Recruiting Forum Football Talk XLIV

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The first part of your sentence negates every other point you made. The fanbase would go absolutely NUTS if we got Gruden. Absolutely no doubt in my mind money, recruits and national attention would flood into Knoxville on a scale we've never seen. Regardless of whether we win a title, it would show the world we're ready to play big boy college football and would set program up extremely well long-term. The effect would more than pay for itself. Just look at Bama. The AD and boosters apparently know this and are chasing it.

I just have insurmountable doubts that we'll get him in the end, in light of all the naysayers in the national media and the uncertainty about whether he really wants to coach college.

I still think we land on a good hire though. Fun to watch!

However, it is possible that we don't see any real improvement over the next 2 or 3 years. I don't think that's the case with him, but it is possible. If that does happen all the attention, at least positive attention, starts going away, as does the money, and we're right back where we are.

In this case though there would be a much larger bill to pay with those huge rumored contracts. But hey, if the boosters are covering most or all of that, no problem.
 
Currie isn't orchestrating any kind of message board strategy himself. But Tennessee almost certainly employs a PR firm that either has its own reputation management/social media management division or it subcontracts to a company that handles those sorts of things.

Reddit is manipulated by those firms every day.

What if it’s two Pr forms. One that manages the baby vol account and another that is LWS.
 
I think LWS is a little similar to me. There’s a lot of prominent media folks (Albright? Staples? Dodd?) screaming in your face that Gruden isn’t coming. Plus if the rumors are true, we are paying him all that money and giving him everything he wants and he still hasn’t accepted yet, seems logical at this point to think he’s not coming.

But I we will see. The rumors aren’t dying.

Lol Albright. Dudes not prominent at all.

*edit: came out snarky. Didn’t mean it that way. Albright is just a wanna be in my eyes.
 
Pat Forde mentioned Mike Norvell and Jeff Brohm as realistic candidates to replace Butch.

Either the entire national media is clueless or we are delusional.

Let's see how it goes.

I am preparing for this. Just as I thought Butch would finish the season. Hopefully I am pleasantly suprised again.
 
What if Gruden turned us down... but Currie and Gruden both agreed to keep the smoke alive to help mask our search and help gruden leverage ESPN or NFL jobs. That’s the most likely scenario imo

Let's let the fanbase think Gruden is still in play so they'll be bummed when I announce someone else?

If he's not the guy, they need as much distance between figuring that out and naming the next guy as possible IMO JMO.
 
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You know when you watch the NFL draft, and when they announce a pick for a team and the fans there boo and get pissed?
This UT fanbase is to that point after Kif, fooley, and Butch, and if Currie announces some boob or dud/up and comer, that is exactly what is going to happen across Volnation. He seems smart enough to know that, and hopefully acts accordingly.
 
However, it is possible that we don't see any real improvement over the next 2 or 3 years. I don't think that's the case with him, but it is possible. If that does happen all the attention, at least positive attention, starts going away, as does the money, and we're right back where we are.

In this case though there would be a much larger bill to pay with those huge rumored contracts. But hey, if the boosters are covering most or all of that, no problem.

That’s true. Worth the risk IMO given where we are.
 
That would be insanely stupid of Currie unless he lands a Patterson level HC.

Why? Any search involving a current coach would/should be kept under wraps out of respect for their current team. And everyone knows Tennessee fans are over-the-top on message boards...which spreads through social media and out to the local/national media. Currie does nor and will not cater to a bunch of message board clowns like us.

If it is a smokescreen, who better to use than Gruden? Not a sitting coach. Gets us message board clowns in a tizzy...just look at 2012. Seems to be working this time around as well. In the meantime, Currie can quietly conduct his search.

I find it hard to believe Currie has told all these former players it's Gruden...and none of them have said anything absolute. If...and that's a big IF, Currie was so conniving and sly, what better way to perpetuate message board furor? I know it seems a little far fetched as Currie has better things to do...but he could always have involved a small group of trusted individuals to help orchestrate the charade.

