Azzanni Departing to NFL

#327
#327
Willie Martinez replaced, Don Mahoney's contract not renewed, Zach Azzanni leaving willingly. Three position coaches who have ALL vastly under performed based on the talent they had to work with. Better "late than never". Question remains if "late was soon enough" to save you, Butch.
 
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#328
#328
BeardedVol said:
That's just not the case he has control over both sides of the ball, he's just more hands-on with the defensive side. It is evidenced by both the number of OC hires, varying levels of experience who run the system that Saban has laid out for them.

Alabama Offensive Coordinator Hire Doesn’t Matter As Long As Nick Saban Is Still Head Coach

How Alabama morphed from a pro-style, smashmouth team to a sleeker, faster juggernaut

Nick Saban's Last Great Rebuild
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nothing in these supports your argument of "saban's offensive system"...

from the first aricle:

All of the above individuals are intriguing in their own right – some more than others. Each presents a unique philosophy that will alter the Tide’s offense from what Lane Kiffin trotted out over the past three seasons. But be very clear on one indisputable fact: as long as Saban is in charge of the program, it doesn’t matter who runs the offense.

...Over the past decade Alabama has won titles with power football, pro style formations, West Coast schemes and hybrid offenses.
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now if you want to talk about Saban as the ultimate program manager, that's a different story. but he has no "offensive system" to speak of.

the last article goes in to a decent amount of detail regarding a lot of what Saban's defenses are all about, how they've changed etc....

there's nothing like that describing his "offense".

so again, there's no debate here if you want to argue who the better program manager is.

but that doesn't mean he has his own "offensive system". he allows the OC to run it. with him running the program.
 
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#330
#330
IluvdoubleD's said:
Next person to say Dooley gets punched in the ear. Let's think hard about some
Of the best wide receiver groups in recent history and go from there.
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You like bringing up DDs but not Derek Dooley (DD). I guess we found 1 giant boob you dont love after all.
 
#333
#333
jakez4ut said:
nothing in these supports your argument of "saban's offensive system"...

from the first aricle:



now if you want to talk about Saban as the ultimate program manager, that's a different story. but he has no "offensive system" to speak of.

the last article goes in to a decent amount of detail regarding a lot of what Saban's defenses are all about, how they've changed etc....

there's nothing like that describing his "offense".

so again, there's no debate here if you want to argue who the better program manager is.

but that doesn't mean he has his own "offensive system". he allows the OC to run it. with him running the program.
Click to expand...

You don't have to take my word for it, the second article has plenty of material and direct quotes from Saban on how he saw the need to change the direction of the offense, and why he made the change.

Aware that the majority of coaches and fans were perfectly fine with the schematic direction of the game, Saban set aside his personal disdain for hurry-up spread offenses and began crafting a new team...is offense would take advantage of the same rules everyone else was...Saban explained on his radio show that joining them was the best way to beat them. "All these people who run spread, you can talk about it all you want, but it's very, very effective," Saban said in September 2015...Now Alabama routinely runs RPOs that give quarterback Jalen Hurts the option to throw the ball, hand it to a back or keep it himself...Saban laughs at the notion that he has loosened up as he has aged. "I never thought I was a conservative coach to start with," he says. The schematic alterations had nothing to do with a personality shift.They simply were the means to an end. To keep winning championships, Alabama had to change.

Any change in offensive scheme at Alabama, comes first and foremost from Saban himself, and not the OC he has running his offense.
 
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#334
#334
volfannbama said:
Thanks Coach Z...

What is taking so long to get Mr. Kippy Browns picture up on the UT website?
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Kippy Brown would be great. I'm sure his old ass is really a road recruiting dog and plugged into the kids of today. Let's find a bunch of 60+ year old coaches. Sounds good
 
#335
#335
BeardedVol said:
You don't have to take my word for it, the second article has plenty of material and direct quotes from Saban on how he saw the need to change the direction of the offense, and why he made the change.

Aware that the majority of coaches and fans were perfectly fine with the schematic direction of the game, Saban set aside his personal disdain for hurry-up spread offenses and began crafting a new team...is offense would take advantage of the same rules everyone else was...Saban explained on his radio show that joining them was the best way to beat them. "All these people who run spread, you can talk about it all you want, but it's very, very effective," Saban said in September 2015...Now Alabama routinely runs RPOs that give quarterback Jalen Hurts the option to throw the ball, hand it to a back or keep it himself...Saban laughs at the notion that he has loosened up as he has aged. "I never thought I was a conservative coach to start with," he says. The schematic alterations had nothing to do with a personality shift.They simply were the means to an end. To keep winning championships, Alabama had to change.

Any change in offensive scheme at Alabama, comes first and foremost from Saban himself, and not the OC he has running his offense.
Click to expand...

seriously? it's ok. i get it. you want to be right. :peace2:
 
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#336
#336
BeardedVol said:
You don't have to take my word for it, the second article has plenty of material and direct quotes from Saban on how he saw the need to change the direction of the offense, and why he made the change.

Aware that the majority of coaches and fans were perfectly fine with the schematic direction of the game, Saban set aside his personal disdain for hurry-up spread offenses and began crafting a new team...is offense would take advantage of the same rules everyone else was...Saban explained on his radio show that joining them was the best way to beat them. "All these people who run spread, you can talk about it all you want, but it's very, very effective," Saban said in September 2015...Now Alabama routinely runs RPOs that give quarterback Jalen Hurts the option to throw the ball, hand it to a back or keep it himself...Saban laughs at the notion that he has loosened up as he has aged. "I never thought I was a conservative coach to start with," he says. The schematic alterations had nothing to do with a personality shift.They simply were the means to an end. To keep winning championships, Alabama had to change.

