

JUDGE AWARDS $3.5 Million To Tea Party Groups Obama’s IRS Targeted * 100PercentFedUp.com
 
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#57
#57
Rush Limbaugh: FBI's Russia Investigation Was A Setup From The Start | Video | RealClearPolitics

Most 'liked' comments at the end of this piece:

Tough-as-nails Joe DiGenova summed this up in his blunt spoken manner: The thugs in the DOJ and FBI conspired to protect Hillary from being prosecuted for her crimes, and frame Donald Trump for "colluding with the Russians", which he did not do. And even if he had, that is not a crime. Rush is right. The FBI has become a rogue agency which is putting our freedom in jeapordy. It may be time to water the tree of liberty with the blood of Tyrants, as Thomas Jefferson advised. I am not exaggerating, this is that serious. As Tucker Carlson said, the FBI is the most dangerous law enforcement agency in the US. They are armed, and have the authority to spy on anybody and arrest anybody they want. I hope somebody can put these scummy criminals in their place, remind them who is the ultimate authority-the American voters.

And this one...

You folks on the left have been saying Rush is a flash in the pan for 28+ years now..... You dummies need to get a grip on who the stakeholders are, and the role the principles and agents play. We the people do have a right to know what the agents are up to and why, and you are going down. It must really suck! to be you.....
 
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#60
#60
Vol0725 said:
Rush Limbaugh: FBI's Russia Investigation Was A Setup From The Start | Video | RealClearPolitics

Most 'liked' comments at the end of this piece:

Tough-as-nails Joe DiGenova summed this up in his blunt spoken manner: The thugs in the DOJ and FBI conspired to protect Hillary from being prosecuted for her crimes, and frame Donald Trump for "colluding with the Russians", which he did not do. And even if he had, that is not a crime. Rush is right. The FBI has become a rogue agency which is putting our freedom in jeapordy. It may be time to water the tree of liberty with the blood of Tyrants, as Thomas Jefferson advised. I am not exaggerating, this is that serious. As Tucker Carlson said, the FBI is the most dangerous law enforcement agency in the US. They are armed, and have the authority to spy on anybody and arrest anybody they want. I hope somebody can put these scummy criminals in their place, remind them who is the ultimate authority-the American voters.

And this one...

You folks on the left have been saying Rush is a flash in the pan for 28+ years now..... You dummies need to get a grip on who the stakeholders are, and the role the principles and agents play. We the people do have a right to know what the agents are up to and why, and you are going down. It must really suck! to be you.....
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No, we have been saying that he is a blowhard fear mongering drug addled idiot.
 
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#63
#63
BowlBrother85 said:
Uhhh, he has already pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI. That's pretty much a felony. Yes, he was a dreadful hire who brought conflicts of interest galore aboard including things not even associated with Russia. See his lobbying efforts in Turkey.
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They had his phone conversation on tape and compared his memory of that conversation to transcript of the call.

He was on vacation during the call - likely could have had alcohol in his system.

Comey stated he had no reason to believe Flynn was dishonest.

He hasn't been convicted of anything yet.

A guilty plea was accepted to end weaponized prosecution by the federal government.
 
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#64
#64
If Trump is guilty of an impeachable offense, throw him out of office. Funny though, that no one on the left actually wants a transparent investigation. LG, Luther, Tom, Mick, and whoever else...You're not interested in a lawful investigation being carried out. You just want Trump gone. It doesn't matter if he's done anything illegal. Your politics dictate your desire to get him out of office. For all your blathering and speculation, you're not seeking the truth. You just want Trump gone. When a Democrat takes the office and Republicans use the same tactics, that's when transparency will become important to you. This is why our political system sucks. It's all about sides. All about dividing. And I'm fully aware Republicans engage in similar behavior, but acting a certain way because "they" do too has never been a reason for acting poorly. Behavior is either acceptable or not. It's not a case by case basis.
 
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#65
#65
Weezer said:
If Trump is guilty of an impeachable offense, throw him out of office. Funny though, that no one on the left actually wants a transparent investigation. LG, Luther, Tom, Mick, and whoever else...You're not interested in a lawful investigation being carried out. You just want Trump gone. It doesn't matter if he's done anything illegal. Your politics dictate your desire to get him out of office. For all your blathering and speculation, you're not seeking the truth. You just want Trump gone. When a Democrat takes the office and Republicans use the same tactics, that's when transparency will become important to you. This is why our political system sucks. It's all about sides. All about dividing. And I'm fully aware Republicans engage in similar behavior, but acting a certain way because "they" do too has never been a reason for acting poorly. Behavior is either acceptable or not. It's not a case by case basis.
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Mueller is carrying out a lawful investigation. We can't help it that it don't leak. When you talk of transparency, you are referring to the transparency of the investigation and not of the Trump Admin. That is obvious from the "I'm ok that Trump didn't release his taxes", "So what that they all meet with Russians" "It was about nothing anyway". The underhanded lack of transparency and the continuous stream of lies is what Mueller is investigating.
 
