CFN: TN Ranked 6th in SEC in 2017

#77
#77
VolunteerHillbilly said:
I don't know whether he upgraded the staff. We all hope he did but if he was capable of upgrading his staff why in the hell didn't he do it before now? I guess I'm supposed to believe that he was just holding back his A-team for when things got a little hairy and we needed to get serious.
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Because his chart didn't tell him to? C'mon man, I don't know. All I know is I feel like our guys are going to be much better coached than in previous seasons. And, I'm happy about that.
 
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#79
#79
99gator said:
You don't have to think you are on Alabama's level to think you are a good football team.

Basically, there isn't much separation between us and the teams we like to make fun of. Forget Alabama.

Tennessee went to OT with Appy State. Lost to SC. Lost to Vanderbilt.

Georgia was in a dog fight (pun intended) with Nicholls State. Lost to Vanderbilt. Was in a close contest with Kentucky.

Florida was in a close game with UMass, had a battle with Vanderbilt. The year before went to overtime with Florida Atlantic and was in a battle with Kentucky.

I could give other examples.

Until these teams go out and take care of business against mediocre and poor teams, it's hard to really puff you chest out and believe that you are a quality team.
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It's unnerving, but you point out Vandy's improvement the last couple of years under their new staff. Points out some of the things that seem to be giving us trouble. Vandy plays as a team, never seem to lack discipline, make changes during games that seem to work in their favor, and on and on. These seems to me to be points we should strive to attain. Staff control problems, or just staff?
 
#81
#81
Wylo said:
Middle of the pack. Right in Butch's wheelhouse...
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Yep. .588 coach in the SEC + this years roster = middle of the pack, somewhere around 6th or 7th. which means 0.0125% chance of winning the SEC :) Unless of course Gruden took over half way through the season.
 
#82
#82
My thoughts...

1-ALA
2-UGA
3-LSU
4-AUB/UF/UT (I don't think these teams are really that dissimilar)
5-A&M/ARK
6-The Rest
 
#83
#83
Doesn't matter. The only rankings that matter are at the end of the season. The only sure good team is Alabama. Everyone else has a lot to prove on the field. I for one look forward to our match ups with Florida and Georgia this year with great anticipation because I fully expect us to whip their ass. Then they can put that on a list.

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#84
#84
I have been a fan for a long time I think this year we will have the season no one expects
with our new staff and O line nega fans can say what they want I just believe this is our year.
 
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#85
#85
TNnative said:
Let me ask you this. Take any decent team in the nation. Have their starting QB, best ball carrier, best receiver, most productive DE, and best CB drafted. Unless that team is Alabama under Saban, you hear the same damn things. Indictment my ass.

You must be a lot of fun at parties...if you are planning for it to become a Jonestown reenactment.
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Let me ask you this. Why does every rational fan on this board to include most Jones supporters STILL say they don't know if he's up to the job? Most of his supporters are saying he needs more time to prove himself.

You may have questions about your talent or replacement players. You shouldn't have lingering questions about whether your HC can coach a team up or not.
 
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#86
#86
LordBolton said:
So why does nobody believe in Dormady over there, but Feliipe Franks is the new star QB and Zaire is a football god (who couldn't cut it on a 4-8 team that plays a weak schedule).
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Well Franks was a 5* and those QBs always turn into super stars, especially at UF. And Zaire destroyed LSU in the one game people watched 2 years ago so that must be the version UF is getting, not the one that looked lost on a bad ND team last year.
 
#87
#87
08Vol said:
Well Franks was a 5* and those QBs always turn into super stars, especially at UF. And Zaire destroyed LSU in the one game people watched 2 years ago so that must be the version UF is getting, not the one that looked lost on a bad ND team last year.
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conventional wisdom still believes CJM is an offensive guru, and all needs is a capable QB for the offense to take off, and it also believes that CBJ is a huge ?.

that's the difference. that and CJM has won the East both of his 1st two years w/out really having an offense to speak of, much less a QB worth a darn.

the missing PC at FL is personnel related. the missing pc at TN is coaching related....

that's what conventional wisdom says anyway.
 