Any change in offensive scheme at Alabama, comes first and foremost from Saban himself, and not the OC he has running his offense.
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it's going to be hard to argue with you if the return volly is "whatever offense they run at Bama is Nick Saban's".

:eek:lol:
 
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#340
#340
jakez4ut said:
it's going to be hard to argue with you if the return volly is "whatever offense they run at Bama is Nick Saban's".

:eek:lol:
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Right... because quoting Nick Saban on how and why he came to the decision to change his mind on the spread offense and eventually his offensive scheme, is just me "wanting to be right".

When you are unable to discredit the source, try to discredit the person citing the source; classic.
 
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#341
#341
jakez4ut said:
it's going to be hard to argue with you if the return volly is "whatever offense they run at Bama is Nick Saban's".

:eek:lol:
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It's a chicken or the egg thing.

Personally I think Saban saw which direction the game was heading and hired a more dynamic offensive guy in Kiffin. I think he wanted to, at a high level, "change" the offense. In other words Saban knew he had to change, but he was going to leave the specific details of the change to a new OC.

However, I think he let Kiffin draw up and run the specific RPO stuff and other plays that Saban hadn't run before.

If Saban simply dictated everything to Kiffin, Kiffin probably wouldn't have taken the job to begin with and he definitely wouldn't have lasted 3 years (maybe just a year, tops). The fact that Kiffin lasted as long as he did, I think, is indicative of the freedom that he had.
 
#347
#347
butchna said:
I'm a Braves fan. No one ever convinced me my team sucked for losing World Series. I'd rejoinder them with "what about the teams we beat to get there?" In any case, look as hopeless as my Bears and get back to me. :thud:
Click to expand...

Speaking of, just saw these guys and got autographs from Mike Soroka, Austin Riley, Chase Johnson-Mullins, Kolby Allard, Touki Toussaint, Max Fried, Patrick Weigel, Stephen Gaylor and Bradley Keller. Riley is a big boy and the 3rd baseman in two years, has to cut out the strikeouts tho.

Braves Prez, GM, and Manager were also there. You should have sent me a baseball and I would have got you an autograph from Riley.

Back to WR coach, my only concern with Craig is some have said does not play well with others but as long as he does his job, who cares if he holds hands with other coaches.
 
#348
#348
secking said:
Speaking of, just saw these guys and got autographs from Mike Soroka, Austin Riley, Chase Johnson-Mullins, Kolby Allard, Touki Toussaint, Max Fried, Patrick Weigel, Stephen Gaylor and Bradley Keller. Riley is a big boy and the 3rd baseman in two years, has to cut out the strikeouts tho.

Braves Prez, GM, and Manager were also there. You should have sent me a baseball and I would have got you an autograph from Riley.

Back to WR coach, my only concern with Craig is some have said does not play well with others but as long as he does his job, who cares if he holds hands with other coaches.
Click to expand...

So much young talent in that Braves system. :wub: Craig's star was bright just a couple of seasons ago. If he's as good a teacher as recruiter, I concur with making the personalities work...tbd.
 
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#350
#350
BeardedVol said:
Right... because quoting Nick Saban on how and why he came to the decision to change his mind on the spread offense and eventually his offensive scheme, is just me "wanting to be right".

When you are unable to discredit the source, try to discredit the person citing the source; classic.
Click to expand...
did we change discussion topics???

no, quoting Nick Saban on what he saw as best for his program in order to get better, good.:thumbsup:

quoting this and saying "see here's his offensive system", bad.:no:


05_never_again said:
It's a chicken or the egg thing.

Personally I think Saban saw which direction the game was heading and hired a more dynamic offensive guy in Kiffin. I think he wanted to, at a high level, "change" the offense. In other words Saban knew he had to change, but he was going to leave the specific details of the change to a new OC.

However, I think he let Kiffin draw up and run the specific RPO stuff and other plays that Saban hadn't run before.

If Saban simply dictated everything to Kiffin, Kiffin probably wouldn't have taken the job to begin with and he definitely wouldn't have lasted 3 years (maybe just a year, tops). The fact that Kiffin lasted as long as he did, I think, is indicative of the freedom that he had.
Click to expand...
its really not tho. the whole thing started with the notion that Jones was too controlling on offense. to which someone said something to the affect of "saban's not that way with the offense, jones should do that", to which i simply said, but Saban is a defensive guy, and he does excersice a great deal of control on that side of the ball, much like Jones does on offense, since he's an offensive guy. both leave discretion to other side of the ball they're not strictly attached to.


to your last point, he let Kiffin run the offense....with some "guidance":p here and there. he has the defense firmly in the palm of his hand, rightfully so.

which was the entire point i was trying to make to begin with.

Saban is defense, as Jones is to Offense. not in results, but in process, hiriging etc......the key here is being able to separate the process from the person. if you can't do that, then i guess that's why some of this has fallen on deaf ears.

bottom line, Saban doesn't have "an offense". just like jones doesn't have "a defense". i don't know how else to break that down.

everything else being discussed is about the differences in them as head coaches, and the results they garner, which are not really up for debate, with Jones or anyone else for that matter.:thumbsup:
 
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