Serious ? about IF Butch were fired.

#201
#201
KBVol said:
Florida was absolutely gonna win the 2000 game. The egregious call happened on 2nd down.....after UF had just walked down the field 90 yards or so for the winning score. There's little to no doubt that they would've scored on 3rd or 4th down.

Also, our 2 point wins counted/had more weight than their 2 point wins? You either win or lose. We rarely were blown out during all our losses to Florida since the mid 70s....average margin of loss was less than 10 points per game iirc, by they still "owned us".

And again, prior to the great 2001 win at Gainesville, we had lost 7 of 8 to Florida. I guess you can say we had Spurrier figured out a bit, but we were still losing to Florida.
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Eh on the 2000 game.

Agree on the rest.
 
#202
#202
UTwild82 said:
I agree coaching isn't what it used to be. I also would have thought everyone would have wanted him to succeed. Then I read "I hope he wins 12 games and a foolish Midwestern school hires him".

That's the dumbest ish (even taking some of D4H's posts into account) I think I've ever read here. If he wins 12 games with this roster and this schedule he's SEC COY. That means he's put all the pieces together and this program is hitting its stride. That is literally saying "I hope the coach that leads us to the best season since we've won a NC gets hired elsewhere". I can't fathom the level of stupidity that takes. And it got a like!

I know sunshine pumping that doesn't allow for criticism is annoying and insane in its own right. But actually hoping a coach has a great year here after building the program back up and then leaves? Are you even a Vol fan at that point?
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Hahaha, thank you for pointing out the foolishness on this board. Just for fun let's play "How will UT fans be upset with a 12 win season?"

Scenario 1: 10-2 regular season losing to UF and Bama. Beats a non power west team like Arkansas or Ole Miss for the SEC championship and an "overrated" G5 or Big12 team in the Sugar Bowl.

Scenario 2: 11-1 regular season. Only loss is to Bama. Lose SEC championship rematch. Win NY6 bowl.

Scenario 3: 11-1 regular season. Loses to undefeated UGA or UF so no SEC championship. UT wins NY6 bowl.

Scenario 4: 12-0 regular season. Lose SEC championship rematch with Bama and bowl game

Scenario 5: 11-1 regular season. Lose to GA Tech. Win SEC championship. Lose 1st playoff game.

Volnation response: "Butch should be fired for not winning a national championship with all this talent."

Scenario 6: 10-2 regular season, both SEC losses. No SEC championship. There is a huge upset when 9-3 UF beats 10-2 Bama. Playoffs pull an Ohio State and take UT with the best SEC record and wins over UF and Bama. UT beats FSU and Washington for the national championship.

Volnation response: "Butch winning with this team just shows how much talent he wasted the last 2 years. This should be our 3rd championship in a row"
 
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#203
#203
08Vol said:
Hahaha, thank you for pointing out the foolishness on this board. Just for fun let's play "How will UT fans be upset with a 12 win season?"

Scenario 1: 10-2 regular season losing to UF and Bama. Beats a non power west team like Arkansas or Ole Miss for the SEC championship and an "overrated" G5 or Big12 team in the Sugar Bowl.

Scenario 2: 11-1 regular season. Only loss is to Bama. Lose SEC championship rematch. Win NY6 bowl.

Scenario 3: 11-1 regular season. Loses to undefeated UGA or UF so no SEC championship. UT wins NY6 bowl.

Scenario 4: 12-0 regular season. Lose SEC championship rematch with Bama and bowl game

Scenario 5: 11-1 regular season. Lose to GA Tech. Win SEC championship. Lose 1st playoff game.

Volnation response: "Butch should be fired for not winning a national championship with all this talent."

Scenario 6: 10-2 regular season, both SEC losses. No SEC championship. There is a huge upset when 9-3 UF beats 10-2 Bama. Playoffs pull an Ohio State and take UT with the best SEC record and wins over UF and Bama. UT beats FSU and Washington for the national championship.

Volnation response: "Butch winning with this team just shows how much talent he wasted the last 2 years. This should be our 3rd championship in a row"
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Any of these are better than a 7/8 win season. Now, make it an eight game season and I'd be content with 7/8 wins.

Good post by the way.
 
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#204
#204
volfan102455 said:
Fedora was 8-5 last year at North Carolina. He lost to Georgia and Virginia Tech, two teams that Jones beat. Upgrade? Really?

Gundy lost to Central Michigan last year.

Patterns was 6-7 last year with a lost to Georgia. Upgrade? Really?

Jones beat Funete last year.

Mullen was 6-7 last year. He has not really set the world on fire.

I'm not sure I consider any of these upgrades. Upgrade = Meyer and Saban and they are not coming.
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In all fairness, Gundy lost to the officiating crew last year.