#88
#88
TJ1985 said:
Come on sj. I said staff, not hc. You've made it very clear that you're not a Jones fan. That's fine.
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That's not exactly fair. I want Jones to be successful and am a "fan" of some of what he's done. But I am also skeptical due to other things he's done. I'm not anti-Jones. I'm pro-Jones because that's good for UT football. He has earned the doubts and uncertainty.

But, you can't honestly say that you know how this overhauled staff is going to work out. You can't say that Jones didn't upgrade his staff. I'm especially excited to see how much our lines and dbs will improve.
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No. But I can say that Jones called a staff that included a failed UGA recycle at DC "the best staff in America". He brought a bunch of guys with him that weren't SEC caliber coaches at their respective jobs.

I have said several times that I like who he has on his D staff now. His O staff to me is doubling down on the confidence Jones has in himself as an O coach and his system.

But.... Saban has gone through numerous versions of his staff. Saban is consistent. Richt is gone in part because no matter what changes were made to the staff... he was consistent.

From a HC performance perspective, we should know what Jones brings to the table by now... and yet we really don't or if we do it isn't good. That's not a good thing.
 
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#89
#89
chargervol said:
Maybe he hired due to past performance and waited to see the results?
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You are probably right... and he is STILL responsible for those poor evaluations.

Or maybe you're correct.
I mean Saban and Meyer fire senior staff members on occasion also. Maybe they're just terrible coaches for not making the perfect hire the first time, everytime.
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What is their records as P5 coaches compared to Jones? It appears that they fire guys in time to prevent them from harming results on the field.

But... can you name the coaches you are referring to?
 
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#90
#90
MWAVolfan said:
If schedules were switched.... OK.

UT was favored to win every game on their schedule except one. They had supposedly the best and most experienced team. A senior QB drafted by the NFL. They were supposed to walk away with the SECe. They even beat UF and UGA. They only left the state of Tennessee THREE TIMES. And two of those games were against first year head coaches. You please name me one coach in the country that wouldn't LOVE to have that set up for their season. Nobody had it easier.

I'm sure Mcelwain is jealous because he isn't a champion of life and doesn't have a five star heart. He will just go sit in the corner with his two SECe titles over Butch Jones.

Oh yeah, doesn't Florida play LSU and FSU every year? But I mean I'm sure Mcelwain would never want to have what Butch had last year. You're right. I don't know anything.
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Alabama didn't keep us out of Atlanta last year, but technically they could. FSU can't keep Florida from going to Atlanta. I'd damn near guarantee CJM would keep his schedule if he had a choice.
 
#91
#91
sjt18 said:
Let me ask you this. Why does every rational fan on this board to include most Jones supporters STILL say they don't know if he's up to the job? Most of his supporters are saying he needs more time to prove himself.

You may have questions about your talent or replacement players. You shouldn't have lingering questions about whether your HC can coach a team up or not.
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Not sure I would include "most" in terms of how you worded this.

There is no doubt that Jones is capable of re-building a team to be successful. He has done that. Are they to the level of success desired by most - no. The debate is and has always been around "how long that should take". Some, for some odd reason thought it should happen the first year and when it did not started throwing stones.

In the rebuild, this is the first year where Jones has seen several players who contributed significantly leave either via graduation or to the NFL draft. How well a program has progressed becomes clear at the point this happens. Established programs are able to sustain a certain level of success when this happens.

Those players who were on the sidelines waiting for their chance will now have to step up. Some of those were highly ranked players out of high school. They have waited patiently - this is the year they get their chance.

I wish folks would stop throwing this players who have worked hard waiting for their chance under the bus before they even have a chance. When some of these players were signed, folks celebrated.

Some of you are so caught up in finding way to bash a coach, that you don't realize that you are also with the same words saying the players on this roster are not talented. That is far from the truth.
 
#92
#92
sjt18 said:
Let me ask you this. Why does every rational fan on this board to include most Jones supporters STILL say they don't know if he's up to the job? Most of his supporters are saying he needs more time to prove himself.