Not saying that it happened, as it likely did not, but it could have. I still have a hard time coming to grips that all these former players have been told. But there is so much misinformation out there.........
 
From OrangePill in the Gruden thread...

Enjoy... I'm not sure there is much more for me to find out at the moment. I'll let you know if I hear anything new, but at this point I believe we're just waiting for an announcement.

Buyout:
Buyout terms were agreed upon prior to the Tampa meeting.
Don't know the exact terms, but was told that it is "very open on both ends" allowing both sides an easy exit.
Gruden's agent initially wanted them to have a liquidated-damages clause of 0 and Tennessee wanted a mutual buyout. This was the eventual compromise.

Endorsements:
Since first contact a major source of contention has been Gruden's current and future endorsements.
Frankly I don't think my two sources know how this ended up turning out and they acted like it may still be an issue.
As best as I understand it, Gruden does not want Tennessee meddling in his endorsements, while Tennessee is adamant that he will need to drop endorsements.
I got the feeling money wasn't the issue, but it was more of an issue of principle with Gruden.

Additional contract info I picked up:
Gruden has an out-clause on his ESPN contract. No buyout.
Was told a contract length of 4 years by one person, other did not know.
3 leased vehicles.
"Around 25" season tickets.
Bonus of 1m.
Not as heavily incentivized as rumors have said. Base salary is pretty close to total salary.
Around 9m with around 1.5m in bonuses.
I wasn't given exact numbers on the salary so I would take that number with a grain of salt.

Staff:
Most of the staff-related issues I referenced two days ago I found out centered around Tee Martin.
Gruden has placed a great deal of importance on Tee due to his recruiting prowess.
Gruden has made it clear that he does not want to be on the road recruiting every single free night, and he feels (whether right or wrong), that having Tee on staff will take a lot of that pressure off of him.
When Tee was contacted 2 weeks ago it appeared as if there would be little to no resistance on either side if Gruden was hired. Things became complicated late last week when Tee was contacted by Georgia Southern. Another source I talked to said he's also been contacted by UTEP, but I'm not as confident in that source.
Tee is currently in limbo and no one I talked to knows who a potential replacement would be.

Timing:
Gruden has no interest in coaching this year.
He will not coach vs. Vanderbilt regardless of when an announcement is made.
If we somehow win the next 2 games he would coach in the bowl.
Due to that he prefers an official announcement on 11/28, with controlled leaks beginning on 11/26.
As of 2 days ago the AD had pushed for an announcement on 11/21 with controlled leaks beginning on 11/20.
Not sure what they've agreed on to be honest.

Source Confidence that deal is done:
I was able to talk to 2 of my 3 sources face-to-face yesterday and they both say that the deal is done.
Last time I talked to my main source they seemed confident as well.
I have no reason to doubt them.
 
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Why? Any search involving a current coach would/should be kept under wraps out of respect for their current team. And everyone knows Tennessee fans are over-the-top on message boards...which spreads through social media and out to the local/national media. Currie does nor and will not cater to a bunch of message board clowns like us.

If it is a smokescreen, who better to use than Gruden? Not a sitting coach. Gets us message board clowns in a tizzy...just look at 2012. Seems to be working this time around as well. In the meantime, Currie can quietly conduct his search.

I find it hard to believe Currie has told all these former players it's Gruden...and none of them have said anything absolute. If...and that's a big IF, Currie was so conniving and sly, what better way to perpetuate message board furor? I know it seems a little far fetched as Currie has better things to do...but he could always have involved a small group of trusted individuals to help orchestrate the charade.

Not saying that it happened, as it likely did not, but it could have. I still have a hard time coming to grips that all these former players have been told. But there is so much misinformation out there.........

PR 101. It would be the definition of over promising and under delivering. Not a good look.
 
Goodness. If that number is true then we are going to have a press box with about 20 analysts in it like Bama has.

Takes a coach with supreme confidence to do this and not feel threatened. A la Saban. Butch could never have high level analysts around his program because he is too insecure.
 