Mullen was 6-7 in the SECwest one season after replacing several starters and the best players. He did beat USCeast, aTm, and Ole Miss last year. We lost to 2 of those teams. He also has 2 more SECwest wins in one season then CBJ has in his entire coaching career at Tennessee.

We beat Fuentes last year but mainly due to VT going into a turnover fest. I honestly think we were out coached that day. Plus look what he did with that team of 3 star hearts!

Patterson was one of the best coaches out there but has dropped off the last few years. I'm guessing due to increased competition in recruiting.

Fedora? The jury is still out on him.
 
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#205
#205
KBVol said:
Florida was absolutely gonna win the 2000 game. The egregious call happened on 2nd down.....after UF had just walked down the field 90 yards or so for the winning score. There's little to no doubt that they would've scored on 3rd or 4th down.

Also, our 2 point wins counted/had more weight than their 2 point wins? You either win or lose. We rarely were blown out during all our losses to Florida since the mid 70s....average margin of loss was less than 10 points per game iirc, by they still "owned us".

And again, prior to the great 2001 win at Gainesville, we had lost 7 of 8 to Florida. I guess you can say we had Spurrier figured out a bit, but we were still losing to Florida.
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This...regarding the '00 UF game. UF could've kicked a FG to send it to OT.
 
#206
#206
08Vol said:
Hahaha, thank you for pointing out the foolishness on this board. Just for fun let's play "How will UT fans be upset with a 12 win season?"

Scenario 1: 10-2 regular season losing to UF and Bama. Beats a non power west team like Arkansas or Ole Miss for the SEC championship and an "overrated" G5 or Big12 team in the Sugar Bowl.

Scenario 2: 11-1 regular season. Only loss is to Bama. Lose SEC championship rematch. Win NY6 bowl.

Scenario 3: 11-1 regular season. Loses to undefeated UGA or UF so no SEC championship. UT wins NY6 bowl.

Scenario 4: 12-0 regular season. Lose SEC championship rematch with Bama and bowl game

Scenario 5: 11-1 regular season. Lose to GA Tech. Win SEC championship. Lose 1st playoff game.

Volnation response: "Butch should be fired for not winning a national championship with all this talent."

Scenario 6: 10-2 regular season, both SEC losses. No SEC championship. There is a huge upset when 9-3 UF beats 10-2 Bama. Playoffs pull an Ohio State and take UT with the best SEC record and wins over UF and Bama. UT beats FSU and Washington for the national championship.

Volnation response: "Butch winning with this team just shows how much talent he wasted the last 2 years. This should be our 3rd championship in a row"
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Kudos for the effort. It may cover a few here and there.
 
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#208
#208
BeecherVol said:
Don't disagree with what was going on with Hamilton. But the only way that gets enough backing is if Fulmer is going the wrong way.

Fulmer obliged, and Hamilton sold his vision.
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Doubt he could sell the vision without having Kiffin already in hand..
 
#209
#209
LWSVOL said:
Doubt he could sell the vision without having Kiffin already in hand..
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I understand that but short of him guaranteeing Bob Neyland returning from the grave he needed Fulmer to slip up to even start the conversation. If Fulmer was coming off an SEC title or NC appearance that conversation doesn't go very far. Unless Fulmer is looking to go out on a high note. And I don't think either of us believe he was anywhere near that even if he had accomplished either that year.
 
#210
#210
hmhawk said:
In almost every thread that a losing or even 8-5 season should get Butch fired. I was just wondering about the economics of it happening. The buy out would be huge and a new coach of the caliber wanted would cost closer to 5 million than 4. Just asking. It's the off season and I need something to read.
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5 and 7 he would hit the highway all he has to do is win 8 games and he is here as long as he likes its all about the money and 8 wins will bring in just as much as 10 wins and as bad as i hate to say this its about the money at TENNESSEE.:thud::thud:i HOPE YOU DON'T THINK ITS ABOUT THE FANS its not as long as the money is flowing in thats all its about.
 
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#211
#211
terrypedigo said:
5 and 7 he would hit the highway all he has to do is win 8 games and he is here as long as he likes its all about the money and 8 wins will bring in just as much as 10 wins and as bad as i hate to say this its about the money at TENNESSEE.:thud::thud:
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I agree with the $ being a big factor.

Don't agree that 8 wins is gonna keep it rolling in much longer.
 
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#212
#212
Boca Vol said:
As of the last 2-3 years I'd say Spurrier would do just fine. Bama has been giving up a lot of points to Clemson & Ohio St...and Ole Miss.
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Agreed! I wish other people would stop putting damn Bama on a pedestal. Other teams are beating them ffs. People want to cry about playing them and then cry when someone suggests we stop playing them every. Win the damn game. It's year five. Win the (weak AF East) or beat Bama or gtfo.
 