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#66
#66
Mick said:
Mueller is carrying out a lawful investigation. We can't help it that it don't leak. When you talk of transparency, you are referring to the transparency of the investigation and not of the Trump Admin. That is obvious from the "I'm ok that Trump didn't release his taxes", "So what that they all meet with Russians" "It was about nothing anyway". The underhanded lack of transparency and the continuous stream of lies is what Mueller is investigating.
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Actually several legal minds have contended he in fact is not carrying out a lawful investigation. That it is fact unconstitutional.
 
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#68
#68
ajvol01 said:
Watergate was amateur hour compared to this.

Obama weaponized the CIA director, (Brennan) DNI (Clapper), DOJ (Yates, Carlin, Ohr, etc) FBI (Comey, McCabe, Rybicki, Kortan, Strzok, Page, et al)

Watergate was a failed break in. This was an illegal spying operation.

Scary and sickening. The media and the Dems are in complete denial. The media was complicit.
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You need to read a little more about Watergate. It wasn't just that particular break-in. It was a series of break-ins and misuse of campaign funds that led to Nixon's downfall.
 
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#69
#69
NorthDallas40 said:
Actually several legal minds have contended he in fact is not carrying out a lawful investigation. That it is fact unconstitutional.
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Yep. Several who are hardcore conservatives. What is funny about this is that Mueller is actually a conservative himself....just not the dumbed downed type that has supported Trump.

That being said, I don't believe there is any real evidence of Trump colluding with the Russians concerning the election, BUT that still that doesn't take away the fact that he's an extremely impulsive, severely insecure ass clown who isn't fit for the office
 
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#70
#70
114VOL said:
Yep. Several who are hardcore conservatives. What is funny about this is that Mueller is actually a conservative himself....just not the dumbed downed type that has supported Trump.

That being said, I don't believe there is any real evidence of Trump colluding with the Russians concerning the election, BUT that still that doesn't take away the fact that he's an extremely impulsive, severely insecure ass clown who isn't fit for the office
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In spite of all that, he's doing a great job.
 
#71
#71
Weezer said:
If Trump is guilty of an impeachable offense, throw him out of office. Funny though, that no one on the left actually wants a transparent investigation. LG, Luther, Tom, Mick, and whoever else...You're not interested in a lawful investigation being carried out. You just want Trump gone. It doesn't matter if he's done anything illegal. Your politics dictate your desire to get him out of office. For all your blathering and speculation, you're not seeking the truth. You just want Trump gone. When a Democrat takes the office and Republicans use the same tactics, that's when transparency will become important to you. This is why our political system sucks. It's all about sides. All about dividing. And I'm fully aware Republicans engage in similar behavior, but acting a certain way because "they" do too has never been a reason for acting poorly. Behavior is either acceptable or not. It's not a case by case basis.
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The definition of lawful does not turn on whether you like it.
 
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#72
#72
114VOL said:
Yep. Several who are hardcore conservatives. What is funny about this is that Mueller is actually a conservative himself....just not the dumbed downed type that has supported Trump.

That being said, I don't believe there is any real evidence of Trump colluding with the Russians concerning the election, BUT that still that doesn't take away the fact that he's an extremely impulsive, severely insecure ass clown who isn't fit for the office
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No. Alan Dershowitz is the primary voice that comes to mind. And he is squarely in the Dims camp. And you guys have tried to shrug off his opinion on this too. That’s awful convenient.
 
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#73
#73
114VOL said:
You need to read a little more about Watergate. It wasn't just that particular break-in. It was a series of break-ins and misuse of campaign funds that led to Nixon's downfall.
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I agree with this. The breakin was the tipping point event that uncovered the behavior. And then you had the follow on cover up and I guess you could call outright obstruction.

However by one years time you had a YUGE trail of evidence which was fairly known on all of this as well as an embedded informant. None of that in Trumps case.
 
#74
#74
lawgator1 said:
The definition of lawful does not turn on whether you like it.
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I don't base it on anything I like. I have come to hate any POTUS, Republican or Democrat, being investigated because imo, it embarrasses our country. We air our dirty laundry to the world then wonder why no one respects us. I find it sad.

No, I question its lawfulness completely on Mueller's actions and his reticence to comply with Congress and some judges in providing pertinent information. If you took off your political blinders, you'd have questions too.
 
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#75
#75
I will never understand anyone who takes glee in trying to take down a sitting President. When Republicans chased Bill, I didn't feel glee. Whether you like or dislike a POTUS, these are the people duly elected to the position. Anytime any President screws up, it's an embarrassment. It's certainly not something to take glee in. Hoping something comes out that will remove him from office, I don't understand that. I would never cheer for a President to fail or be booted from office in anything other than a lawful election. It's like cheering for our country to fail. Or at least that's how it feels to me.
 
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