Clinton counting on "unfortunate accident" for Obama?

#126
#126
VolzRChamps said:
Care to show me where I ever said they are only in certain states? The states I listed were states that voted overwhelmingly for the white candidate or that I know have racist populations due to personal expierence.

EVERY state has racists. Stupidity is everywhere.
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Why is it, lets say 90% or more of black are going to vote for Obama, but that's not racist.? It works both ways..
 
#128
#128
VolzRChamps said:
I don't believe that it does, but since you won't give it up and since you said that you think people ONLY vote issues, I was responding to that. WHICH IS WHY I QUOTED YOUR POST.

BTW, you don't REALLY believe that garbage do you?

Surely you are smart enough to know their are racists out there that simply don't care about anything other than skin color when it comes to who they vote for.
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I donamt think people only vote issues. I think people will vote race. How does any of that make her comments any less racially charged?

I 100% believe that the overridinf political issue for her is race. Barack, probably less so, but it's likely unavoidable given who he is.

But you'v made it sound as if I'm the one calling everyone else racists. I've only called Michelle and Wright racists. People voting for Obama are by and large just socialists. Race is immaterial to them. Those voting against don't care that he's black near as much as those closest to Obama would like to think. They don't like slick talking empty suits with a bunch of hackneyed change language as a platfom.
 
#129
#129
volinbham said:
Not really - it is my opinion of Hannity's approach. I'm sure I could dig up examples but if you don't perceive him that way it is a waste of both of our time.
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I share the same opinion and agree with the last point 100%.
 
#130
#130
BigPapaVol said:
then why don't you help me, first, understand the comment, second, whyshe made it at that time, and what else she could have meant by it.
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Check. Check. And check.

Read my post for explanation of all three requests.

If you get racism out of this -- "for the first time in my adult life, I am proud of my country because it feels like hope is finally making a comeback." -- then it's really not worth us discussing anymore.
 
#131
#131
volinbham said:
I think Air America is more extreme than Fox News. There may be opinion commentators on Fox (Hannity for example) that are as nutso as Air America personalities but Fox also has mildly slanted news coverage just as MSNBC, CNN, NYT, etc. have.
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Air America doesn't do as good of a job hiding their propaganda. Fox is a giant propaganda machine that conceals theirs in a very effective way, at least to a good portion of the population who bought into their attack on the "liberal media."

The documentary "Outfoxed" certainly has some bitter ex-Fox employees, but it plainly lays out the case for what Fox is really all about. Also, any news source whose president is the former media consultant to Nixon, Reagan, G.H.W. Bush and Giuliani will have a hard time convincing moderates that it isn't biased.
 
#132
#132
volinbham said:
There's plenty of partisanship crap spewing from all the news purveyors unfortunately.
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Good find, and agree there's spewing from many news sources, but these two are very different IMO.

One's referring to a "Death cage match" where the winner takes all -- and honestly, not calling for such a match, but I think Olbermann's point is that we're not sure if Hillary is ever going to admit defeat. The other comment clearly was referring to an assassination, and clearly saying that it would be a good idea. That ain't funny or helpful one bit.

And the Osama-Obama thing is beyond ridiculous, especially from a "pundit" at this stage of the campaign. It's blatant propaganda, and it feeds into a large portion of the population's most naive fears.
 
#133
#133
TennNC said:
Air America doesn't do as good of a job hiding their propaganda. Fox is a giant propaganda machine that conceals theirs in a very effective way, at least to a good portion of the population who bought into their attack on the "liberal media."

The documentary "Outfoxed" certainly has some bitter ex-Fox employees, but it plainly lays out the case for what Fox is really all about. Also, any news source whose president is the former media consultant to Nixon, Reagan, G.H.W. Bush and Giuliani will have a hard time convincing moderates that it isn't biased.
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But Outfoxed is a blatantly biased presentation - why use that as evidence of bias.

I don't claim Fox is unbiased but their news reporting is in the same boat as NBC's or CNN's or the NYT's. Much of what is on Fox is opinion-based programming and I'm not referring to that.
 
#134
#134
volinbham said:
I refer to Hannity as a nutso in the partisan sense. He is a bomb thrower. His arguments are sensationalized and hyperbolic much like the Air America crew.

A guy like William F. Buckley, Jr. was an unabashed conservative but relatively sane commentator.
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Some other sane conservative voices in the news business, to deflect any cries of favoritism:

George Will, David Brooks, Bill Kristol, Ross Douthat, Reihan Salam, Ramesh Ponnuru, Rich Lowry.
 
#135
#135
TennNC said:
Good find, and agree there's spewing from many news sources, but these two are very different IMO.

One's referring to a "Death cage match" where the winner takes all -- and honestly, not calling for such a match, but I think Olbermann's point is that we're not sure if Hillary is ever going to admit defeat. The other comment clearly was referring to an assassination, and clearly saying that it would be a good idea. That ain't funny or helpful one bit.