Don't like ESPN laughing at Vols, if that is what is happening. Isn't that network in trouble? Bite the hands that feed you?

Also, the choices for us are insulting.. As someone said, just keep Hoke as Interim and we'll try again next year.
 
LWS is not a believer...

Not trying to say it's happening, because I've been in the believe it when I see it camp since buying in so hard in 2012. But here's some reasons why those things LWS says don't make sense actually do make sense...

1. I can't take credit for this, but someone brought it up yesterday and it makes sense. They wait until after the regular season game so our coaches and players can focus on the last two games and trying to make a bowl. Hiring Gruden would be a media explosion and a huge distraction, especially for coaches from our school and even other schools constantly being asked if they're going to be retained by Gruden, if they've talked to Gruden, etc. The impact of hiring Gruden won't be any greater if it's announced tomorrow than if it were announced next Sunday. It 100% makes sense to wait, even if it has actually been done for a while.

2. A $10 million move to hire Gruden is too massive to hide. This would require massive coordination between virtually all UT's boosters, and as we all learned in 2012, them boosters like to talk. Also, if he's already been vetting assistant candidates and asking around about working in the college game, there's no way to keep all those coaches and agency employees quiet. It would be like trying to hide the elephant in the room by throwing a bedsheet over it. There is no way Currie and Gruden would be able to work mano a mano on a deal like this. It 100% makes sense that there would be info leaks.

*What 100% doesn't make sense is that the UT administration hasn't come out to squash these rumors if there were no truth to them. You do not use Gruden as a smokescreen and build up fan expectations to the point where wheeling out anyone less than Gruden could result in a riot.
 
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I am preparing for this. Just as I thought Butch would finish the season. Hopefully I am pleasantly suprised again.

To me that’s the debate this cycle. National media thinks we are toast as a program and that we should accept mediocrity. Fans who know what we have know differently. But what is the perception of the coaches we are targeting? Can they see UT the way we see it? Time will tell.

I hate the media narrative though. So much ignorance. Tell me one inherent advantage Clemson has over us, yet look what they’ve done
 
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I think LWS is a little similar to me. There’s a lot of prominent media folks (Albright? Staples? Dodd?) screaming in your face that Gruden isn’t coming. Plus if the rumors are true, we are paying him all that money and giving him everything he wants and he still hasn’t accepted yet, seems logical at this point to think he’s not coming.

But we will see. The rumors aren’t dying.

I don't think anyone knows anything, prominent or not. All these guys are guessing imo. He may not come here but none of these guys know anything. Also, who's to say he hasn't accepted? Just because it hasn't been announced doesn't mean he hasn't accepted. Larry used the "If he has accepted, there's no reason not to name him" line of thinking. There's a bunch of possible reasons not to name him yet. I'm excited to see how this plays out.
 
Which guy is more annoying?

1. “He ain’t coming”
2. “How many college games has he won”
3. “He was just above 500 in nfl with players that weren’t his”
4. “He’s never recruited”

Edit: for the record I am talking about in your daily life when you bring up the coaching search in conversation with people. Not on this board. I don’t think we have many people on here that fall into 3 or 4.

All of the above. I argued with my boss about it Thursday. I told him any question he had about Gruden I had an answer for it. Come at me..... lol
 
Or bring dan brooks back. He lives in seveirville

I'm good with that. He's one of only 2 UT coaches I can truly say I've met. Handshakes and 30-second chats don't count. He came to my school one day for a recruit we wanted badly. When he got there he asked for me by name because he knew, from the Mike Barry, the 2nd coach, that I knew the kid personally. Pretty cool. The only thing I've ever been an insider on.
 
Let's let the fanbase think Gruden is still in play so they'll be bummed when I announce someone else?

If he's not the guy, they need as much distance between figuring that out and naming the next guy as possible IMO JMO.

I’m just thinking it would probably help a sitting coach’s confidence that nothing will get out incolving him and TN if all the attention is on gruden.
 
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