#213
#213
Fans need to take a good long look at where we were and how far Jones has brought us. To contemplate firing him in light of where we were after kiffin and doofus, is ridiculous. You fire him after an 8 or 9 win season in the rough and tumble SEC and best of luck getting anything but an up and comer to give the job a second look. Anyone with half a brain will look at how the SEC deck is stacked, the schedule he's going to face and know that 8 or 9 wins gets you fired? Pfftt...good luck with that. UT fans dream of a bama-esque run. Unlikely. The Manning/Martin era was the best I've seen in my lifetime and out of all that talent, we get one ring......one. And we went what....50 years between titles? Nope. If you want to routinely get 10+ win seasons, leave the SEC and go to a lesser conference where the pickings are easier. Of course, elite recruits will stop listening to the UT pitch because the best want to play against the best and that's in the SEC. So unless Saban gets an itch and suddenly decides he and his family want to live in Knoxville, I think UT fans need to appreciate where we are and what Butch has done. I'm no Butch apologist, but there is this little thing called reality. Hey, I can dream about having a Victoria Secret gal as my girlfriend, but it's just not going to happen no matter how hard I try.
 
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#216
#216
For those of you that think a 5 and 7 season this year will get Butch canned, I just don't see it. The seat would be red hot for next year (2018) but with all that has to be replaced this year 5 and 7 will not get him canned. A 3 or 4 win season would be a different story I think.
 
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#217
#217
BeecherVol said:
Eh on the 2000 game.

Agree on the rest.
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They had moved 86 yards in 12 plays, 1:54 off the clock. It was 2nd goal from the 5 when the play to Gaffney happened. Had they not counted it, they had 2 plays from 5 yards with :20 left to win it. We could do nothing to stop them the entire drive, I think there's no doubt they were gonna score again had the original td pass to Gaffney not counted.
 
#218
#218
Fatman Photos said:
For those of you that think a 5 and 8 season this year will get Butch canned, I just don't see it. The seat would be red hot for next year (2018) but with all that has to be replaced this year 5 and 8 will not get him canned. A 3 or 4 win season would be a different story I think.
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*5 and 7
 
#220
#220
KBVol said:
They had moved 86 yards in 12 plays, 1:54 off the clock. It was 2nd goal from the 5 when the play to Gaffney happened. Had they not counted it, they had 2 plays from 5 yards with :20 left to win it. We could do nothing to stop them the entire drive, I think there's no doubt they were gonna score again had the original td pass to Gaffney not counted.
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Remember the drive well. Was sitting about 100 ft away from the play when it happened.

I'm just not in the "no doubt" camp.

It's not like UT didn't have some good drives between the 20s only to come away with 3s.
 
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#221
#221
BeecherVol said:
Remember the drive well. Was sitting about 100 ft away from the play when it happened.

I'm just not in the "no doubt" camp.

It's not like UT didn't have some good drives between the 20s only to come away with 3s.
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We were unstoppable between the 20's. A Spurrier coached UF team was always willing to give up 3. It was only a matter of time.

Still, with all that, UT just needed 1 1st down to seal the win...It's a theme that's repeated itself far too many times.
 
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#222
#222
Boca Vol said:
We were unstoppable between the 20's. A Spurrier coached UF team was always willing to give up 3. It was only a matter of time.

Still, with all that, UT just needed 1 1st down to seal the win...It's a theme that's repeated itself far too many times.
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It was a weird game. Similar to the 10-9.
 
#223
#223
BeecherVol said:
Remember the drive well. Was sitting about 100 ft away from the play when it happened.

I'm just not in the "no doubt" camp.

It's not like UT didn't have some good drives between the 20s only to come away with 3s.
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But Florida, on that drive, wasn't only good beteeen the 20s. They started at their 9 and were at our 5 before you could blink your eyes twice. And quite honestly, Gaffney was wide open in the end zone on what turned out to be the game winning play....just didn't hang on to the ball long enough (imho) when our db got hand in. Both Florida and UT looked like different teams on that drive.....they looked dominant and we looked like we had given up.
 
#224
#224
KBVol said:
The "abyss" we're climbing out of wasn't of Fulmer's doing. His was a drop off, a downturn.

The "abyss" you're referring to was the result of the Dooley era after which the roster was bad/without depth, recruiting relationships were badly damaged, the mood/feelings around the program were borderline depressing and desperate, APR scores were nearly catastrophic and the 3 year run gave us a sub-.500 record.
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Ahem. Hamilton. Dooley was just one symptom of Hamilton.
 
#225
#225
KBVol said:
But Florida, on that drive, wasn't only good beteeen the 20s. They started at their 9 and were at our 5 before you could blink your eyes twice. And quite honestly, Gaffney was wide open in the end zone on what turned out to be the game winning play....just didn't hang on to the ball long enough (imho) when our db got hand in. Both Florida and UT looked like different teams on that drive.....they looked dominant and we looked like we had given up.
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I'm not saying the were not gonna score. I'm just saying that no doubt is a little strong.

We 'll just disagree there.
 
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