And the Osama-Obama thing is beyond ridiculous, especially from a "pundit" at this stage of the campaign. It's blatant propaganda, and it feeds into a large portion of the population's most naive fears.
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The Olbermann comment was about party officials "taking her into the room" not a fight between Obama and Clinton. This is why he apologized.

Probably not on the same level but it was taken by many that someone needed to beat the crap out of Hillary to make her get the message.

As for the Osama-Obama - who knows if it was a mistake or not. Certainly others (including Ted Kennedy) have made the same mistake.

As for the assassination commentary - no excuse for that. Clearly she wasn't serious but not a matter to be joked about in any way.
 
#136
#136
TennNC said:
Check. Check. And check.

Read my post for explanation of all three requests.

If you get racism out of this -- "for the first time in my adult life, I am proud of my country because it feels like hope is finally making a comeback." -- then it's really not worth us discussing anymore.
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you haven't explained jack. you certainly haven't explained why she would have had no hope for the entirety of her adult life or couldn't be proud of America before.

Odd question, but what changed from the day before? Why the new found hope? The new reason for hope is the problem.
 
#137
#137
The only reason she's proud is because it's her hisband, if he wasn't running does that mean she would have nothingn to be proud of (pertaining to our country)?
 
#138
#138
volinbham said:
But Outfoxed is a blatantly biased presentation - why use that as evidence of bias.

I don't claim Fox is unbiased but their news reporting is in the same boat as NBC's or CNN's or the NYT's. Much of what is on Fox is opinion-based programming and I'm not referring to that.
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I can't agree to that, but I also don't watch their "news reporting" on a regular basis, so I defer to your judgment on that. I do agree that much (most, it seems) is opinion-based programming.
 
#139
#139
There's a reason Fox is doing so well, nothing is perfect but most of their shows try to give you the angle form both sides. Watching the network news is as painful as a root canal.
 
#140
#140
BigPapaVol said:
you haven't explained jack. you certainly haven't explained why she would have had no hope for the entirety of her adult life or couldn't be proud of America before.

Odd question, but what changed from the day before? Why the new found hope? The new reason for hope is the problem.
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You can go back to page 5 of this thread if you want to read my interpretation. Otherwise, we probably should heed the wisdom of H.I. McDonough and let this issue drop: "There's right, and there's right, and never the 'twain shall meet."
 
#141
#141
VolzRChamps said:
So, "This is the first time I'm proud to be an American" = racisim and no one here thinks that's a streatch?


Also, the comment was made in refference to her husband, the love of her life, running for and actually winning a bid for President of the United States. I not only understand the comment, but I understand the context that she intended it. It had to be, and continues to be a very proud moment for her. So much so that I can understand her saying that. Rivals will ofcourse take that and try to turn it into a comment that she was never proud to be an American before, but that's foolishness and a huge streatch to try to find something wrong with someone, just for the sake of trying to find something.
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Words have meaning, and further more the way words are used further stress the meaning intended. An educated woman such as she is would understand this. Why she would use those words and in that context is beyond me, unless the words simply mean she wasn't proud of her country before her husband was a serious candidate for POTUS.
 
#142
#142
Instead of starting a new thread, I thought I'd talk about this here... seems when someone asked her if she was aworried someone would try to kill Obama if he was PUSA, she said that since he's a black man, he can get killed just going to the gas station. Thought that was appropiate to put here.
 
#143
#143
volsforever27 said:
Instead of starting a new thread, I thought I'd talk about this here... seems when someone asked her if she was aworried someone would try to kill Obama if he was PUSA, she said that since he's a black man, he can get killed just going to the gas station. Thought that was appropiate to put here.
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you should clarify that it was Michelle Obama who said that and not Hillary.
 
#145
#145
First do you have a link to a video of her saying it, or even a respectable source saying she said it?

Second, what about it isn't true?
 
#146
#146
VolzRChamps said:
First do you have a link to a video of her saying it, or even a respectable source saying she said it?

Second, what about it isn't true?
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My problem with it would be that ANY person could be killed just going to the gas station. Color should be no factor here.
 
#148
#148
VolzRChamps said:
But Color IS a factor in this country.

Ignoring it isn't going to make it go away.
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The Obama's color certainly hasn't hindered their aspirations. They seem to be doing just fine. Let me ask you this question..... What about Obama's color or race makes it a factor in this campaign?
 
#149
#149
VolzRChamps said:
First do you have a link to a video of her saying it, or even a respectable source saying she said it?

Second, what about it isn't true?
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MICHELLE OBAMA: I don't lose sleep over it, because the realities are that, you know, as a black man, you know, Barack can get shot going to the gas station, you know. So, you know, you can't -- you know, you can't make decisions based on fear and the possibility of what might happen. We just weren't raised that way.
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It was on 60 Minutes so I'm sure a clip exists. I saw a youtube link on google but can't look at it from work so let me know if it's not the right one.

YouTube - Barack Obama's wife plays race card on '60 Minutes'

Is it also true that I could say I have the same likelihood of being shot in my city since I'm a white man? It may be half-true but what's the point in saying it?
 
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