You may have questions about your talent or replacement players. You shouldn't have lingering questions about whether your HC can coach a team up or not.
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The inconsistant play is what's creating the questions. If we were bad all the time he would already be gone. Since we have played well at times some think if only he could put the pieces together and figure out how to get 121 to play with passion and a sense of urgency for an entire game. Then he can be as conservative as he wants and still win all the games.

Start strong but can't finish or start slow and finish strong.

Why not start strong and finish strong?

Like I said, figure it out Butch.
 
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#93
#93
volfan102455 said:
Not sure I would include "most" in terms of how you worded this.
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Anecdotally. I can only speak from experience. Even the polls here are non-scientific and not useful.

There is no doubt that Jones is capable of re-building a team to be successful. He has done that. Are they to the level of success desired by most - no.
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Define "successful". I can understand but no agree with someone who says success is being the "best you are capable of being". I would argue that it means winning championships. To say Jones has been successful would require a different definition than either of these.

The debate is and has always been around "how long that should take". Some, for some odd reason thought it should happen the first year and when it did not started throwing stones.
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Really? Who are those people? Because of what he faced when taking over, I thought the first definition of success above should apply. By losing to Vandy, he was "unsuccessful".

In the rebuild, this is the first year where Jones has seen several players who contributed significantly leave either via graduation or to the NFL draft. How well a program has progressed becomes clear at the point this happens. Established programs are able to sustain a certain level of success when this happens.
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Successful programs do not finish third by losing to the two worst teams in the conference...

Those players who were on the sidelines waiting for their chance will now have to step up. Some of those were highly ranked players out of high school. They have waited patiently - this is the year they get their chance.
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I don't doubt those players have talent and potential. Based on performance so far, I have doubts that Jones can get it out of them.

I wish folks would stop throwing this players who have worked hard waiting for their chance under the bus before they even have a chance. When some of these players were signed, folks celebrated.
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Not sure who is throwing the players under the bus. I think there's talent on the team. I like some of the replacements a lot even without a track record of performance.

Some of you are so caught up in finding way to bash a coach, that you don't realize that you are also with the same words saying the players on this roster are not talented. That is far from the truth.
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No. That is not true of me and probably not too many others. I have said several times that the potential and talent were there to have a very good year. That was true of last year (8-4, 4-4) and the year before (8-4, 5-3). The common factor isn't teams without talent. The common factor is a coach who has failed to win with the talent he's assembled.
 
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#94
#94
Iam4utalways said:
The inconsistant play is what's creating the questions. If we were bad all the time he would already be gone. Since we have played well at times some think if only he could put the pieces together and figure out how to get 121 to play with passion and a sense of urgency for an entire game. Then he can be as conservative as he wants and still win all the games.

Start strong but can't finish or start slow and finish strong.

Why not start strong and finish strong?

Like I said, figure it out Butch.
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Good post.
 
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#96
#96
Iam4utalways said:
The inconsistant play is what's creating the questions. If we were bad all the time he would already be gone. Since we have played well at times some think if only he could put the pieces together and figure out how to get 121 to play with passion and a sense of urgency for an entire game. Then he can be as conservative as he wants and still win all the games.

Start strong but can't finish or start slow and finish strong.

Why not start strong and finish strong?

Like I said, figure it out Butch.
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The only reason I still have hope for him is that I believe he really is trying to fix things.
Right or wrong, I believe that he changes coaches, S&C trainers and practice techniques because HE truly believes these things can limit the hold back factors.
Don't know if it will work but won't accuse the guy of not trying to fix what he believes are the issues.

Time to find out.
 
#97
#97
MDVols said:
So Dormady and Kelly will keep the offense rolling for Tennessee but the defense is to soft, but at Auburn their defense is ok but Jarrett will keep them rolling?
Every year Auburn has a heisman QB that has never taken a snap for them. Lol.
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Stidham is a different cat, he's the real deal.
 
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#98
#98
chargervol said:
The only reason I still have hope for him is that I believe he really is trying to fix things.
Right or wrong, I believe that he changes coaches, S&C trainers and practice techniques because HE truly believes these things can limit the hold back factors.
Don't know if it will work but won't accuse the guy of not trying to fix what he believes are the issues.

Time to find out.
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That's my favorite part.

Finding out.

Go Vols!
 
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