Ukraine II: The Fight Against Russian Aggression

#3,677
#3,677
Pacer92 said:
Just wrong....we caused every one of them...

And made them all worse than what was in place to begin with...
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I won't really argue with the second point, but the first is laughable. You and Ras seriously act like nothing can happen in the world if it isn't the US's doing. you ignore any and every bit of context that doesn't start with the US.
 
#3,680
#3,680
Lavrov admits Russia is a combatant in Eastern Ukraine, despite years of saying otherwise.
 

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#3,681
#3,681
no, those Ukrainian miners were just finding top of the line Russian equipment. nothing to see here
 
#3,683
#3,683
This documentary is amazing (not in a good way), even by RT standards.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZMB_TxyuNM[/youtube]
 
#3,685
#3,685
Velo Vol said:
This documentary is amazing (not in a good way), even by RT standards.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZMB_TxyuNM[/youtube]
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that Trump wants to be our "Great Leader" himself, don't you? Trump has almost EVERY quality of a dictator. Throws red meat at his redneck base almost every day. Tries to intimidate the intimidate the media--which plays a vital role in democracies. You don't think Trump would love drive every media company out of business but right-wing organizations that coddle him. Trump's narcissism is off the charts: He'd LOVE to have monuments of himself--loudmouth moron--in cities around America. You realize that he took money from his own "charitable" foundation and commissioned a huge portrait of himself for Mar-a-Lago? He had fake Time magazine covers of himself done up and they hang in several of his golf clubs. Notice how all that Trump does is go around spouting BS about all the "greatness" that is coming from his incompetent administration. He's not interested in being president and leading the country--he just wants to promote himself 24/7.
 
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#3,687
#3,687
Velo Vol said:
Remember at the beginning how they said they were using abandoned equipment?
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And they were...

They were using Soviet era tech seized from local national guards and military bases...that's why they were getting beat for the first several months of the war...

Then....the little green men and weapons arrived..:thumbsup:
 
#3,688
#3,688
Pacer92 said:
And they were...

They were using Soviet era tech seized from local national guards and military bases...that's why they were getting beat for the first several months of the war...

Then....the little green men and weapons arrived..:thumbsup:
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So did you just agree that without Russian regulars and equipment intervening in the war Ukrainian forces more than would have reclaimed its sovereign territory?
 
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#3,689
#3,689
Burhead said:
So did you just agree that without Russian regulars and equipment intervening in the war Ukrainian forces more than would have reclaimed its sovereign territory?
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I admitted yrs ago that Russia supplied men and arms...

The thing is, that none of Ukrainian sovereignty would had been at risk if not for the Western/US regime-change program, orchestrating yet another coup of a democratically elected official...

When you can agree to this....we can meet in the middle...
 
#3,690
#3,690
Pacer92 said:
The thing is, that none of Ukrainian sovereignty would had been at risk if not for the Western/US regime-change program, orchestrating yet another coup of a democratically elected official...
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If a country can't do as it wishes, trading with whom it wishes, then it really isn't sovereign, is it?
 
#3,691
#3,691
Velo Vol said:
If a country can't do as it wishes, trading with whom it wishes, then it really isn't sovereign, is it?
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Exactly. Which is why it amazes me that Ukraine doesn't have any sovereignty if they've forced a dully elected Yanukovich twice in 10 years and had the voice of the people overturned by Color Revolutions...
 
#3,692
#3,692
NATO has stopped playing word games and has come out and named Russia as a threat to its Baltic alliance members.[twitter]https://twitter.com/NATO/status/882240128105795585[/twitter]
 
#3,693
#3,693
carlos86 said:
NATO has stopped playing word games and has come out and named Russia as a threat to its Baltic alliance members.[twitter]https://twitter.com/NATO/status/882240128105795585[/twitter]
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I can't remember where I saw it but there was a poll conducted among the Russian people that had 60% of Russians viewing former Soviet territories as "Russian" and giving them the right to intervene in those countries. So we'll be dealing with Russian threats to Georgia, Ukraine, the Baltic's, and other former Soviet republics for awhile until the Russian people get tired and throw out the Putin regime.
 
#3,694
#3,694
carlos86 said:
NATO has stopped playing word games and has come out and named Russia as a threat to its Baltic alliance members.[twitter]https://twitter.com/NATO/status/882240128105795585[/twitter]
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That was at one time the Warsaw Pact's Western Flank. It was understood after the collapse of the Soviet Union that NATO would not expand into Warsaw Pact regions and vice versa. But look who is violating that unwritten agreement?

Anyone with common sense would know that these moves are provocative.
 
#3,695
#3,695
Rasputin_Vol said:
That was at one time the Warsaw Pact's Western Flank. It was understood after the collapse of the Soviet Union that NATO would not expand into Warsaw Pact regions and vice versa. But look who is violating that unwritten agreement?

Anyone with common sense would know that these moves are provocative.
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The Warsaw Pact died in 1991. The presence of 4,000 NATO troops is not provocative. 100,000 Russian troops and calling the Baltics and Poland their territory however is.
 
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#3,696
#3,696
Rasputin_Vol said:
That was at one time the Warsaw Pact's Western Flank. It was understood after the collapse of the Soviet Union that NATO would not expand into Warsaw Pact regions and vice versa. But look who is violating that unwritten agreement?

Anyone with common sense would know that these moves are provocative.
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Was that "agreement" written in stone, if not who cares? Remember the winners write the history books.
 
#3,698
#3,698
Burhead said:
Was that "agreement" written in stone, if not who cares?
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No, it was not written in stone, but it was a clear understanding by both sides at the time.

Lets not act as though there was a reason why the two regions need to not have encroachment from the other. This is clearly a way for the US/NATO to put troops on Russia's border and then suddenly act perplexed when Russia gets agitated.
 
#3,700
#3,700
The Russian war against Ukraine by the numbers

  • A massive Russian invasion and occupation force. There are more than 60,000 Russian troops in Ukraine and along the Russian Ukrainian border, outfitted with modern weapons, and officered almost exclusively at the top by Russian cadres officers and generals.
  • 2700 Ukrainians Fighters Killed and More than 10,000 Wounded. Ukraine has suffered massive human losses as Russian forces have killed more than 2700 Ukrainian troops and wounded more than 10,000 in addition.
  • 50 Billion US Dollars in Property Losses. Rusnak says that preliminary assessments suggest that “in the east of Ukraine,” Russian actions have destroyed “objects of energy, transportation and social infrastructure” worth about 50 billion US dollars.
  • An Ever-Increasing Defense Burden on Ukraine. This year, the deputy minister says, Ukraine spent 64 billion hryvnia (2.46 billion US dollars) and plans to spend even more next, 74 billion hryvnia (2.85 billion US dollars).
 
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